Question on laptop

CuriousMe · Mar 1, 2007

The only thing I want a computer for is school. I really only need it to write essays and other school assignments and to surf the web. What I would like to know - At my CC we are using blackboard. On this we can download and print school assignments and view our grade. Mostly these are sent in word or excel; will I still be able to download/ print them or will I have to purchase the Microsoft software?

Hi Curlysue,

With either a Mac or a PC you'll need Microsoft Office to work in Word or Excel.

I've used blackboard as well, it's a pretty good virtual classroom tool.

Peace,

Cathie

MB37 · Mar 1, 2007

Don't pay full price for MS office either, most student bookstores offer it super cheap - I think I paid about $20 for it. Also, we have a Toshiba and an ibook at home, and the ibook hasn't been used since last summer. I usually use the desktop PC at home, and my husband hates macs and works for an internet company. My mac already spend weeks in a repair shop a year after I bought it, and I got out of the habit of using it. I'd rather use a desktop than a laptop when I'm at home, and at school I just use their computers. Laptops are too heavy for me to carry around comfortably on top of all of my books.

FAM600 · Mar 2, 2007

Okay curiousme. Your wrong on most of what you've said.

I'm an advanced computer user and i doubt most people know what i know about how to use a windows based computer, sure i don't know much about computer programming or anything technical like that but as far as using the operating system as a consumer goes, i'm strong in that field.

1 - i'll admit, macs do freeze one or twice a month. As for virus protection, everybody who has one of those things installed on their computer should know how that it makes the system slower and it makes it more annoying with all those pops up from the program. The best way to remove those is to disable the program, but then that makes the virus protection useless. Unless you know how to avoid viruses like i do you'll need virus protection. With my mac i never had to use my geeky computer knowledge. I have a windows desktop that i built and since i bought my mac that desktop has seen rare usage by me. Most of my usage is to scan and fix the thing for problems that my family brought on to it.

2 - Yep, 6 months. It took me 3 months to get familiar with it (could've took a few hours if i devoted that time to learning to use it). That comment was based on my deep and diverse experience with windows, someone who does not know much about computers won't understand this.

3 - I wasn't speaking literally, just saying that more people move from ms to mac and not the other way around.

4 - Who cares about ibm. Ibm's aren't made for regular people like us, their made for business people who travel and such. My argument is mainly about the Mac operating system vs. the windows system. IBMs suck because they use windows.

5 - just hating on microsoft;)

6 - most problems people face on their computers whether mac or windows will be software based. You call microsoft for that, right? Now in the case of a hardware problem, apple rules in supporting their customers in that field. For that plug thing, yeah it isn't a technological revolution. Not everyone achieves being as careful as they intend on being with their computer. It isn't what caught my eye when trying to decide between a ms machine or apple, as a matter of fact it didn't know it had that. There are lots of things i didn't know an apple had but when i took it home and played with it, i was overwhelmed by it and very pleased. I have zero regrets on my decision.

7 - i didn't pay much attention to the commercials until i bought one. But it is a clever ad campaign. Yes, macs are costly and thats why we often see them among people who have the money to afford one.

aviator411, RN · Mar 2, 2007

I've been switching between Mac and PC daily for many years (home & office) and the Mac is far superior for all the things I find myself wanting to do.

Anyone who thinks a laptop power cord problem doesn't exist is dreaming. I make my living doing electronics work (not limited to computers) and I have repaired MANY power cord problems. The connectors are so vulnerable on most systems that the best solution is often to install a short "pigtail" cable that dangles from computer with a connector installed on the end which can be connected to the power cord. If a connector which separates easily is used, this will prevent further damage inside the computer. It's an ugly solution but a very permanent one. Apple's solution to this problem is elegant.

I'm not a computer repair person as such, I've just done these repairs for friends and students at no cost. If you take your laptop to a computer shop with a power cord problem, they're not likely to offer you an inexpensive option, they're usually going to sell you an entire new logic board which is VERY expensive if not covered under warranty.

It is true that an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure but it is disingenuous to argue that "being careful" is the solution to power cord problems. The very nature of the portable computer brings it into environments and situations which are not well-suited to the power connectors most manufacturers use. Other things being equal I would choose the better power connector every time. Who wouldn't?

I wasn't aware that there were any aftermarket power supplies for the Macbook with a compatible connector. I too would be interested in the source.

No Apple isn't the only company making good computers, Toshiba and Sony in particular are extremely good but, as FAM points out, Apple's operating system software is what makes the real difference. Those who think that the Mac difference is only of interest to the artist community are overlooking the value of graphics power to every student or researcher. I've written papers for physiology and patho which involved scanning hundreds of medical journals on line and the Mac enabled me to quickly and easily, with 3 keystrokes, capture electron microscope images of fibrin molecules, antibody structures....without knowing much of anything about graphics or computers. I do see many students who seem to strive for mediocrity and appear uninterested in producing outstanding work. For the uninspired, the capabilities of the Mac operating system are perhaps less necessary. That's not to say that you can't produce outstanding work on the PC, only that you'll have to overcome the deterrent of figuring out how to do such things while keeping up with all your other classes.

CurleySue asked about blackboard compatibility. Either the Mac or the PC will do blackboard just fine but there is one situation you need to be aware of with the Microsoft web browser, Internet Explorer. Microsoft is deceptively tricking many people with pop-up ads or other gimmicks which look legitimate into upgrading from IE 6 to IE 7. When people upgrade to IE 7 thinking they are simply updating IE 6 they discover that IE 7 does not work with lots of data-intensive web sites such as the many travel reservation sites. When the user uninstalls IE 7 which causes the system to revert to IE 6 they find that IE 6 no longer has the ability to access Blackboard as well as a number of other institutional web sites. None of the IT departments at any of the universities I have contacted have a solution for this problem other than switching to firefox or some other non-Microsoft web browser. Apple's OS and web browser do not have this problem.

One very nice feature which Toshiba offered at one time was the elimination of the external power supply; simply a power cord between the wall outlet and the computer. I don't know if Toshiba or others still offer such a feature but it would be VERY NICE if they do. I am critical of the entire laptop industry for not eliminating the need for the external power supply long ago.

CuriousMe · Mar 2, 2007

I've been switching between Mac and PC daily for many years (home & office) and the Mac is far superior for all the things I find myself wanting to do.
Anyone who thinks a laptop power cord problem doesn't exist is dreaming. I make my living doing electronics work (not limited to computers) and I have repaired MANY power cord problems. The connectors are so vulnerable on most systems that the best solution is often to install a short "pigtail" cable that dangles from computer with a connector installed on the end which can be connected to the power cord. If a connector which separates easily is used, this will prevent further damage inside the computer. It's an ugly solution but a very permanent one. Apple's solution to this problem is elegant.
I'm not a computer repair person as such, I've just done these repairs for friends and students at no cost. If you take your laptop to a computer shop with a power cord problem, they're not likely to offer you an inexpensive option, they're usually going to sell you an entire new logic board which is VERY expensive if not covered under warranty.
It is true that an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure but it is disingenuous to argue that "being careful" is the solution to power cord problems. The very nature of the portable computer brings it into environments and situations which are not well-suited to the power connectors most manufacturers use. Other things being equal I would choose the better power connector every time. Who wouldn't? ..

Me I guess. I assure you I'm not dreaming, I'm just big on not fixing things that aren't broken. As I said earlier, after ten + years of supporting laptop users (I was a computer repair professional), as well as using a laptop myself for at least that period of time,I've never seen that problem before.....so either all my users (in three different multinational organizations) have been fortunate, or they're just smarter Really though, I've never seen that problem before.

No Apple isn't the only company making good computers, Toshiba and Sony in particular are extremely good but, as FAM points out, Apple's operating system software is what makes the real difference. Those who think that the Mac difference is only of interest to the artist community are overlooking the value of graphics power to every student or researcher. I've written papers for physiology and patho which involved scanning hundreds of medical journals on line and the Mac enabled me to quickly and easily, with 3 keystrokes, capture electron microscope images of fibrin molecules, antibody structures....without knowing much of anything about graphics or computers. I do see many students who seem to strive for mediocrity and appear uninterested in producing outstanding work. For the uninspired, the capabilities of the Mac operating system are perhaps less necessary. That's not to say that you can't produce outstanding work on the PC, only that you'll have to overcome the deterrent of figuring out how to do such things while keeping up with all your other classes...

OK, so that's a bit insulting....I assure you that I strive for excellence in my work and my GPA of 4.13 can attest to that. I'm not sure that having a computer with an Apple OS is the measure of commitment from a student.

I don't really understand why you think it's so difficult to import graphics....depending on document you're taking them from and where you're putting them (which would be the same considerations with an Apple), it can be as little as two keyboard strokes to capture graphics (illustrations or images--microscopic or otherwise). I've had no problems with adding graphics to any of my physiology projects, and didn't feel like there were any "technological challenges" to overcome. I didn't use any big "computer geek" information...just basics (I know they're basics, because I've designed and taught basic computer classes....in both Mac and PC). Truthfully, with my current laptop, I don't need any mouse clicks or keystrokes to capture images.....I can just use my pen on my tablet screen and circle what I want....which I do in my physiology notes on a regular basis....oh and there are no Apple tablet convertibles.

CurleySue asked about blackboard compatibility. Either the Mac or the PC will do blackboard just fine but there is one situation you need to be aware of with the Microsoft web browser, Internet Explorer. Microsoft is deceptively tricking many people with pop-up ads or other gimmicks which look legitimate into upgrading from IE 6 to IE 7. When people upgrade to IE 7 thinking they are simply updating IE 6 they discover that IE 7 does not work with lots of data-intensive web sites such as the many travel reservation sites. When the user uninstalls IE 7 which causes the system to revert to IE 6 they find that IE 6 no longer has the ability to access Blackboard as well as a number of other institutional web sites. None of the IT departments at any of the universities I have contacted have a solution for this problem other than switching to firefox or some other non-Microsoft web browser. Apple's OS and web browser do not have this problem.

Again, I've had no pop ups trying to "trick" me. If you've chosen to turn on automatic updates, then there will be a pop up in the bottom of your screen that will tell you when a new update is available, you have the choice to install it or not. I'm happily running on IE 6 right now, I've seen no need to upgrade.

One very nice feature which Toshiba offered at one time was the elimination of the external power supply; simply a power cord between the wall outlet and the computer. I don't know if Toshiba or others still offer such a feature but it would be VERY NICE if they do. I am critical of the entire laptop industry for not eliminating the need for the external power supply long ago.

I really don't have anything against Apple, I happily own an iPod and have already mentioned that I think they're engineering is wonderful. They're just not the "only smart option" as many users have posted. In some cases they're the right solution, absolutely....but in some cases they're the absolute wrong solution and I think to say otherwise is disingenuous. There's to much zealotry involved here.....there are no good guys and bad guys here, there are two companies who are trying to make money. They do this by designing different products that they hope people buy.

Well, I'm off to school.

Peace,

Cathie

aviator411, RN · Mar 2, 2007

Curious,

I guess we must be living in parallel universes. I wouldn't be wasting my time fixing these things if they weren't broken.

The reason I think it's so difficult to capture and import graphics with a PC is because I have had great difficulty doing it with a PC, in fact I have encountered a number of web documents where I couldn't do it at all with a PC. My son makes his living as a graphic artist and uses a Mac for this very reason.

So you design and teach basic computer classes. In that case none of my remarks apply to you. I am addressing users who do not teach computer classes and who don't want to have to take them to get their work done. By the way, I have taken quite a number of computer classes over the years and none prepared me for the difficulty I've encountered capturing graphics with a PC.

Congratulations. How does one earn a 4.13? The only school I ever attended where that was possible used a 1 - 9 grading system but they have long since changed to 1 - 4 so you can't do better than 4.0 there.

Thanks for your remarks. I do appreciate having the opportunity to learn from your experiences. There are certainly more ways than one to get the job done and for some people it will make no difference. For me the difference enormous.

CuriousMe · Mar 2, 2007

Curious,
I guess we must be living in parallel universes. I wouldn't be wasting my time fixing these things if they weren't broken.

I meant Apple...in my opinion, they fixed something that wasn't broken.

The reason I think it's so difficult to capture and import graphics with a PC is because I have had great difficulty doing it with a PC, in fact I have encountered a number of web documents where I couldn't do it at all with a PC. My son makes his living as a graphic artist and uses a Mac for this very reason.

We must be in a parallel universe, because I haven't experienced this at all. The only time I've had any difficulty is when a document is protected (usually a PDF)....in which case you should contact the author before using the image.

So you design and teach basic computer classes. In that case none of my remarks apply to you. I am addressing users who do not teach computer classes and who don't want to have to take them to get their work done. By the way, I have taken quite a number of computer classes over the years and none prepared me for the difficulty I've encountered capturing graphics with a PC.

I understood that you were referencing basic skills, my point was that I understand the scope of basic skills (most of my students started at the level of "when you move this thing, the arrow on the screen moves")

Congratulations. How does one earn a 4.13? The only school I ever attended where that was possible used a 1 - 9 grading system but they have long since changed to 1 - 4 so you can't do better than 4.0 there.

In my school A+'s are scored as a 4.1.

Thanks for your remarks. I do appreciate having the opportunity to learn from your experiences. There are certainly more ways than one to get the job done and for some people it will make no difference. For me the difference enormous.

Same here, and as I said, I'm really not opposed to Apple at all, I just get concerned when the conversation becomes almost religious in tone. Right now a Mac wouldn't work for me at all, as I said I have a tablet convertible, which really assists me with school. Apple doesn't make one of these yet.

Peace,

Cathie

curlysue82 · Mar 2, 2007

Okay, I have been looking at some Toshiba notebooks and have found that most come preinstalled with "Vista". I have heard that it not to good; what do you all think about it?

live4rachael · Mar 2, 2007

Just a shout out for HP... Had mine for 4 years now and still working great. Had a battery issue about 6 months ago and worked with their chat support folks - incredible customer support. I waited less than 5 minutes for someone to chat and we had it resolved in 15 minutes. That was my first (and only) issue I've had since I got the HP.

Funny about the PC vs Mac thing... People really do get religious about this stuff.

CuriousMe · Mar 3, 2007

Okay, I have been looking at some Toshiba notebooks and have found that most come preinstalled with "Vista". I have heard that it not to good; what do you all think about it?

"Not Good" might be a strong statement. It's just new. I try not to move to a new OS for a year or so. But with the hardware requirement differences between the two OS's, it might be worth it to at least get a dual core laptop so that even if it doesn't have Vista now, you can upgrade later. So....in my opinion, the best solution would be a dual core machine that still has XP on it.....but I don't know if you'll find that or not.

Did that make sense?

Peace,

Cathie

carolinapooh, BSN, RN · Mar 5, 2007

I've been switching between Mac and PC daily for many years (home & office) and the Mac is far superior for all the things I find myself wanting to do.
Anyone who thinks a laptop power cord problem doesn't exist is dreaming. I make my living doing electronics work (not limited to computers) and I have repaired MANY power cord problems. The connectors are so vulnerable on most systems that the best solution is often to install a short "pigtail" cable that dangles from computer with a connector installed on the end which can be connected to the power cord. If a connector which separates easily is used, this will prevent further damage inside the computer. It's an ugly solution but a very permanent one. Apple's solution to this problem is elegant.
I'm not a computer repair person as such, I've just done these repairs for friends and students at no cost. If you take your laptop to a computer shop with a power cord problem, they're not likely to offer you an inexpensive option, they're usually going to sell you an entire new logic board which is VERY expensive if not covered under warranty.
It is true that an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure but it is disingenuous to argue that "being careful" is the solution to power cord problems. The very nature of the portable computer brings it into environments and situations which are not well-suited to the power connectors most manufacturers use. Other things being equal I would choose the better power connector every time. Who wouldn't?
I wasn't aware that there were any aftermarket power supplies for the Macbook with a compatible connector. I too would be interested in the source.
No Apple isn't the only company making good computers, Toshiba and Sony in particular are extremely good but, as FAM points out, Apple's operating system software is what makes the real difference. Those who think that the Mac difference is only of interest to the artist community are overlooking the value of graphics power to every student or researcher. I've written papers for physiology and patho which involved scanning hundreds of medical journals on line and the Mac enabled me to quickly and easily, with 3 keystrokes, capture electron microscope images of fibrin molecules, antibody structures....without knowing much of anything about graphics or computers. I do see many students who seem to strive for mediocrity and appear uninterested in producing outstanding work. For the uninspired, the capabilities of the Mac operating system are perhaps less necessary. That's not to say that you can't produce outstanding work on the PC, only that you'll have to overcome the deterrent of figuring out how to do such things while keeping up with all your other classes.
CurleySue asked about blackboard compatibility. Either the Mac or the PC will do blackboard just fine but there is one situation you need to be aware of with the Microsoft web browser, Internet Explorer. Microsoft is deceptively tricking many people with pop-up ads or other gimmicks which look legitimate into upgrading from IE 6 to IE 7. When people upgrade to IE 7 thinking they are simply updating IE 6 they discover that IE 7 does not work with lots of data-intensive web sites such as the many travel reservation sites. When the user uninstalls IE 7 which causes the system to revert to IE 6 they find that IE 6 no longer has the ability to access Blackboard as well as a number of other institutional web sites. None of the IT departments at any of the universities I have contacted have a solution for this problem other than switching to firefox or some other non-Microsoft web browser. Apple's OS and web browser do not have this problem.
One very nice feature which Toshiba offered at one time was the elimination of the external power supply; simply a power cord between the wall outlet and the computer. I don't know if Toshiba or others still offer such a feature but it would be VERY NICE if they do. I am critical of the entire laptop industry for not eliminating the need for the external power supply long ago.

God help me for jumping in here, but there's some stuff here I don't get. What power cord problem? My laptop borders on 2 1/2 years old and I've got no power problems. My husband has had three laptops; the most recent one is three years old and it has no power cord problems. No one I know has ever said anything about their power cord being a problem. I doubt all of us are living in a dream world. Also - I use Mozilla, not IE (which I agree sucks) and I have no problems running any web pages for anything - including Blackboard. Duke University DID find a fix to the Blackboard/IE issue, since our IE 7 machines in our computer lab run Blackboard with no difficulties whatsoever; I just don't use IE anymore since discovering Firefox.

I booked my plane ticket for my upcoming transcontinental flight with IE7 online, and I didn't have a problem doing it. That was several weeks before a classmate converted me to Mozilla Firefox.

I don't understand the "external power supply" thing, either - all I have is either a battery, or a cord going from the computer to the wall. I have a Sony. It works great. In fact, it's plugged in right now, and I'm using it with no problems.

I too have written many many papers and have done countless PowerPoint presentations, and I've inserted multiple photos and journals and other docs. I haven't had to "overcome the deterrent of figuring out how to do such things while keeping up with all your other classes" while doing it, and I take umbrage at your suggesting that just because I don't own a Mac, I believe in substandard work. I consistently get the highest grades for presentations and papers out of the class, and I can assure you - I don't tolerate laziness, sloppiness, or poor quality in anything I hand in to anyone. My summa cum laude standing from my first BS and my current 3.5 GPA at Duke would seem to disprove the statement that I "strive for mediocrity", wouldn't you say?

I'm just confused. This conversation seems to be getting way out of hand, way too technical, and way too complex. I appreciate your Mac passion, but you're almost insulting PC users, and I don't think that's called for. It's a computer, in the end - it's not a life-altering decision, just a critical purchase. I don't think it's worth working up a sweat over, is it?

CuriousMe · Mar 5, 2007

I don't understand the "external power supply" thing, either - all I have is either a battery, or a cord going from the computer to the wall. I have a Sony. It works great. In fact, it's plugged in right now, and I'm using it with no problems.

The "problem" that Mac theoretically solved is that if you're using your laptop with the power cord laying across a walkway and someone trips over it, it could damage the laptop. So, Apple made the connection between the power cord and the laptop to be a magnetic connection that breaks away if someone were to trip on it.

As I said already, I've never had this be an actual problem. I also don't have my power cord lay across a walkway. Someone mentioned that due to the portable nature of laptops you can't always control where your power cord is....I say, sure you can. Power outlets are along walls, just make sure you're along the wall as well, then there's no problem.

Peace,

Cathie