What would you do (or have you done) if your patient asks you to pray with them? In regards to holistic nursing would you ever initiate and ask your patient if you can pray for them?
I am a first semester nursing student and this is a discussion topic right now in one of my classes. I'm curious about the diversity in responses that this might get, and also any stories that veteran nurses might have.
I see that calling the chaplain in is possibly most appropriate, but what if they are really looking to you right then and there for prayer support??
I will be sharing this thread with classmates. Thanks so much!
:nurse:As a born again Christian, I feel that nursing is my calling, and that I am to miinister to not only the physical aspect of my job, but also the spiritual side of it.
I too, have prayed at many a bedside that my patient be accepted in the loving arms of my Lord, and that the family be given strength to get thru the coming days and weeks.
I am strictly a geriatric nurse, working in LTC facilities and most of my patients that have passed, have lived a full and fruitful life with loved ones surrounding them.
Being a nurse is not only involves healing the physical self, but also ministering to the spiritual self.
I don't see a problem with praying with patients and their families if they request it and you are comfortable with it. It may bring them a great amount of comfort in their time of need.
Specializes in ICU/CCU, Home Health/Hospice, Cath Lab,.
Many people have stated the essential components of praying with patients - namely that it is what the patient or family needs that is important. If they need a hand to hold as they die, a person to bow his head and "pray" with them, or simply to be left alone for a bit, we need to accept and help facilitate their needs.
The "ethics" of such come down to what we consider wrong or right. If you believe prayer to be detrimental then it would be unethical to pray with a family. That being said you might find that your opportunities and acceptance in nursing diminishing if you hold to a rigid standard here.
It helps to not have a "black and white" mentality when dealing with people. I personally think smoking is bad for you - so giving a cigarette to someone normally would be an unethical action for me to take, however, the person dying of "whatever" who wants to go out and smoke (well the smoking is probably not going to kill them now) would not be unethical for me to help.
As for praying, well as an atheist I don't think it helps a person recover from illness. However, I know it helps families that are grieving. Since I don't think that it is detrimental and has obvious good qualities, it would not be unethical for me to "pray" with a family (even though I personally don't believe in it).
Asking to pray with a family would not be unethical (if you believed in prayer) since you are attempting to do something you consider "right". However it might be impolite, aggravating, rude, insulting, etc - depending on who you ask. The key to remember is that it is the patient's needs we are meeting, not ourselves in this instance.
Specializes in Cardiac surgery and percutaneous interve.
I have worked in a cardiac ICU/Step down for 5 years and I have been asked to pray with a lot of patients in that time frame. I am atheist and tell the patient that I am uncomfortable with that and I would be happy to find a chaplain to assist in prayer. If I walk into a room and the family is praying, I stand outside the door until they are finished.
Even if I had similar beliefs as my patient, I don't think I would ever initiate a prayer.
I'm sure this will be a bit of an uncomfortable area for me after graduation considering I'm an atheist living firmly in the "Bible Belt". Anyone out there coming from my background want to share their experience?
Hey there, I'm an athiest living in the bible belt.
In short, if a family member or pt asks me to pray with them, I will, as long as I don't have to say much. If I am expected to insert my own narrative or improvise, I will just say that I am uncomfortable with that. If they persist, I ask if I could read them a bible verse of their choice.
If they seem to just need to have their nurse pray with them once in the shift, I don't have a problem with that. If they seem to be needing more than that, then I offer to call the hospital chaplin or their spiritual leader.
Smack in the middle of the bible belt, in a red, red, red state, I have prayed with Buddhists, Muslims, Wiccans, and a variety of Christians (some pretty freaky ones, in addition to "normal ones"--I'm talking cult freaky). Each time my part in the prayer was clasping my hands and bowing my head respectfully.
I figure I don't know everything, but I know what is right and wrong, good and bad in my own heart. I think it is right to support a pt in their spiritual beliefs. Who knows, that Muslim, Christian, or Witch might be right, and if so, then it probably helps my afterlife case a little, huh? Honestly, though, since I sincerely believe we all just return to the earth after we die, what skin off my back is it to support and comfort someone within their religion? If it gets to the point that I feel like I am out of my league in terms of their spiritual needs, then I will provide them with someone who CAN help.
It's no different than any other consult, I feel. If a pt has questions about their diet, I will answer them to the best of my abilities. If they have extensive questions or need a lot of teaching, though, I'll consult a dietician. It's the same with their spiritual needs, for me.
I feel I can always tell when someone is playing me (ie, wanting to convert me to their beliefs) or if they are sincerely wanting my support. In the first case, I participate simply or bow out and get the Chaplin. In the second, I do everything I feel comfortable doing, and if *I* need more support, I get the Chaplin.
What would you do (or have you done) if your patient asks you to pray with them? In regards to holistic nursing would you ever initiate and ask your patient if you can pray for them?
I am a first semester nursing student and this is a discussion topic right now in one of my classes. I'm curious about the diversity in responses that this might get, and also any stories that veteran nurses might have.
I see that calling the chaplain in is possibly most appropriate, but what if they are really looking to you right then and there for prayer support??
I will be sharing this thread with classmates. Thanks so much!
I would decline to lead a prayer because I don't believe in it, but if asked to participate I awkwardly go along with the group to show I care.
I figure I don't know everything, but I know what is right and wrong, good and bad in my own heart. I think it is right to support a pt in their spiritual beliefs. Who knows, that Muslim, Christian, or Witch might be right, and if so, then it probably helps my afterlife case a little, huh? Honestly, though, since I sincerely believe we all just return to the earth after we die, what skin off my back is it to support and comfort someone within their religion?
That's called Pascal's Wager. I used to go by that, but anymore I have chucked religion altogether. People use the argument that no one can disprove God exists but you can't disprove the Easter Bunny or Santa either-- because you can't disprove something that doesn't exist.
I work nights and I always say, after my assessment and while turning out the light, I say a night time pray for my patients, would you like one?" I have only had 2 or 3 people say no. I keep it simple " Dear Lord please bless Mr Smith with a good night's sleep. Relieve his fears over his procedure/illness/new medicine and let him face tomorrow with a smile and strength. Amen.
I am actually surprised at the people that get emotional afterwards.
I had one little old lady who cried and thanked me - she said she hadn't been feeling loved and I reminded her that God loves her. That made my whole week.
Specializes in Nursing Ed, Ob/GYN, AD, LTC, Rehab.
Its important to remember that not everyone believes in God in the USA. If a patient ask you to pray with them and you are comfortable with that then I see no harm in that, in fact might be appropriate. If you are uncomfortable ask them if they would like the chaplin and polietly decline. I am a proud atheist and I know I would take great offense if a nurse wanted to pray with me if I were the patient. Never asume anything about anyone, as an atheist I would like religion to stay out of my care. Just saying this to point out another perspective.
I am a proud atheist and I know I would take great offense if a nurse wanted to pray with me if I were the patient.
Why is it offensive? As a person of faith (and someone not big on religion), I am not offended by your beliefs. It would be offensive if you had made it clear to the nurse that you were an atheist and then she later offered prayer. If someone merely offers to try everything within their abilities to help and comfort a patient and that happens to include a prayer, where's the harm in that? I would only see it as a problem if the nurse ignored the patient's wishes/beliefs. I'm not saying that nurses should offer prayer but rather that people may be reading too much into suggestions. Look at it as a offer of alternative therapy, similar to massage therapy or accupuncture.
Specializes in Nursing Ed, Ob/GYN, AD, LTC, Rehab.
I am a proud atheist and I know I would take great offense if a nurse wanted to pray with me if I were the patient.
Why is it offensive? As a person of faith (and someone not big on religion), I am not offended by your beliefs. It would be offensive if you had made it clear to the nurse that you were an atheist and then she later offered prayer. If someone merely offers to try everything within their abilities to help and comfort a patient and that happens to include a prayer, where's the harm in that? I would only see it as a problem if the nurse ignored the patient's wishes/beliefs. I'm not saying that nurses should offer prayer but rather that people may be reading too much into suggestions. Look at it as a offer of alternative therapy, similar to massage therapy or accupuncture.
Its offensive to assume ones religion and belief system and to initate action based on false assumptions
Its offensive to assume ones religion and belief system and to initate action based on false assumptions
It's not assuming anything by asking someone if they'd like to pray--except that there is a possiblity that they might say yes...and you can't really assume a possibilty. Someone grabbing your hand and bowing to pray would be assuming (and even I would find that offensive). If people went around with their mouths shut afraid of offending people rather than asking questions, society would regress!
If the information isn't available in the chart and the patient doesn't offer it without prompting, how else would the nurse know? If I were an atheist, I'd rather turn the nurse down once (who can now put that missing info in the chart) than have to repeatedly tell the nun offering communion every day (this is practice at the hospital closest to my house).
Ann, maybe being and atheist has led you into many a confrontation you found to be offensive, maybe not. I certaintly don't mean to offend you. And you can't help the feelings you experience. But a spirtuality assessment (just like physical or cultural assessment) is part of the nursing process. By your logic, simply asking someone if their spiritual needs are being met is an offensive question because the nurse would be assuming the patient was spiritual! There's no "agenda" behind these simple questions or offers other than to privide comfort and complete care, so where's the offense?
Calgon-take.me.away
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:nurse:As a born again Christian, I feel that nursing is my calling, and that I am to miinister to not only the physical aspect of my job, but also the spiritual side of it.
I too, have prayed at many a bedside that my patient be accepted in the loving arms of my Lord, and that the family be given strength to get thru the coming days and weeks.
I am strictly a geriatric nurse, working in LTC facilities and most of my patients that have passed, have lived a full and fruitful life with loved ones surrounding them.
Being a nurse is not only involves healing the physical self, but also ministering to the spiritual self.