Is Health Care a Right?

maureeno · Feb 7, 2003

you better believe we've got a drug problem in this country and i'm not talking about dope. checkout http://www.familiesusa.org and download their publication "profiting from pain: where prescription drug dollars go". using annual financial reports submitted to the sec they review corporate profits and spending. read and weep!

on average of the 9 companies studied the revenue [net sales] gets allocated 11% r&d, 18% profit, 27% marketing and advertising.

annual median executive income exclusive of stock options over $11,000,000. median value of unexcercised stock options $42,000,000.

drug companies receive special tax credits for research and experimentation bringing their effective tax rate down from 35% to 17%. meanwhile studies show they are providing the public with fewer and fewer new drugs having significant clinical improvement over existing therapies. most 'new' drugs are reformulations, 'knock-offs' to be aggressively marketed. name-brand drug companies employ 81% more people in marketing than in research. between 1995 and 2000 marketing staffs increased by 59% while research staff decreased by 2%.

big pharma practices profits over people...big time.

fiestynurse · Feb 8, 2003

I have been working for many years fighting for Universal Health Care in this country. I hope to see it become a reality in my life time. I am currently working with an organization called Health Care for All - California. We sponsored SB480, which mandated a study of various health care options. The single payer system came out on top for improving quality, saving millions, and providing health care to everyone.

Senator Kuehl is introducing a single payer health care bill this year. An RN, Judy Spelman, is assisting her in it's drafting.

Check it out on the HCA Website:

http://www.healthcareforall.org/

fiestynurse · Feb 8, 2003

Think about this: The incarcerated, who have the fewest rights, are the only US citizens with a constitutional right to health care through the 8th amendment.

An excellent book on this topic: http://www.trhs.org/bobsbook/

Physicians for a National Health Program:

http://www.pnhp.org/

Q. · Feb 8, 2003

Stargazer,

Clearly I can see the point in the excerpt of the book, and I totally agree with and support mutually beneficial "trades" or exchanges.

Interestingly though, when I read through the old thread I started almost a year ago, "Universal Health Care?" I had described how despite efforts to increase preventative care and other less costly health services to avoid the costly ones later (such as NICU stays), people will indeed do as they wish to do. As a matter of fact, I just recently read an article in JOGNN that detailed how African-Americans don't percieve prenatal care as important, and also don't relate the connection between lack of it and poor birth outcomes. So basically, what happens if we decide to pay for prenatal care for everyone, but not everyone utilizes it? Who pays for the NICU visit then? And then how is this a mutually beneficial exhange for me?

Don't get me wrong: I am all for preventative health care and feel that nurses are the key to solve some of the health care problems, particularly in that area. I've read study after study that details how education and prevention, in theory will decrease tertiary cost, but that only works when patients actually utilize them. We can't force people to utilize them and clearly, they don't.

What then?

Also, what about the option to opt out? We all know of people who refuse some preventative measures; immunizations for one. I myself, despite not ever having nor being immune to varicella have refused the vaccine. If I didn't have health insurance, or, if I were covered under a universal plan, and I didn't want the vaccine, and and I got pretty sick with varicella, who would pay for that visit? And more so to the point, doesn't that in fact take away my autonomy in health care decisions (ie: make this decision or else you won't be covered later?) Is that even ethical?

fiestynurse · Feb 8, 2003

Another good book:

"A Perfect Storm: the Confluence of Forces Affecting Health Care Coverage" by Joel E. Miller, National Coalition on Health Care

Excerpt: "The confluence of powerful economic forces, fueled by the terrorist attacks of September 11, have unleashed a 'perfect storm' that could increase dramatically the number of uninsured people in the U.S.-- with as many as 6 million people in total losing their coverage in 2001 and 2002."

Stargazer · Feb 8, 2003

Susy, as to your first point, I think it just underscores the point that priority has to be given to education as well as actual health care. A parallel that immediately sprang to mind for me is that my company's CEO places a high value on medical care, but interprets this to mean buying new equipment. In concrete terms, this has meant that he is willing to buy AEDs, but does not understand and will not fund the necessary training for personnel to actually operate the AEDs. It's an ongoing struggle to educate him on and convince him of the relationship between the two.

I just recently read an article in JOGNN that detailed how African-Americans don't percieve prenatal care as important, and also don't relate the connection between lack of it and poor birth outcomes.

I think this is always something that we face in health care, and it ties in a bit with your second point too. To use another parallel from my own career, we offer free flu vaccinations to all employees and aim for as close to 100% compliance as we can manage. There are always a number of people who are, as a group, prima donnas and drama queens who refuse the shot. About a month ago a large group of them got very sick indeed and many of them missed work. Their colleagues who HAD gotten the vaccine stayed healthy. All of a sudden they understood the correlation and were willing to be vaccinated. It's a matter of finding the right way to educate them on the sequelae. Yes, there are often cultural or economic biases or barriers, but they're not insurmountable.

As to your 2nd point, people certainly should be able to opt out, but all actions have consequences. As someone pointed out in another thread, insurance companies are now starting to refuse payment when clients have documented noncompliance with recommended medical treatment. I don't see this as unethical at all. Your choice, your risk. A simple release documenting a patient's understanding of the possible results (medical and financial) of refusing treatment and their signature noting that they are assuming that risk & responsibility voluntarily would go a long way towards covering that issue.

Sally_ICURN · Feb 8, 2003

Originally posted by fiestynurse

Check it out on the HCA Website:

http://www.healthcareforall.org/

Feistynurse, having read your posts on the thread Susy reincarnated, "Universal Healthcare Coverage?" I would like to thank you for your efforts and I have recently come across the website you link to here in my search for information about single payer healthcare coverage in the US.

I will take the time to seriously look at that website and consider involvement and a donation/membership. Many states are proposing single payer plans. If it's going to happen I think California will be the place that starts the ball rolling.

~Sally

Q. · Feb 8, 2003

To use another parallel from my own career, we offer free flu vaccinations to all employees and aim for as close to 100% compliance as we can manage. There are always a number of people who are, as a group, prima donnas and drama queens who refuse the shot.

Hey! I also refuse the flu shot.

Q. · Feb 8, 2003

Psstt.... Sally.

I didn't reincarnate that thread. It was posted in April of 2002.

Fiesty brought it back to the forefront probably from a search and realized..."hey, this WAS a great discussion."

Stargazer · Feb 8, 2003

Originally posted by Susy K
Hey! I also refuse the flu shot.

Then don't come crying to me when you get sick, MISSY!

Sally_ICURN · Feb 9, 2003

Originally posted by Susy K
Psstt.... Sally.

I didn't reincarnate that thread.

Oh! sorry.

an side, I was in a hurry when I typed that post and I meant resurrect.

Anyway......

Q. · Feb 9, 2003

Originally posted by Stargazer
Then don't come crying to me when you get sick, MISSY!

*cough, cough, sniffle, sniffle*

Seriously, I have to laugh when my friends get the latest and greatest flu shot, get a trifle ill from it, and then get a full-blown flu when they get the one strain that wasn't in the predicted vaccine...

Ah, another thread.