dealing with rude doctors? - page 4
new grad. started working about 8 months ago. slowly getting to know doctors. two times ive had to contact a doctor. i work night shift. both times i called and it wasnt past 10 pm. first time,... Read More
Sep 4, '16Joined: May '16; Posts: 402; Likes: 1,241Unfortunately i have to contact docs a lot. The thing is they get paid the big bucks to answer our calls/pages. They KNOW they are on call. Don't ever feel bad or scared to contact a doctor about a patient. And dont let these incidents discourage you from contacting them about a patient, if ever in doubt i always call them.
Sep 4, '16Joined: May '16; Posts: 402; Likes: 1,241Quote from RicRockWe have a lot of foreign doctors that are horrible to understand to begin with...add in waking them up at 3 am i cant understand a word. I always have to have them repeat the order 2-3 times and then i repeat because i have no idea what theyre saying lolHad a doctor who would always be an ass on the phone.
Eventually, when he became hateful, I would say, "For patient safety, I want to make sure I understood you, could your repeat what you just said?"
The first call, was pretty rough, then he started understanding and was at least tolerable on the phone.
Sep 4, '16Joined: Sep '12; Posts: 299; Likes: 914Quote from 2016NewJust know that if something happens to the patient and you didn't call- it would be your license- so always call and document.Regardless of whether or not it was my way of speaking to the doctor... the way he was demeaning to me was unacceptable. And it hasnt just been me he has done this too.
The point of this post was how to deal with these certain doctors. Do you just deal with it, brush off the way they treat you? Or do something about it?
Yes, ill accept advice on how to speak with doctors more efficiently seeing how i am a new nurse and dont claim to be doing things perfectly or knowing everything.
So thanks for any input you have.
As far as the way they treat you on the phone- it could be their aggressive way of trying to dissuade you from calling. But if something went to court or before the board- they would not back you up.
HR I have found to be worthless- an RN is listed in the same category as other hospital supplies and services- i.e. a liability on the budget. An MD is considered the person who brings the money in- and no this isn't right.
Try different things- tell the MD that you have to do this to protect your license- or like others have said call him out on it and let him know its unacceptable...
The other option, though not as satisfying as getting him to stop this hostile workplace behavior which has been shown to impact patient outcomes negatively, is to let him has his tantrum and keep moving forward.
If you do go to HR make sure they document the problem, make sure it is taken as a formal complaint. I had a situation where I had more than one meeting with HR and a particular person. When it came time for me to quit that position I asked HR about the documentation of repeated hostile remarks- their response was they thought it was informal mediation to help, and they didn't have documentation of the meetings/complaints.
Sep 7, '16Joined: Jun '16; Posts: 3; Likes: 1Make sure you are in an environment where you are being supported. I have had similar phone interactions and it always bothers you to some degree; however, I had one doctor that was extremely rude and it was very uncalled for. When I told my charge nurse, she informed the house coordinator who then wrote up the doctor. A snide comment here and there is expected on night shift, but when an MD basically asks you to act outside your scope of practice (i.e. make up orders for him, not clarify orders with him, etc.) you HAVE to call and get the order. There is no reason for harassing nurses and making us feel incompetent, and when they do, you have the right to go up your chain of command.
Sep 7, '16Joined: Sep '16; Posts: 3; Likes: 32016 New... the way you presented the situation was very concise and clear to me... I did not perceive it as a "giant block of rambling text"... just as you being very frustrate by the rudeness.
I want to thank you for bringing it up and also thank everyone for the input.
Sep 7, '16Joined: Aug '16; Posts: 1; Likes: 2Ahhh yes managing physician populations, always a difficult task. My suggestion would be of course to use SBAR formats in calling and then if he remains rude, which is not uncommon in our field remember the basics. First he brings money to the hospital and a nurse costs a hospital money. The amount that this will raise it's ugly head depends on your administration and the amount of money you are talking about, sorry it is what it is. Second, leave documentation in a form of an incident form everytime from every nurse, you could save someone their job. If in fact the doc is rude every time and the nurse gets in trouble her sisters have her back by the many times the physician has done it before, it's pretty hard to fire someone with this kind of paper trail. And third remember docs are human too and many are just terrible communicators NEVER take it personal there is no longevity in it. There are aides you can use if they scream in the unit. Years ago we had a group of docs that screamed a lot and our CNO told us every time a doc yells all nurses were to stop and clap as in give the man an applause for his childish behavior. I have to say it just stopped after about a month of it.
Not sure what aid might work in your unit, but I do know it requires support from administration, RN unity and the ability to be kind to the person after he has corrected his behavior.
Sep 7, '16Joined: Jun '16; Posts: 15; Likes: 22The places I have worked are FINALLY cracking down on physicians that act this way. They are written up, spoken to by the head of their group and lose money. It seems to be working. I haven't seen a chart thrown across the nurses' station in a long time.
Sep 7, '16Joined: Jan '16; Posts: 4; Likes: 1I've been dealing with this situation, calling Doctors at night, mostly on call doctors are rude... esp change of condition..relaying labs...
Sep 8, '16Joined: Dec '13; Posts: 131; Likes: 257Quote from Sour LemonExactly what is it that she did not make clear? I thought she was to the point without giving too much information.Your way of communicating in writing makes me wonder how well you communicate on the phone. Is it possible you could rehearse your calls beforehand with someone on else on the unit? That was truly difficult and irritating to read.
I agree that she should just shrug it off. Everyone knows that this particular Dr. is the way he is. Just chart to CYA. He really isn't your supervisor and I doubt that he would want to take up his precious time to complain about being called. When I have a Dr. that starts in on me like that, I just say, "Dr. ...... you may speak to whoever you wish, but can we just now focus on what I called you for? If you don't have any new orders or are concerned about the change in the patient's condition, I will need to chart that." That usually snaps them out of the personal attack. They may still be rude, but at least you will have an answer without all of the other nonsense. It helps to have the charge nurse within earshot. I guess I am no longer sensitive to this as I have watched Dr.s have tantrums at the nurses station. I remember one in particular that was red faced and yelling about being called in the middle of the night, his patient flew out of her room and yelled back at him, "Dr. ..... I had the nurse call you last night so stop this sh*t, you look like a jackass and a fool." She was an 83 year old that was 5 foot tall and all of 90 lbs.
Sep 8, '16Joined: Dec '13; Posts: 131; Likes: 257Quote from Sour LemonI work with more foreign-born nurses than not. I have never noticed any of them writing in big blocks with no capital letters and no spacing. 99% of them are effective communicators despite English being their second (or third? or fourth?) language. The words may get mixed up now and then, but they're concise.
I've also worked with a few American nurses who can't get to the point and frustrate everyone they dare to speak to. A little coaching can help that group and improve their workplace relationships.
What do you do with patient's that "can't get to the point," Are you this inpatient with them as well? I have learned many lessons about communication that you obviously have not. People who have problems waiting for "the point," often miss other markers for concern. Someone comes in with a complaint and it is not always what it seems. You are too focused on "the point."
Sep 8, '16Occupation: RN Specialty: 3 year(s) of experience ; Joined: Feb '16; Posts: 97; Likes: 108At least your doc responded. We have one that picks and chooses IF he will even call back. Not fun if your ortho doc decides he's
not going to call back on your little 80 yo lady with a hip fracture in horrible pain. Glad off of nights now and my manager has his cell phone and doesn't hesitate to text him. It's frustrating.
Sep 8, '16Joined: Sep '12; Posts: 62; Likes: 92I work days and have never had a doctor be rude about calling them but have heard some night nurses that have been yelled at, hung up on, etc. They were told to write an incident report. I don't know if those really help with the problem but it might make you feel better
Sep 9, '16Joined: Nov '13; Posts: 134; Likes: 44For the record! I did rewrite my post. I wrote the post SourLemon commented on the morning after speaking with the doctor so i was still worked up about it. Hence the rambling. I edited it to what it is now.
Thank you all for your input! I greatly appreciate it and will keep it in mind!