NNAS experience?

dishes, BSN, RN · Jul 6, 2016

@valiumeal The provincial college of nurses voted to have an external organization assess IENs education because they are not in the business of assessing foreign education, they are in the business of protecting the public.

bobacia · Aug 11, 2016

I am wondering if anyone on this thread has made any headway taking a direction with their 'non-comparable' rating from the NNAS. You still can apply to your provincial board right? Has anyone done that? What have the outcomes been?

RN_Pro · Aug 14, 2016

You can, but you will have to do a variety of other things, such as the OSCE (in Ontario at least).

I had a non-comparable result and applied to the College of Nurses of Ontario. They sent a letter which did not exemplify therapeutic communication at all: it said, You do not meet the requirements to become a Registered Nurse in Ontario or something like that. No intro, no nothing. You are then directed to register for the OSCE. The test is $400 and the company called Touchstone which is contracted to administer it refuses to give a ballpark date of when the next test dates might be released. When the dates are released, those wishing to register must rush on a first come first served basis to get a spot in the next exam sitting, or risk waiting another 8 months or so to try to get into another one. The OSCE can only be done once, and the pass rate is rumored to be about 25%. If you fail, you have to go to school. The BScN bridge program is 20 months straight, costs $12,000 and there are only 50 spots per year.

Where did you receive your nursing education bobacia?

bobacia · Aug 14, 2016

I got my ASN/BSN in Iowa.

Did you take the OSCE? Do you know people who have taken it and passed? Or failed?

I don't mind to take it as I feel that I have been well prepared. That being said, I have heard a few disconcerting things being said about the practical skills test being implemented in the other provinces, so I am concerned. How reliable is the 25% pass rate rumour--I wonder if there is data to back this up.

dishes, BSN, RN · Aug 14, 2016

How reliable is the 25% pass rate rumour--I wonder if there is data to back this up.

I originally saw the low pass rate mentioned in an article entitled 'Immigrant nurses face new hurdles with Ontario's licensing changes' Toronto star 11/11/ 2014

There has been more transparency about the OSCE from CNO and Touchstone Institute since 2015 and I think the OSCE pass rates are now higher. However, the problem is there are long delays in booking the OSCE due to lack of assessment dates. Some IENs cannot work in nursing while they wait for their assessments and end up running out of time for proof of recent work experience and have to return to school for a bridging program. It's better for IENs to stay and work in their country of training, until after they have received their OSCE results from CNO.

RN_Pro · Aug 15, 2016

Hi bobacia,

I haven't done the OSCE yet. I have been instructed to by the licensing board but there are no spaces left in the February test date and no word at all on when they will release the new test dates. Since they won't disclose the number of people that can do it on one test date... I have no idea how anybody gets a spot at the test. I feel well prepared too though. I'm more than happy with my US education. But it does frustrate me that I have to do this exam-- pay $400, go through the stress of it, knowing that if you fail just because your so stressed out about it (I'm confident of my nursing knowledge), you have to go back to school for a full nursing degree minus one semester. Waiting for a test date and being able to sign up in time before it fills severely delays our application time. I believe that Touchstone took on the contract but does not have the capacity to meet the demands. OSCE puts us through a lot of testing on knowledge that Canadian nurses don't even have to get tested on before they get their degree. If our American educations were both "non-comparable", I wonder whose is ever seen as comparable? Does anybody know anybody? I'm assuming you have already passed NCLEX which is the licensing exam for which all of these things (OSCE, etc) are supposed to be preparing us for?

I'm not sure how reliable the 25% is anymore but I did see that in 2015 there were only one quarter of the IENs writing NCLEX in Ontario that there were writing the CRNE in 2011. Between 2014 and 2015 actually the number was cut in half. So it looks like many aren't getting through. I imagine the few that did in 2015 were already well into the process before NNAS came into play and maybe that's why they made it through to be eligible to write NCLEX.

bobacia · Aug 15, 2016

Hi,

Yes--I did pass the NCLEX.

So are you currently working in the USA to keep your license current? How long have you been at this process of getting your license recognized in Canada.

I am trying to find out the following information:

-how long are the wait times at Touchstone?

-what is the pass rate?

-what is the pass rate broken down by country

How transparent is Touchstone?

RN_Pro · Aug 16, 2016

Hi bobacia,

It's been almost a year now.

I am wondering the exact same things as you, but Touchstone refuses to answer any of those questions. The last test date that we know of is Feb 2017 and they will not give an estimate of when the next exam date will be released. I don't find them to be very transparent at all. And since they are a private company, there is nothing that requires them to be, unfortunately. If you are able to find out any of the answers to these questions, please do post them, and I will do the same.

bobacia · Aug 16, 2016

So did you try to register for the Feb slot and it was already full? How much of a heads-up are you given to register? Is it on a first come-first serve basis, or ??

I did find out a few things today. I called the CNO just to make sure I was clear on the enter into Canada process. I expressed concern about pass rates and wait times.

The person I spoke to said that the pass rates have grown with participants taking an information session about the skills test. This person was not aware of any wait times with Touchstone and did mention how parts of the system could look next year with the addition of funding/more seats in colleges/universities to help with bridging.

I am concerned about the transparency of Touchstone. I have been trying to call there/left messages/etc. I have yet to speak to an actual person. It's frustrating and concerning.

dishes, BSN, RN · Aug 16, 2016

Some questions can be answered through the healthforce Ontario information sessions but, I don't think the results of the OSCE have been made public at this point. You can get an idea of the number of candidates that have been tested, the frequency of the tests, if you are interested. There is a presentation entitled The Internationally Educated Nurses Assessment Program (IENCAP) that was presented at the Partners in Education & Integration for Internationally Educated Nurses conference in 2014. The presenters were CEHPEA (the former name of Touchstone Institute), it is available on pie-ien ca.

The presentation mentioned that 136 candidates require 270 staff, I wondered why they broke it down that way, are there are 136 candidates at each OSCE? I had speculated that there were 48 candidates at each OSCE because there are 12 stations and 13 minutes at each, but now I have no idea.

RN_Pro · Aug 16, 2016

Yes when notified by CNO that I need to register for it, it was already full. I called Touchstone just to ask about whether there are any tips on how to ensure a spot next time...there aren't. I found them to be very unfriendly. Hostile in fact, when I asked about how many spots there are at each sitting vs how many are recommended to Touchstone for the OSCE. There is no warning when test dates are to be released.

I suppose we need to continue to let CNO know about the wait times at Touchstone. Since they selected Touchstone to do the exam, they need to know if Touchstone isn't meeting CNO's/CNO's applicants' needs.

It is good that there will potentially be more seats in the bridging programs but as someone educated in the United States I dont feel it is fair for me to have to quit my job, move to Toronto, and take an entire degree program for a degree that I have already earned and written the entrance to practice exam for, fair and square. I shouldn't just be given an Ontario license without any checks or balances, but I think it is fair to say that Canadian and American nursing educations are more similar than, let's say, Canadian and Indian or Saudi. It's just the truth. I wouldn't want to take the seat of someone who wants to move to Canada and become a nurse here.

Hmmmm dishes,

I wonder since NNAS came into play how the numbers of those referred to do the OSCE have changed? I really hope there are more than 136 candidates able to take the OSCE at each exam time, because at this rate, they might as well stop accepting applicants to NNAS because by the time they get to OSCE the que will be so long they will never have a chance to get through. I'll post if I get any more info from Touchstone :)

dishes, BSN, RN · Aug 16, 2016

@CDN_US_educated_RN the number of candidates Touchstone Institute has assessed each year has increased, see the annual report 2014-2015 found on Touchstone's website, it shows the number of candidates assessed for IENCAP (OSCE) was 83 in 2012/13, 960 in 2013/14, 1002 in 2014/15. Touchstone moved to new larger facilities this past summer, the office moved in July so maybe the staff are still settling in. I expect they will be able to assess more candidates because the new location has 78 exam rooms. Touchstone isn't just assessing IENs alone, they are also assessing IMGs, international optometrists and dietitians and the CELBAN, they seem to add on more assessments for the various international educated health care professions as they grow and expand.