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Negotiating my salary is exhausting!

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I echo the above comments. Is the weight loss job still on the table? Is the weight loss job strict hourly and no benefits? I'm assuming you would like the IM position for broader experience but that offer sounds low. I need to know so, so, sooo much more.

Yes, I am working at the wt loss clinic now but only on the weekends (total of 12 hrs per week). It is strictly $60 per hour without benefits. You are correct, i want to work at the IM clinic to get that first year of experience that every doctor in CA seems to require for all NPs. Yes, the offer is low! I have done my research and i can't accept such an offer that is lower than Southern CA average.

How many patients are you seeing? If this is a very low volume job that may be a reasonable offer. However if the manager is expecting you to churn out 25 to 30+ patients a day run for the hills and take that weightloss job. Also ask the same for the weight loss job.

For an NP, the average is to see between 18 to 20 patients per day at the IM clinic. At the weight loss clinic, i see about 40 patients but most are refill visits. I basically review poss medication side effects with the pt and i decide if i will stay with the same dose or titrate down/up. Really easy if you have been doing it for a while.

Realistically at the IM job, how many hours a week will you have to work?. The main drawback to Salary positions is it's basically giving the manager "free work" after 40 hours a week. Say that you work an average of 45 hours a week and you get your 80K salary. That will average about $34.19/hour. That's $25/hour or so less than the weight loss job. On the other hand, what if this salaried job only required you being there 30 hours a week. That's $52.28/hour.

Full time NP has to work Monday to Friday from 9 to 5pm. I am sure that i will be working from 8 to 6pm. She also said something about taking calls from the hospital in the future but she said that she will not make me take that responsibility right now.

Other things I would need to consider: Does the weight loss job come with benefits? $60/hour sounds great but is that full time or just 12 hours during the week? Just wage wise not including other benefits and assuming equal interest the weight loss job sounds much better.). =)

I wish i could work full time at the wt loss clinic but they only have a per diem position. Thanks you for your response, swimstudent! ]

Be brave and walk away! Don't put up with that kind of treatment. California is a large state that isn't the only job.

I know that too! But i have been looking for a job in IM or family practice settings in the last 3 months and this was only the second one to offer me a job (after 20 applications). I am worried that I won't be finding a job soon enough to get that experience.

Did you get an official offer letter with the pay rate? She can't just decide to change your offer on day 2.

Unfortunately, the offer letter was not signed by her yet when i received it. The letter was sent to me by the office manager. The manager said she will tell the doctor to sign it. Then i got a call from the doctor saying that we will talk about my pay the next day, in person.

I really want to talk about my pay in person so i came back. Then we got busy with all the patients so i followed her all day until she had the time to talk to me in private. I understand she shouldn't change what was talked about but unfortunately, the offer was only made verbally. I am still waiting for her call (as she promised, she will call me back for her final offer) but I know that i can't go back on Monday without knowing my definite salary... In writing.

If she floated the balloon of messing with ur pay after ur already on board and sees you're ok with it and still showing up for work there then you've just set a financially unfavorable precedent for yourself. Its analogous to letting the shark sense ur blood in the water...she will keep nipping at you, probably indefinitely, quite frankly. Also, as a previous poster already point out, it's good practice to get your pay in writing before u even show up for 1st day. Going forward, with regards for ur next job, don't even put in ur 2 week notice on ur current job without having the pay for your next job put in writing. To not have something so important locked in is doing yourself, and whoever is counting on your finances (an older u with retirement funding needs, wife, kids, elderly parents, etc.) a disservice.

Yes, agreed! To get by with our finances, i have to keep my RN job or stick to $88k per year (but that means we won't be having many vacations planned this year). :(

You actually started work without negotiated compensation? Without an offer letter that stated compensation? No wonder they think they can screw you over! You gave the impression that working for them is your number one concern and everything else is secondary. Quit now and consider that a lesson learned.

Yup, i know that now. But the whole situation is very confusing from the very beginning. This is the first time i am negotiating contracts or pay. As an RN before, i was really spoiled. I get the offer letter right away without questions, complaints, or issues. Everything is laid out for me and signed right away. I really thought this is the standard for every employer. Lol, but yes, lesson learned! Everything has to be in writing (signed by both parties) from now on.

I will disagree with some posters. I hear you mention experience being wanted to get a better job. Get the best offer you can get immediately and then start job hunting.

Yes, you are also right. Sounds like i am going to sacrifice my pay though :(

If she offers me at least $86k with benefits (and possible renegotiation after 3 months), i will take it. But if not, i will probably walk away. Unfortunately, i'm very anxious about the risk of not finding the next job.

Keep the job and find something better. They deserve a brief commitment from you. I would not want to work there longer than I have to.

My job changed me from hourly to pay per visit on day one. A year later I found out my PPV rate was the same as the LPN visit rate. They compensated me (somewhat) and decreased my hourly non productive time rate. They nickel and dime the employees constantly. The mileage rate changes every month. Our workplace is 10% patient focused, 90% bottom line.

This is the writing on the wall.

I understand where you are coming from. But since I am paid well as an RN for 8-9 years, it is very hard for me to accept this kind of low offer. Yes, i know i am new but i at least deserve an average starting NP salary.

I have this whole day to think about all of this. I wish i could arrive at my best decision. I am also waiting for her final offer via phone today.

sadiemae1123

Has 16 years experience.

If you do decide to stay with the promise, in writing, to renegotiate in a few months, then you should be able to review how much revenue you are generating for the clinic. It may not be much in the first few months of training, but if you're doing a lot of procedures and seeing that many patients, then that clinic should eventually be making a lot of money from your work. You deserve to be compensated for that.

TakeTwoAspirin, MSN, RN, APRN

Specializes in Peri-op/Sub-Acute ANP.

They are absolutely correct, NPs are different from RNs. As an NP they will be making money off of you, as an RN you are an expense. Don't forget this!

If you do decide to stay with the promise, in writing, to renegotiate in a few months, then you should be able to review how much revenue you are generating for the clinic. It may not be much in the first few months of training, but if you're doing a lot of procedures and seeing that many patients, then that clinic should eventually be making a lot of money from your work. You deserve to be compensated for that.

Yes, great option! So glad I came to AN for advice. Instead of having only one option (to walk away), i have written 4 options for her to choose from. I already know that she won't accept my counteroffer of 88k as it is. So i have to be ready for more options that i'd be willing to accept at least for 6 months.

Thank you, everyone! So glad i can count on fellow NPs and nurses all over the nation ;-) The nurses and NPs (and hubby) are giving me advice that i already know, lol.

They are absolutely correct, NPs are different from RNs. As an NP they will be making money off of you, as an RN you are an expense. Don't forget this!

YES, no kidding!!! This made me laugh a little bit.

Thank you!

Once you are salary they can definitely take advantage of you on the hours worked,

Once you are salary they can definitely take advantage of you on the hours worked,

Yes, agreed!

Unfortunately, the offer letter was not signed by her yet when i received it. The letter was sent to me by the office manager. The manager said she will tell the doctor to sign it. Then i got a call from the doctor saying that we will talk about my pay the next day, in person.

I really want to talk about my pay in person so i came back. Then we got busy with all the patients so i followed her all day until she had the time to talk to me in private. I understand she shouldn't change what was talked about but unfortunately, the offer was only made verbally. I am still waiting for her call (as she promised, she will call me back for her final offer) but I know that i can't go back on Monday without knowing my definite salary... In writing.

Yikes! the offer letter was not signed? that's a big no no for me. I think two parties have to agree to the deal and I wouldn't accepted the offer unless it was signed. I think they are really taking advantaged of the situation. I mean understand its business but she still shouldn't have changed what was talked about. So perhaps, you can't do certain skills yet but that doesn't mean you can't treat and diagnose patients that don't need procedures. Perhaps what you could do is come up with a contract to re-evaluate/re-negotiate your salary every quarterly for the first year and then every 6 months after that. I realize that they do have to invest time in training you and at the same time as a new grad you also have need to gain confidence in your training. I think that perhaps after 3-6 months you will be able to handle your own patient flow. Besides, I don't think its unreasonable for you to come up with that type of re-negotiation of salary agreement with them if their excuse for paying you that low is that you are a new grad and basically have no skills. Just be sure to keep up how many patients you have seen and their acuity and as well as the procedures you have done that way when it comes to re-negotiation you have proof that you have improved from where you were.

sailornurse

Specializes in ER/Tele, Med-Surg, Faculty, Urgent Care. Has 39 years experience.

Keep the weight loss clinic job. Consider finding another or more part time job. Definitely we all learn how to negotiate as we go. If you can make more as RN, then consider doing that, prn to pay the bills while you continue to look. I agree that if you are salaried, you can be taken advantage of unless your contract (did you mention a contract?) specifies number of hours, if you are on call etc. Contract should also specify how many days for CME and how much employer will pay for attending conferences, vacation/sick leave etc.

You bring a lot to the table, don't forget this. While you are a new grad, you bring current clinical guidelines, enthusiasm and willingness to learn new skills. I currently have 5 part time jobs. I did not plan this, it just evolved. I have been doing this for past 1.5 years. When one job is no longer fitting my needs, I have been fortunate to find another. I work 2 days per week for an allergy/immunology doc, pt doing urgent care/after hours walk ins at another clinic, 1-2 Sundays/month at another urgent care, 3-7 shifts doing health assessments and recently started one weekend per month at psych hospital doing H&Ps on new admits & urgent consults. 2 jobs I am 1099 independent contractor and the rest I'm employee. No benefits but feel I am in control of my time. The previous 2 jobs I had I felt like a slave, working 9-10 hours daily, on call/weekend visits. If you can get ahold of a copy of Carolyn Buppert's NP Business Practice & legal guide is a great resource for all NPs.

I agree with all the posters that have responded to you

All I can say is WOW! I'm in the wrong field. :banghead:

I agree that it's wrong of them to try and flip on you and I'd decline after that experience.

I'm thinking she meant she can't offer you more as a new grad because although you have nursing experience, you're new to NP practice?

I have no idea if that logic is reasonable or not since I don't have any experience, but that's probably how they're justifying themselves.

But if you're offered more elsewhere there's no need to allow this place to be cheap with you. And they're allowed to just switch your pay status around like that?

synaptic

Has 5 years experience.

im in ky and the travel nurses (rns) here get paid more than that.

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