Mandated Flu vaccine?

wooh, BSN, RN · Sep 17, 2011

If you are allergic to the shot you should be permitted to opt out.

We don't even get that. We have to go to an allergist (on our own dime, "dime" meaning specialist copay) to get half the vaccination, and if it doesn't kill us then we get the other half, and if that doesn't kill us, we get to do it all over again next year. And the year after that and the year after that. All the while forgetting all we've been taught about repeated exposure to allergens. And all we've been taught about anoxic brain injury (because isn't a doctor's office exactly where you want to lose your airway? With the only people around to save you being a doc that hasn't seen a code cart since his residency and some MAs that might have taken a CPR class?)

I think what makes this different is it's every year having to take the risk. Every ten years for tetorifice. Three times for HepB. Once for chicken pox. It's an entirely different risk to benefit ratio than a yearly vaccine. Especially if you're allergic and your workplace wants to brag about 100% compliance.

I've already destroyed my back being a nurse. Not sure how much more of my health I want to risk. But in this economy...

SuesquatchRN, BSN, RN · Sep 17, 2011

I am just waiting for a nurse to take one of these mandatory vaccines, die from complications and sit back and wait for the lawsuit, and THEN watch administration cover their tracks and backpedal on these mandatory requirements. .

What complications? Please cite a reliable example.

wooh, BSN, RN · Sep 17, 2011

Every 'patient' has the right to choose their caregiver and the right to refuse treatment.

THIS is what really gets me. If a patient told me they were allergic, and I gave them the vaccine anyway, and they had a reaction, they'd have a legitimate malpractice claim against me. Is my workplace ready for the lawsuit that WILL happen if/when I have a reaction to the vaccine they forced me to get?

glasgow3 · Sep 17, 2011

What complications? Please cite a reliable example.

I could give you a recent extremely serious complication from one such vaccine, however, I can't because of the remote risk of a potential confidentiality breach. But trust me, things beyond just feeling like crap for a few days most certainly CAN happen.

nurse955 · Sep 17, 2011

I work for a big hospital system and all direct care staff are required to take the flu vaccine. If you refuse, one must wear the blue face mask while on duty(entire 8 or 12hr shift). It is immediate termination for anyone caught without the face mask

SuesquatchRN, BSN, RN · Sep 17, 2011

THIS is what really gets me. If a patient told me they were allergic, and I gave them the vaccine anyway, and they had a reaction, they'd have a legitimate malpractice claim against me. Is my workplace ready for the lawsuit that WILL happen if/when I have a reaction to the vaccine they forced me to get?

That's utterly indecent of them. Documentation should be produced once and kept on file.

SuesquatchRN, BSN, RN · Sep 17, 2011

I could give you a recent extremely serious complication from one such vaccine, however, I can't because of the remote risk of a potential confidentiality breach. But trust me, things beyond just feeling like crap for a few days most certainly CAN happen.

Specifically flu. And to someone who did not have an allergy to eggs.

RFRN · Sep 17, 2011

For an employee to opt out for reasons other than allergy or pregnancy they had to have a note from their doc. An employee could not merely say "I don't want it." According to one employee, she went to her doctor for an 'excuse' note. The doctor though that she should have the vaccine and would not write her a note. She continued to refuse the shot and was terminated.

Working in an OBGYN clinic, I cannot see why an employee would opt out for pregnancy and I do not see any of the docs writing notes for this unless they have a true allergy. We strongly encourage all of our pregnant patient to get the flu vaccine. We even hold our first delivery of vaccine for ONLY pregnant patient so if we have a GYN patient come for their annual and want a flu shot, we have to tell them we don't have enough supply yet for the general population, only high risk.

onedayitllbeme · Sep 17, 2011

"or a nurse to take one of these mandatory vaccines, die from complications and sit back and wait for the lawsuit, and THEN watch administration cover their tracks and backpedal on these mandatory requirements." that isn't going to happen, but great that you are waiting for it.

http://www.familiesfightingflu.org/

Rodoon, BSN, MSN, RN · Sep 17, 2011

SueSquatchRN,

I don't know what you mean by reliable example but this happened to me. As a student nurse, I was asked to give flu shots in the college adm building to students, but first thing we gave each other the Swine Flu shot--the one that made people sick (76-77) I think. By late afternoon I felt weak. Driving home through a park, its curvy, I couldn't move my legs to apply the brake and ran up over the curb in an attempt to stop. A jogger assisted me (pre cell phone and 911 wasn't well established). This leg weakness came and went acutely for a month and luckily didn't progress to GB, but it took me another 3 months to return to jogging. I almost couldn't finish my classes and back then you had to wait a year to reenter a nursing program. My instructors felt guilty for acting like a little old flu shot wouldn't hurt anyone and they gave me consideration. One student got Guillan-Barre and many others complained about similiar symptoms to mine. I lived with the guilt of making others sick too. My GP couldn't explain my symptoms and wouldn't relate it to the flu shot until it was in the news.

I never took another until my department wanted 100% compliance 23 years later. I let a feeble stupid excuse for a recognition plaque make me sick. This shot had h1n1 in it too. I experienced leg weakness again. A neurologist (I worked for him) suspected MS by neuro exam, but when I told him about the first flu shot and this one, he held off a spinal tap for a few weeks. Like before I got better.

I'm glad I'm retired now because I wouldn't want to be mandated to go through that scare again. If I'd been a beside nurse, I couldn't have worked at the beside while symptomatic. Yes, there will be lawsuits if people that know they're sensitive can't refuse. Based on what happened to me do you think it would be proof enough? There are plenty of people who experience symptoms but nothing gets related to a vaccine until the news oks it.

SuesquatchRN, BSN, RN · Sep 17, 2011

Rodoon, that's not enough. The problems of the 76-77 vaccine are well-documented. And given that you had problems the first time you got one you would have been well within your rights to refuse another.

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/Activities/emergency/swine_flu.html

Bill E. Rubin · Sep 17, 2011

I don't agree. I feel this is America I have the right to refuse. The "big" hospitals in Boston are threatening termination and suspension for no-compliance. There isn't a precedent for this and I suppose some are going to lose their jobs and sue before it's settled. I worry about these arbitrary decisions. Every decision that leaves no choice and threatens you with your job is being bullied by the one in power and is abusive. Like every other form of abuse it's all about those in power and the abuse of their power over others with lesser power.
It's a slippery slope to arbitrary unfair treatment of all......

Actually, my big Boston hospital doesn't require it, but strongly encourages it and does require opt-outers to wear a mask after the first case of flu hits the hospital. I think it's a reasonable request to protect the patients (and staff from each other). As someone mentioned earlier, we are required to be immunized against MMR, hepatitis, etc. I happily get my free flu shot every year.