Male Nurses/female Patients

[ern91]

I'm interested in knowing if anyone has the issue of male nurses refusing to perform certain nursing functions simply because they are male. Having worked in a large teaching hospital and smaller community hospitals, there seems to be a huge difference. In the teaching hospital, male nurses did everything a patient needed, regardless of gender. In the smaller community hospitals, the male nurses sought out female nurses to take care of all manner of female patient's hygiene, all gyn exams ,and anything else a female patient needed. Have we become such a litigous society that we base our practice on gender? Do you find yourself taking care of your male colleagues patients as well as your own simply because they are afraid to touch their female patients?

[donsterRN, ASN, BSN]

There's nothing gratifying about being on the receiving end of Foley insertion.

Amen to THAT!!!

[Bill E. Rubin]

Hmmm.... Jumping in late to this thread, I find all of this discussion to be interesting.

As a PCA on a med/surg floor, one of my primary jobs is to provide hygienic care to patients. As a floor of all private rooms, there really isn't a tactful way to do it without closing the door. I've rarely had female patients express problems with me providing their care. Granted a certain amount of savvy on the part of the resource (charge) nurse in assigning me patients to bathe and whatnot goes a long way.

For those who say older women mind more than younger women, I've found the opposite to be true. Elderly women sometimes assume that I might be embarrassed to provide "intimate" care, but rarely do they mind my doing it. I am usually not assigned to do total care of women patients under 40, though in all honesty, we don't get all that many in that age group who need total care (most are capable of bathing themselves).

Among elderly women, if they can wash their own genital area, I ask them to do it, though sometimes they can't and if so, don't seem to mind my doing it (or changing their diapers or whatever I'm doing down there. Some may be embarrassed at the fact that they are incontinent or unable to care for themselves, but a respectful and gentle demeanor go a long way.

More than cleaning and care, I find that people, both male and female, are most squeamish about bedpans. Often, someone will hit the call bell asking for a bedpan, and I have been asked if there were a female nurse to do it. My reply is usually that I will be happy to find a female nurse, but that it may take a while (these requests usually seem to occur during the change-of-shift report when there aren't any nurses on the floor)...

If the pt can hold it until a nurse comes, fine, but usually they choose to have me do it rather than wait.

[CITCAT]

usually you let the patient know what you are going to do before you do any procedure , if there is a problem then get female nurse to assist or talk to spouse or pt.reassuring them that your professional and that you have many years experience ,if they refuse then get a supervisor/dr to address .

[CITCAT]

did he say router rooter lol

[Cheisu]

Unfortunately, our litigious society assumes that all men are predators. The fact that doctors are exempt from this assumption is claim to thier continued elevation as morally and intellectually superior to all other health care professionals.

Let's face it, all it takes is an accusation and that male nurse is run out of town on a rail (there will be the usual investigation, commonly without finding, followed by considerable stress on the floor about what really happened). The assumption of guilt is classicly conditioned. Who would want to put themselves in that position?

Please don't shoot the messenger on this subject; it is only my opinion

I'm from SDN, and I plan on becoming a surgeon.

I want to tell you, doctors are not exempt from that assumption. There have been many cases against doctors.

[Cheisu]

I agree that the assumption of guilt is conditioned. However if, as a male nurse you are uncomfortable say so! opt out of the procedure and have someone else do it, or get a female nurse as a chaperone. Notice I am saying procedures I have not seen (not to say it never happens) a female pt refuse to get meds b/c they were coming from a male nurse they just don't want to be exposed in front of them. Ahhhhh what can a say ern91 if you a really worried about it you may want to think about another profession. But trust me everything comes with practice and time.

An appendix can rupture within SECONDS, and it takes SECONDS to switch people or get a chaperone.

Me personally, I wouldn't care which gender examined me (I'm a male). Why should you care, anyway? It comes to stereotypes. Women do have different anatomies, and look slightly more feminine, and have a feminine voice, but women and men can do an exam the EXACT same. They both have hands, etc. etc. and I would be perfectly comfortable being examined by a male or a female.

[Cheisu]

After reading some of your posts I have a question, and comment.

Why is it that a woman can do the procedures on a male, and not have a witness but a male cannot do the procedures on a female without having a witness?

Isn't that racist of a kind?

Wouldn't it make sense that if a male needs witness to do his duties on a female, that a female needs a witness to do her duties on a male?

It seems us future surgeons think alike. (except i don't like ortho, I'm going to be a trauma surgeon, general surgeon, or cardiothoracic surgeon)

[Cheisu]

I'm a female student, (not a nurse yet) but I can tell you from experience with my two teenage sons and my husband, (who needs to get cathed every once in a while due to kidney stones); all three of them want a female nurse, not a male nurse! This seems to be the opposite of what everyone is saying, but from their point of view, it has something to do with homophobia. My husband was very uncomfortable having a male nurse do his foley, even though there is nothing sexual about it. There is always that question in their minds... Is this guy a homosexual? If he is, I don't want him touching me!

Well your husband needs to get over it. I wonder if the female nurses know that he sees foleys as a sexual experience (because he obviously doesn't want a male nurse to do something SEXUAL to him), and he wants a female nurse to do them? I also wonder if he knows that these people are there to help relieve pain. What do you think about your husband wanting a FEMALE to do his foleys, because he would otherwise think if it was a male, then it's sexual. Have you ever thought that your husband LIKED getting touched by a female patient? I mean, that's what it sounds like to me, if he's that close-minded.

[Cheisu]

I know what you're talking about! My dad got his BSN from Alderson-Broaddus College in Philippi. I used to get teased mercilessly from other kids- "Your daddy's a nurse? What's yer momma do, drive a truck?"

And now, I'm a nurse too. And wouldn't you know, my wife drives a truck! (kidding!):rotfl:

Yeah, some people are really close-minded to the fact that that males can be nurses too. (I'm a guy, but I want to be a surgeon, personally)

In my media arts (photography) class, I was talking about a male nurse or something, I don't remember what it was about (it wasn't anything bad, all the male nurses I work with are actually pretty masculine and cool), but anyway I was talking about it and this girl was like "men can't be nurses!". I'm 16, and a sophomore in high school. This girl is also a sophomore. I was seriously shocked, because I really think she believed that men couldn't be nurses.

In all honesty, I would be the same amount of comfortable with a male nurse or a female nurse, but I think it's just that males know how to handle males better, because they're males themselves, and women know how to handle women better, etc. BUT, I've also heard the theory that men are EXTRA sure to be over sensitive and very careful when they have a female patient, maybe so sensitive that the female pt is like "lol why is he being so shy"

[Cheisu]

I absolutely agree with everything you have said. Doctors are not questioned about whether they perform task on women and neither should I. Back in the early 90's I worked in an emergency room. All the other nurses had gone to supper and only myself and an old doc were present in the ER. He said we had a patient that needed a lady partsl exam but her would have to wait a half hour until a female nurse returned from supper. The patient was bleeding. I told him that we are all nurses not male or female and that professionally we could perform the exam. Talking to the patient revealed she did not have a problem with us performing the exam she just wanted results. Another time one of my female patients needed a cath. I was told by one of the older nurses that I could not do the procedure. I told her to check her license and I would check mine to see if it said male or female. I also told her to check the scope of practice to see if it differentiated gender specific task. I got the cath and performed the procedure. Nurses have to step up and take charge. We are no different than the physicians. We all have jobs to do. Sure there are some nurses who are not as professional and probably should not be nurses as there are MDs that are not as professional and should not be physicians. Well I guess that is enough on this subject.

:up::up::up::up::w00t:

[nursemike, ASN, RN]

Amen to THAT!!!

Awhile back, I was asked to place a Foley in a male patient because his female nurse and another female nurse had been unable. Neither of them was in any danger of being sexually harassed--the patient's guard would not have permitted that--and neither was ready to scream or faint. If he had needed an external (Texas cath) it would have been easy.

I was able to place the Foley, but it was probably not very comfortable, since the patient was beginning to respond to my touch by the time I got it in.

Those critters have a mind of their own, sometimes.

[nursemike, ASN, RN]

If the pt can hold it until a nurse comes, fine, but usually they choose to have me do it rather than wait.

I find much the same response toward waiting for a female aide. Some do, and some don't care. Occassionally, a lady who prefers to wait for a female at the beginning of the shift is more than happy to have me do it by the end of the shift--I'm available, and while most of our aides do try to respond promptly, they're pretty busy. When the choice is a male nurse right now or a female in a few minutes, comfort sometimes takes precendence over modesty.

A few times, when I've asked an aide to assist a modest female, I've gotten looks or remarks suggesting I was using my gender as an excuse to get out of "dirty work." And of course there are those who think all nurses would rather spend twenty minutes looking for an aide than five putting a patient on and off a bedpan. Fortunately, this is uncommon, and I don't believe I've ever noticed even a hint of it from a fellow nurse.

I agree, though, that older females--even some who've never had a male nurse before--seem generally less perturbed than younger ones.

Come to think of it, the times I've been "sexually harassed" (well, flirted with, playfully) have all been older ladies.

It seems to me that our society tends to see the elderly as less sexual beings, and this seems especially true of women. I think part of the reason they may be less modest is that they see themselves as less sexual. Now, I know from growth and development that this is not a fair assumption, but it is still a fairly pervasive cultural perception, and I've also noticed that the elderlier I get, the less sexual I feel (and frankly, it's kind of a relief!) I also notice that when a woman in her 80s pats the bed beside her and invites me to hop in, I tend to feel happy she's feeling so frisky, rather than feeling threatened. Even older men can seem threatening to women, and some (of all ages) seem to have trouble distinguishing between flirtatious and nasty.