Is your facility warning staff for overtime, for missing lunch breaks or other?

Chaya, ASN, RN · Sep 24, 2007

Wow. I had no idea this practice was so widespread. Nearly3/4 of all respondents say this is happening at their facility!

n7sa5q · Sep 24, 2007

as usual i am the odd person out! maybe it is because i am new to the practice and only work a few days each week. either way, i love to work! if i were told that there was an issue with the process and management was concerned over the over time and lunches, which did happen when i was a cna, i would just clock out and finished caring for my patients. grant it, i have not had to do this at scott and white as an lvn. they do, however, account for lunches and such with adjustments in pay and chromos time. i just don't concern myself with the issue. either way, i have a job i love and i will have the pay necessary to meet my needs in the end. my patients know i will be there when they need me and management knows they can count on me to complete my work. i just consider it my nursing right to help the team to meet goals set by management and manage my care as a professional. yes, this means that i don't always get paid for working, but overall the majority of people in the u.s. do not get paid for the hard work they perform for others. just as owners of small businesses, musicians, and artists work an honest living and in the end can not afford to feed their families. i feel that i am fortunate enough to have the opportunity to care for my families needs with the career i have chosen. it does come with some unfortunate sacrifices. i am willing to accept that. have a blessed day!

Ariesbsn · Sep 24, 2007

We were told in ICU that the number of people who were clocking out using the "worked through lunch" option was excessive because there were 2 people who used it in a 3 month period.

RNgonewild · Sep 24, 2007

Administration has been severely cutting the overtime. There is a place to put a request in for extra shifts, but there hasn't been any posted for over a month. Two months ago the overtime was flowing freely, but now it seems they have decided they are in the red. Being a relief Charge Nurse I used to be able to call in nurses for time and a half if I needed them, now I have to go through managers around and around and am pressured to overstress(overload) the nurses I already have on shift. Then I tell them if I dont get an extra nurse in they will paying the ones that are here double time after the 12 hours they worked to finish up the computer charting,etc. It seems as if the computer charting has cost us more time and overtime than when we were handwriting in charts and more orders get missed because the nurses are ignoring the charts altogether!

nu2id · Sep 24, 2007

Our facility is just now starting to pay attention to all the overtime we have had. We have to document in an edit log why we have overtime. If we put down "no lunch" we better have a better reason than staying over for 30 minutes. The ironic thing is most of us put down took lunch as a reason for staying over at the end of our shift. Charting and pt care are also big reasons to stay over or not be able to take lunch. Hopefully administration will see the link. It does seem that computor charting has taken alot more of our time.

EmmaG, RN · Sep 25, 2007

if i were told that there was an issue with the process and management was concerned over the over time and lunches, which did happen when i was a cna, i would just clock out and finished caring for my patients.

no offense, but that is not very smart. what happens if you are injured off the clock? what happens if an incident occurs with you off the clock?

if you love your job so much, you best stay on the clock until you are ready to leave. you might one day end up regretting your choice otherwise.

eta: by the way, if you think you're helping your employer out by breaking the law, think again; it could very well come back to bite them in the butt: http://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3aen-us%3aofficial&channel=s&hl=en&q=walmart+overtime&btng=google+search

paulla29 · Sep 25, 2007

My facility has a written policy that if we are off the clock, we are not to be on the floor working. Another reason for a write up.

prepacuornurse · Sep 25, 2007

I've been hearing of nurses getting counseled or warnings about overtime, for missing lunch breaks, late admissions, and misc other reasons... and/or hospitals requiring you to clock out on time, then you have to submit your overtime separately with documentation why you had to have overtime.
Is your facility warning staff for overtime, for missing lunch breaks or other reasons?
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My facility rarely has the staff to give lunches or we get 15 minutes in sometimes a 12 hour day.Also we may work 12 hours a day for 3 days and when it comes to thursday and friday they make you leave before you get overtime.Nice huh?

EmmaG, RN · Sep 25, 2007

http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/whd/whdfs31.htm

Common Industry Problems
Non-exempt employees must be compensated for any time during which they perform activities that benefit the employer.
The most common violation in the nursing care industry is the failure of employers to pay for all the hours worked. This uncompensated time most frequently occurs when employers fail to pay for work performed:
Before and after a worker's scheduled shift;
During an employee's scheduled meal period; and
While employees are attending staff meetings and compensable training sessions.
Minimum wage and overtime pay violations also occur when employers make deductions or demand reimbursement for the cost of required uniforms or equipment.
Individuals not otherwise employed by the facility who volunteer - without expectation of pay - to attend to the comfort of nursing home residents in a manner not otherwise provided by the facility are not considered employees under the FLSA. However, individuals (including residents) who perform work of any consequential economic benefit to the facility are employees and entitled to FLSA minimum wage and overtime.
Overtime pay violations often occur when employers:
Fail to pay overtime after 8 hours of work in a day for workers (both full time and part time) who are under the "8 and 80" system.
Pay overtime after 80 hours worked during a biweekly period rather than after 40 hours in a workweek to employees not under the "8 and 80" system.
Fail to combine hours worked in more than one department or at more than one facility when determining the total overtime hours worked.
Fail to include in calculating overtime hours the time spent or hours worked while performing on-call assignments.
Fail to include shift differential, bonuses or on-call fees in calculating an employee's regular rate.
Fail to pay overtime to non-exempt, salaried employees (e.g., clerical staff, cooks, and activities directors).

I can assure you, the Feds take this VERY seriously.

I reported my facility when my manager told the staff that they could no longer charge for a missed lunch break if they had taken time here and there during their shift (i.e. going to the cafeteria for coffee, sitting down for a few minutes, smoke breaks, eating a fast 15 minute "lunch", etc), stating that all of these added up to 30 minutes total, and therefore constituted a "lunch break".

When I called, I was simply looking for clarification because what she said seemed wrong. The man I spoke with got soooo fired up over this; he demanded to know where I worked and quoted me the law as it applied to the hospital. The hospital administration got a friendly call the next day from the Feds reminding them of the law.

He never took my name, btw. It was completely anonymous.

EmmaG, RN · Sep 25, 2007

More info:

http://www.dol.gov/elaws/esa/flsa/otcalc/i2.asp

http://www.dol.gov/elaws/esa/flsa/otcalc/doc7j.asp

An employer can use the standard system of overtime for hours over 40 in a workweek for some employees and the "8 and 80" exception for others at the same workplace, but cannot use both systems for a single individual employee.

The following has specifics as it relates to healthcare facilities. (meal breaks, "rest" breaks, staff meetings, "authorizing" overtime, working from home---pay attention those of you who make out the staff schedules and perform other activities away from the hospital!!), etc. Something I've seen time and again is administration telling staff they won't be paid for OT unless it's "approved". That is illegal.

http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/whd/whdfs53.pdf

http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/whd/whdfs54.pdf

You part-timers need this info too; you may be qualified to receive OT pay. Also, use the calculator provided to determine if your shift differentials are being added to base pay to calculate your OT pay (I know for a fact my old employer did not do so).

http://www.dol.gov/elaws/esa/flsa/otcalc/suffer_or_permit_to_work.asp

dcnballmom, ASN, RN · Sep 25, 2007

OMG do they every - we now have a slip to fill out to say why we are late clocking out - i usually put on it CUZ I WAS DOING MY JOB - 50 patients to tend to, 25 labs, 15 fingersticks, not counting the numerous interuptions from admin - and dont forget that the patients lots of times want to use the bathroom when there is only 1 GNA and myself on the unit - and i forgot that there are 9 people that need to be fed meals and only 2 GNAs that are qualified to do that because my nursing admin hasnt found the time to give the feeding course to the housekeepers where I work - but they have time to go out to lunch at least once a week - and there is the never ending paperwork, the docs that have to be called, the orders that need to be written - and have mercy, if you skip that mandatory half hour lunch so you can take care of stuff on your units, shame on you there too - I dont see any way to solve the problems at my facility though - would like some answers if anyone else has figured this out - when they make 10 hours days, then maybe my patients will start getting quality care, not just hit and miss stuff :nono:

bethin · Sep 25, 2007

We've been warned but no one believed management until they fired an er clerk. She was working registration on a very slow day when she rec'd word that her mother had been brought to the er via ambulance after a car accident. She got a replacement but in her haste forgot to clock out. Her mother died and she was fired.

Yes, I know that technically the hospital is liable if she was still clocked in and an accident occurs, but the thing is the mother was a pt in our er.

I've even been asked to clock out while running labs to another hospital. Didn't clock out and never got paid for it.

They are so worried about the almighty dollar that they forget that we are humans and not machines.