Is it me, or is the College of Nursing in Ontario hiding something?

Fiona59 · Apr 14, 2008

Hey wait till they do what they did out west.

The bridge is basicallly over. With the introduction of the diploma exit for PN students which include the arts courses, the bridge no longer exists.

Athabasaca U offers a programme for PNs wanting to go onto RN which takes four years and gives 30 credits for the PN education.

GMCC and the UofA no longer offer the bridge. The last bridge at GMCC started in October last year.

So it's back to apply with everyone else from what we can determine out here.

linzz · Apr 14, 2008

How long was the bridge in Alberta before it was axed? We have them here in Toronto at Ryerson, Humber and a few others and they have been around just a few years but they only take about 25 people and I am pretty sure they prefer their own diploma RPN's. Whether they will continue is anyone's guess. I just wish Ontario would figure what to do with nursing education. I often wonder if one of the reasons the original RN diploma program was axed was to reduce unemployment by putting out fewer nurses, however it will likely just result in an RN shortage as Ontario is really resisting using RPN's in hospitals to any great extent. Just my thoughts only.

suzanne4, RN · Apr 14, 2008

Bridging programs are always changing, this happens in the US as well, and the lists are always needing to be updated. So there are many licensing boards that no longer bother to concern themselves with the list.

They can tell you easily of the RN programs that are approved, but anything less than the full program and you will need to check with the specific program that you are interested in.

Ontario is also one of the stricted provinces in terms of licensure in Canada as well.

Fiona59 · Apr 14, 2008

Linzz: I believe that GMCC had it for around five years. The UofA was about four. Basically it looked like the only gave us old timers a few years to have a crack at it. (You had to have all the arts transfer courses completed before you could be admitted) As soon as the BScN became mandatory for practice in AB, it died.

kidsndog · Apr 14, 2008

What I wonder is if the practical nurse position was created by the governing board of nurses, or by the government? If it was originally a govenment initiative to create lower paying nursing jobs, then perhaps the Colleges of Nurses have no really desire to actually see practical nurses improve themselves. For example, in Ontario, from what I have been able to research, if a practical nurse wants to become an RN, she/he has to either;

a) quit her practical nurse job and go back to school full time for no less than three years or;

b) Apply to the only university that offers a part-time bridging program that takes FIVE years to complete.

Does that make sense? How many working nurses can afford to quite working for THREE years to return to school? That's more than a $117k loss of gross salary for the three years not working, plus whatever debt is occured by being in school full-time. I don't want to sound paranoid, but it does seem that practical nursing is not supported by the colleges of nurses. And, to add fuel to the fire, would the fact that a very large number of practical nurses are minorities have anything to do with the lack of support?

Fiona59 · Apr 14, 2008

Practical Nursing education developed as a result of a shortage of nurses in the 1940s. Over the years the scope of practise has changed radically. Depending on where you train and work there is very little difference in the permitted skills between both grades of nurses.

I would dispute your claim that a large number of PNs are from ethnic minorities. It's not the case in AB.

What I have seen personally, is that at the end of the '90s and turn of this century more mature students entered PN programmes due to the limited number of seats in RN programmes and the amount of upgrading that was required by many local colleges and universities to be considered for the RN diploma and degree. Norquest and Bow Valley in Alberta required a high school diploma and didn't care how old your marks were, GMCC and UoA had mature students of 35 and over competing with 21 yos for admission as mature students.

As you state people of this age just can't pack up their lives and live off student loans and savings for two or more years to acquire a degree. Mortgages, being a single parent, and the plain old cost of living make it impossible for many. The PN course used to cost around $3500 plus living expenses which made it much more palatable for this age group because the four semesters were back to back and there was a light at the end of the tunnel roughly 56 weeks later. The RN education was run on strict academic schedules and 2.5 to 3 years later the job search began.

I honestly think that nursing education in this country needs to be re-evaluated and I believe cna is doing some research on this.

It is becoming a very sad state of affairs when there are LPNs with degrees in other fields, with skills that are superior to many new grads are making less than employed nursing students. In my facility the main difference in the skills right now are I cannot hang blood or the first bag of TPN. The rest of the skills are identical but facility policy restricts my practice of them.

Fiona59 · Apr 14, 2008

Bridging programs are always changing, this happens in the US as well, and the lists are always needing to be updated. So there are many licensing boards that no longer bother to concern themselves with the list.
They can tell you easily of the RN programs that are approved, but anything less than the full program and you will need to check with the specific program that you are interested in.

Not correct. There are a limited number of universities that even offer a BScN in each province. Canada does not have any "unapproved" nursing schools. If a nursing programme is offered it must meet provincial and national requirements.

Ontario is also one of the stricted provinces in terms of licensure in Canada as well. -- Every province is strict. AB still endorses licenses of PNs moving here from BC due to the difference in educational content. We won't even start discussing PQ and it's requirements.

suzanne4, RN · Apr 14, 2008

Not correct. There are a limited number of universities that even offer a BScN in each province. Canada does not have any "unapproved" nursing schools. If a nursing programme is offered it must meet provincial and national requirements.
Ontario is also one of the stricted provinces in terms of licensure in Canada as well. -- Every province is strict. AB still endorses licenses of PNs moving here from BC due to the difference in educational content. We won't even start discussing PQ and it's requirements.

I did not mean that they offer programs that are not approved at all, but the fact is that they may not have lists of programs that offer bridge programs as those are forever changing. Bridge programs are not offered in all schools of nursing that offer the four year degree there and that is the only point that I was trying to make.

Ontario also requires the full two years for the LPN role there, not all of the provinces require that amount of time, the same for the two year RN in the US.

That is the only point that I was trying to make, please do not take it out of context. And to take it a step further, why in the world would a licensing board have a list of programs that were not approved? That makes no sense at all. But whether or not one has a bridge program is completely different and that is what I was talking about.