HPRP unfairly being treated

Recovering_RN · Apr 8, 2018

Well first of all, know that however "unfair" you consider this, it is totally commonplace and not unusual AT ALL. No it's not fair, and no it's not necessary, no you're maybe not an addict or alcoholic, BUT I can tell you right now that compared to the other people who post here on this forum, you are LUCKY to be offered two years!! Most people get five years of monitoring. My state, Texas, is three, and I'm lucky because that's not nearly as common as 5.

You're going to have to do it. You could try to get a lawyer, see if he can help with any of the specifics of the requirements, like which doctor you can use to get your evaluation. If you found an "addictionologist" near you and requested him, that might be considered, I dont know. My program offered me a list of 3 doctors, when I requested a different one I was told no. My doctor recommended a particular IOP (intensive outpatient treatment) but it was an hour drive so I searched online and found one that was much much closer, and on that point they did allow me to use my choice.

But you're not going to get out of it. There are LOTS of us here doing our time. What state are you in?

By the way, if your employer is supportive of you that may help you with your biggest hurdle, which is finding a job once you get into monitoring. You will have restrictions like no narcotic administration for 6 months, no overtime, no nights. Maybe not all of those, depends on your state's program, but if you can keep your job during this you will have achieved already one of the hugest hurdles that we all face, which is going out there after being fired and trying to find an employer who will take us on with all the restrictions and paperwork that is involved.

Wolfpuppy31 · Apr 8, 2018

Michigan

Recovering_RN · Apr 8, 2018

I don't know anything about Michigan but I'm sure someone here will chime in. I added an extra paragraph above, while you were already responding, about your employer.

Wolfpuppy31 · Apr 8, 2018

I am unfortunately considering a different career and going back to bartending in the meantime. I can't eveb believe they can do this to people. Good honest people. I don't have a problem what so ever - but I can see the need for the program and restrictions if you were in fact unsafe to practice.

This last year of my life has been hard. I have socially isolated myself completely. I don't hang out with people, I hang out with m dogs. As far as having a life. I don't have it. I work and sleep. I should be working hard and going on vacations. I should be dating or getting married. I am a 32 year old single woman living alone. Two more years of being completely depleted of money and going through the emotional stress is just too much for me. Is it really worth it? Worth my sanity?

Very tough decisions. I say unfairly treated because I know I am safe to practice. My employer and employees know I am safe to practice. Patient safety is my number one goal, it's the most important thing to me. I would never jeopardize someone and I almost feel like I am slipping mentally due to the stress that sometimes maybe my head is in a fog at work! That is not okay to me.

I am not having my narc keys taken away but there was a part in my MA that stated can work 7am-12. I am a night shift nurse and I also get mandated frequently. I work a lot of over time and they will restrict that. Over time is how I pay my bills!

This is all just insanity to me. It's been the most horrific experience Of my life.

Recovering_RN · Apr 8, 2018

Read the post I started recently called something like "Isolating, obsessing, life on hold". You are not the only one doing that!!

I also considered giving up nursing, and many people consider it. Yes it's going to be expensive but in the long run, 2 years out of your life is not that much. I know it seems like it is right now, but it is doable. It sucks but it's doable. The biggest reason I didn't give up nursing is that my ego couldn't take having to lie to people for the rest of my life when they said "didn't you used to be an ER nurse?" What would I say? I'd lie and say yeah but it was too stressful or too exhausting or whatever. I would never tell people the truth, I'd got caught diverting and had to go into a 3 year monitoring program so I just quit! And those questions will come up for years! People who haven't seen you in a long time will pop up years from now and be all like "bartending? Huh, I thought I remembered someone told me you're a nurse. Was that not true?" Weddings, funerals, family reunions, people will remember that one fact about you and then you'll have to explain it, again. You might just tell the truth, idk, but for me I would've lied. And I couldn't stand the thought of keeping up a lie for years! So I bit the bullet and just did it.

Consider your options very carefully. I don't want to harp on this point because I know right now you are way stressed, but two years is a good deal where all this crap is concerned!! You can do two years.

Eris Discordia BSN, RN · Apr 8, 2018

Honestly, what is happening to you is unfortunately par for the course. I also agree with "Recovering RN" that you are getting an exceedingly short contract and very good terms, as far as this crap goes.

I mean, instead of having to shovel 500 tons of manure with a spoon, it sounds like you are getting about 200 tons of manure and a spoon to deal with. It's still manure and feels impossible, but it's more possible than others might have it.

It's not about fair. You will lose your mind if you focus on the unfairness of it all. The BON and monitoring folks don't care if you were on duty or off, as long as your license was active. They don't care if your house gets foreclosed on and your car gets repoed.

I was not working at all, nursing or otherwise, when my doctor reported me for abusing a non-controlled drug. My license however, was obviously still active. There was no crime, absolutely nothing illegal happening. Just me abusing my own prescription for a non-controlled med. Patient care was not a factor. Employment wasn't even a factor.

Doesn't matter. I am in a five year contract and my terms are far harsher than yours. I had a narc restriction, no nights, restrictions on the type of nursing I can do, no overtine, heavy supervision, one YEAR of IOP (which I am now done with), minimum of 52 drug tests a year, nail, blood, and urine tests have been done, yada yada yada.

I have been sued 6 times for not being able to pay medical bills. Garnished wages left and right. Every month, at least one utility has been cut off because we can't keep up. I get drug tested at least 52 times a year and I've had to give blood and nail tests randomly for no reason.

Believe me, this entire thing blows chunks. It's punishment and the punishment BON/monitoring gives rarely matches the level of the offense. When I first started, I was positive that it was mathematically IMPOSSIBLE for me to survive this program. I mean. No way, no how.

I'm 14 months in and somehow, I've done it. Yes, it's been ugly, messy, and sometimes we don't have much food in the house. If there was a way for me to drop out, earn a livable income, and not have my sins made public, trust me, I would drop out in a heart beat.

What you are going through is normal. I remember feeling every bit as angry and frustrated as you are now. I *knew* what they were asking from me was impossible. But I was wrong. It is possible, just massively painful.

I agree with the previous poster, that you have an advantage over many of us...you have an employer who knows about your criminal background already and is choosing to stand by you, fight for you, and help you keep your job. That is a serious advantage to have. Since I was not working when I was reported, I had to start from scratch and attempt to find a job that was okay with my restrictions, okay with my monitoring, and who was willing to take a chance on an unknown nurse to them. It wasn't simple and I'm certainly not working in my chosen specialty. But it's work and a paycheck and I'm able to work off my restrictions.

Ultimately, you have a very difficult choice that only you can make. This is certainly a very good place to come to and vent about the crappiness of these programs and the cookie cutter sentences that they give out.

But try to focus on some positives you have going for you:

1) a job that wants to keep you and is fighting for you (that's awesome!)

2) a relatively short monitoring sentence, (most get 3 to 5 years)

3) very few restrictions on your practice (relatively speaking...not having a narc restriction is HUGE)

4) having proof of sobriety thru the courts. That will help you out when you have your treatment evaluation. That might just keep you out of inpatient treatment and land you a relatively short IOP treatment.

You have a hard choice. But sometimes things that seem impossible manage to find an impossible way of working out.

We are here for you! As much as it is absolutely vile to have landed here, you are very welcomed in this corner of nursing. Keep us posted.

Wolfpuppy31 · Apr 8, 2018

Thank you for the support. I do truly appreciate the responses. I feel like my life is in shambles and I don't know who to talk to about it. I did not want to make my mistakes known or public. To this day my own mother doesn't know about my owi charge and just thinks I decided to be sober on my own. I am very private and proud.

This is sunday day so I don't know where my life will take me tomorrow. I know I'll be getting a call first thing in the morning from HPRP.

Its not about being sober. That is easy. It doesn't bother me at all. Everything else...yeah, I am having a hard time with it. Very hard time.

Wolfpuppy31 · Apr 8, 2018

I do have another question..

This appointment they want me to go to that is over 9 hours away. It is for a "second opinion" about my diagnosis. I first had to do a alcohol assessment with a approved counselor of their choice. Did that. I disagree with some of the things on the assessment and honestly, this guy has a bad rep in this town. I only went with him due to the fact it was in town and my other choices were again, 6-9hr drive away. I didn't have a choice. Now, I need to see a doctor, not a counselor, for a second opinion. Is it worth it to make the drive to see a doctor of their choice for a second opinion? Especially when I don't trust what the counselor had said on my alcohol assessment. (He's actually known as a creep and the first thing my lawyer asked me after assessment was done was "did he hit on you?")

So will it be worth the second opinion from a MD?

Eris Discordia BSN, RN · Apr 8, 2018

I do have another question..
This appointment they want me to go to that is over 9 hours away. It is for a "second opinion" about my diagnosis. I first had to do a alcohol assessment with a approved counselor of their choice. Did that. I disagree with some of the things on the assessment and honestly, this guy has a bad rep in this town. I only went with him due to the fact it was in town and my other choices were again, 6-9hr drive away. I didn't have a choice. Now, I need to see a doctor, not a counselor, for a second opinion. Is it worth it to make the drive to see a doctor of their choice for a second opinion? Especially when I don't trust what the counselor had said on my alcohol assessment. (He's actually known as a creep and the first thing my lawyer asked me after assessment was done was "did he hit on you?")
So will it be worth the second opinion from a MD?

I'd say it depends. Have the monitoring folks given you all your terms based on the first assessment? Have they said anything about inpatient versus outpatient treatment?

If they are trying to pin you with an inpatient stay, I would think the second opinion would be worth it. If they are recommending a short IOP treatment? Honestly, that's probably the best you will get and I likely wouldn't bother if the second evaluation is pricey.

For me, the distance of the eval would matter less than the cost of the eval and the benefit I would stand to gain. If it were a cheap copay, I would do it and eat the gas and time regardless. If it were a $2,000 eval and I wasn't facing inpatient to begin with? Meh, I'd probably not do it.

Wolfpuppy31 · Apr 8, 2018

No inpatient treatment was offered or discussed.

I will need to call tomorrow and find out cost and if my insurance covers the appointment or not.

I have a month left of classes - I just hope if I go it doesn't interfere with work of school. I basically have a perfect attendance record.

This has all just really put everything I have been working on and towards on hold. Such an enormous stressor. I just want to be able to live comfortably.

SpankedInPittsburgh, DNP, RN · Apr 8, 2018

Yeah. I don't know what to add. You have gotten a lot of good advice from the good people that come to this site. The monitoring programs don't care about fairness in general or you in particular. I'm not trying to be harsh but that's the way I see it. They care about bloody retribution. These programs rarely do any good for anybody. There are rare exceptions but the net gets cast way, way too wide and nurses who do not have substance abuse problems nor were impaired at work in anyway get caught up in it. Worse are nurses with mental health diagnoses who simply get stuck in these meat-grinders because there is no other place to put them. If you get off for $12K you are getting off light. The lost wages alone last year cost me more than $40K not to mention the treatment and testing fees.

Anyway, I'm going to tell you what I tell all new nurses caught up in this hideous carny-show. Evaluate how important being a nurse is to you on every level. If you have a viable alternative consider it strongly because you are going to pay a steep price to keep working in nursing. I stayed because I'm old and would have literally lost everything if I simply quit. I say all the time, if I was 10 years younger I would have found a new line of work or 10 years older I would have simply retired. I wish I had better news for you but honestly there is nothing but misery in these programs. Maybe at one time they were a good idea but now they have morphed into an uncaring cash grab from nurses who are often inappropriately placed and can ill-afford to pay.

By the way they don't care if you can't pay.

Good Luck!!!