smoke coming out of my ears!!! - page 2
alright everybody....i came across this in the paper and the last 2 paragraphs have me fuming....:angryfire as usual, i was turning to you guys to find out your thoughts on this. for those of... Read More
Jul 9, '02i like the idea of carrying around a tape recorder.
we could tape the docs saying things like:
you will be ok
its just a precaution
everything is fine
ill see you tomorrow
and whenever the pt has a problem we could just play those comforting words that work such wonders.
say for example the author of that article comes in the hospital and codes on the floor...
instead of calling a code we could just play his doc saying:
you will be ok
everything is fine
ill see you tomorrow
certainly that will go much further than anything we could do
Jul 9, '02In reading the above article through it seems to me that the last statement is merely made in relation to marketing of hospitals. I think what Snyder is saying is that if a patient's Dr. or friends talk up a hospital the patient is more likely to go there regardless of what the staffing ratios are. This is just another example of how the health care has been changed into a business where many lose.
Jul 9, '02P RN super moderator.....thx for the correction in the date of these things.....
the sad thing to say is that the public is dubious and ignorant(and I do not use ignorant in a bad way, just an uninformed and whatever the bestest powers that be tell to think way)...
I have respect for doc's (well, that is for the doc's that I respect).....but if not for the 24/7 of the nurses, patients would be lost in the great divide called medical docdom and patient is here and in need.........
no offense fellow male coworkers/nurses, but are we still just being viewed as the handmaidens of the medical profession.....at least in the eyes of the public.......
give me a tylenol is the least of what i do.....in eight to twelve + hours.......
i live at work and come home to sleep.........
good night all,
what can be done when five year old studies get put out like this and the public thinks they are brand new.........
don't wanna have a dream about this one.........;-/
Jul 9, '02Out here in good ol' British Columbia, the bedside nursing/patient ratio is 1:6. Beds get "closed" when there isn't a nurse available for that ratio. Not that I do bedside nursing myself (sorry, OR), but when we've had to cancel a patient's op because "there's no bed available" and the patient's family has a hissy fit, I have my line down pat. I'm sorry but there is no bed available for ..... Then the family says "of course there's beds available. the hospital has to provide a bed and there are vacant beds here on the wards". Yes, true, however, in order to have a patient in a bed, there has to be a nurse available to take care of them. I'm sorry, welcome to the reality of the nursing shortage. No available beds in ICU or telemetry because of lack of staff means no op.
Our "surgical short stay unit" closes the 2nd week of June and re-opens the 2nd week of September every year. The staff then are used to "staff" other nursing units. We get "no beds available", bed booking gets frantic, and the hospital "admin on call" then has to try and find staff available/willing to come in (work overtime0 to staf the sssu. Seems a waste of time to me. Better to keep the unit open and hire more staff for "permanent lines" rather than just "casual", but then, what do I know?
Just last week, there was a leukemia patient who died in the emergency room where the oncology hematologist was frantically trying to find a bed available in the lower mainland. This hit the news media, with the doc saying that there were empty beds in the hospitals, but no nurses to staff them.Last edit by jurbyjunk on Jul 9, '02
Jul 9, '02Jurbyjunk, are you saying the problem is the National health system is refusing to hire full time nurses and that is the problem?
Jul 9, '02i just sent this response to the joker andrew snyder interviewed in th article:
I just read your response to the questions about about nursing staff ratios in the Times. It sounds like you should be having "0" RN"s on your staff since you feel they are of such little importance. I wouldn't want to work at your facility or be a patient there.Let alone, take care of you when you are sick. Perhaps you could have an all physician staff to care for pts. That would be even more expensive and just think of the time you wait to see a doc in his office. I am sure his/her comforting words would mean little as you waited for your pain shot or bedpan. You may need your doctor soon Mr. Snyder TO PERFORM SURGERY TO REMOVE THAT FOOT THAT'S SUCK IN YOUR MOUTH.
Your arrogance is appalling and you owe your nursing staff an apology. Your response is evidence of what many bedside nursing staff have known for years, administration is totally out of the loop when it comes to having a clue about what we do. Nursing is not merely a cost center within the hospital, it is the core provider of both pt. care and public relations. If you have poor nursing care, your reputation suffers. You know this. As nurses we are currently bombarded by demands from administration that we be friendly, caring, and have the "right" attitude even while administrators tell us we can do more with less staff. If your hospital has a good reputation, you should give credit to your nursing staff, because I guarantee you that it is in large part due to their skill and dedication. Isn't the mission of your hospital, patient care, Mr Snyder? And who provides that care?
Jul 9, '02Hi All--
I also was incensed by the comments made by Mr. Snyder at the end of this article. In fact, I have been considering a job within the Porter system, but will now have to think twice about it. Here is the response I emailed to Jerry Davich just this morning:
"Andrew Snyder, spokesman for Porter Memorial Health System, said an adequate number of nurses can never replace the comforting opinion of a patient's doctor or word of mouth.
'Both of those carry a heck of a lot more weight than a bunch of numbers,' Snyder said."
What a comment! And what a shame that your publication saw fit to publish that statement! If Mr. Snyder truly speaks for the Porter Memorial Healthcare System, then I hope that I, nor anyone I know is ever a patient there.
The implication that the god-like PHYSICIAN can breeze into a room for a total of 30 seconds and leave the patient feeling so much better about his/her situation is a farse. As a RN, I spend a significant amount of time explaining and clarifying what the physician has said to the patient--patients don't necessarily hear everything a physician says during his/her brief appearance in the patient's room. The time that RNs spend in the aftermath of the physician visit is usually what leaves the patient with a clearer understanding of what is going on with them, what the treatment plan is, and what they can expect to experience. It sounds to me as though Mr. Snyder needs to make some rounds with attending physicians, followed by shadowing a RN after the physician visit, to see how this process REALLY works. The "bunch of numbers" he refers to are, in fact, partners to the physician to assist him/her in providing the necessary care to his/her patients. We are the integral link between patient and physician for the purpose of assessment, education, support, and information, not to mention direct, hands-on care. I am also stymied by his reference to "word of mouth" being more comforting than a "bunch of numbers". If my neighbor tells me that she had excellent care at Porter Memorial, what does that mean? I still believe that the RN to patient ratios are meaningful in relation to the skill and knowledge of the personnel involved in caring for patients. I resent Mr. Snyder's comment, which would indicate that the Porter Memorial Healthcare System places little value on its staffing, and relies far more on the opinions of the community and former patients in promoting the system. The best advertising in the world cannot replace the care rendered by a competent and caring nurse--PERIOD!
I would like to see Mr. Snyder amend his statement after receiving some education regarding the manner in which physicians and nurses function as partners in healthcare. His blatant ignorance is a black mark on the otherwise excellent reputation that Porter Memorial has in the Northwest Indiana community.
Please, everyone, send a piece of your mind to Mr. Davich--NW Indiana needs to know how valuable RNs are, since Porter Memorial is one of the bigger healthcare providers in the region.
Jul 11, '02I received a reply from the author of the article from the NW Indiana Times. He said a clarification of the spokesman's comments would be in today's edition. Shannon--did you or anyone else who might be in this area see the paper today? I'm working and haven't seen it yet. Let's hope it was emrely a comment taken out of context!
Jul 11, '02i read the paper today and i didn't see an addendum or anything along those lines...but maybe i wasn't looking close enough. i will scour my paper and see what i can find.
i also sent a email with an attachment of the article to the ana and they said they would be pursuing the issue.
Jul 11, '02okay guys, i've looked through my paper and searched their website...haven't come across anything....maybe i am just having a massive brain fart?! bestblond, if you find it i would appreciate the link or the letter. i would like to send the article to the ana. if you guys are interesting in searching the newspaper site it is www.thetimesonline.com :wink2:
Jul 12, '02Nope.....nothing that I could find either. Let's keep looking for the next week or so to see if it gets put in another edition.
Jul 12, '02"Comments on nurses clarified
Posted on Friday, July 12, 2002
In Monday's Times, a story regarding nurse-patient ratios quoted Porter Memorial Hospital spokesman Andrew Snyder, whose comments were meant to reflect the view that no study could diminish the importance of Registered Nurses and their contribution to patient care."
jeez, thought they might have been a littler nicer....that is horsesh!t!!! thanks to everyone who wrote them and helped stand up for our profession. you guys rock! :kiss