Do LPN's get the pay they deserve?

estrogen · Apr 10, 2005

I worked as a hospital LPN for many years...then I worked for the same hospital as a RN. Just off the top of my head...Yes, the IVPs and transfusions through peripheral lines. Then the physical assessments take some extra minutes for each patient. RNs had to do them for each LPN's patient each shift....but the RNs usually split the LPNs patients to do assessments on. Central line blood draws, flushes, and hanging central line IV meds. could also be very time consuming...especially if you had more than one patient that needed most of those procedures during your shift. I found I was busier as a RN than I would have thought when I was a LPN. It looked easier than it was. Just my experience.

I've been an LPN in my hosp in WA for two years now. I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but in my Hospital, IVP's, LPNs do them, xept of cardiac meds. Transfusions through peripheral lines??? LPNs do even transfusions through central lines. Physical assessments - perfectly within the scope of practice of an LPN (at least in this state and I would be MAJORLY surprised if not in all others). Central line blood draws - we have an IV team (all RN's I admit) that does these, so our RN's don't have to do these either. Flushes, hanging meds, PHHHHLLLLEEEASE!!! "...If you have more than one patient that needs these procedures during your shift..." On my floor (med-surg) I have six of them EACH AND EVERY shift! :rotfl: & :crying2:

I make approximately 5 to 7 Bucks less, than a beginning, freshly out of school RN. Thank you very much.

And secondly, if you didn't do all these things in your facility as an LPN, what the heck did you DO do? Pass pills I guess? What a shame, that you hosp didn't utilize you better...

Please don't take this as a personal attack, but I felt like I have to speak up and defend myself here. :)

estrogen · Apr 10, 2005

I don't want to start anything here...but do RN's get paid what they deserve? They have a Bachelor's degree or higher (well, some have an ADN)...LPN education is much shorter, is it not? And don't RN's have more responsibility than an LPN?
We have a nurse who is working on her nursing law degree -- has her MSN, CNS etc -- glutton for punsihment -- EXCEPTIONALLY intelligent woman BTW
In her view, LPNs need to be very careful about saying that they are doing 90% of what the RN does -- she believes that that is putting them out of their "legal scope of practice". I hear her, but REAL life says that that happens alot! In institutions that are financially strappped and understaffed -- it is apparent that many LPNs are doing the 90%! So where does that leave them: underpaid? in legal limbo? HMMMM! Maybe health care needs to reevaluate something here -- YA think!?
Oh thank you! THANK you so much for this post!!! Tragically, you are wo right.

GN1974 · Apr 10, 2005

Estrogen,

Here where I am LPN's can't do initial assessments and must have the assessments there after co-signed by the RN. LPN's can't spike blood or give IVP meds. They can't mix any IV med. Actually our hospitals in this area do very little hiring of LPN's--and this is usually for their outpatient clinics. One area hospital does utilize them but they can't keep RN's there because it has made their workload too much. They must run around trying to reasses the LPN's patients, give her IVP meds, and do blood transfusions. I have seen both sides of the fence...what the nurse you responded to describes IS indeed a reality in many parts of the US. Across the US many hospitals have strarted to phase out LPN's. Do I agree? No! It is a reality even though it may not be at your door step yet. While it is a poor use of resources sometimes...it is also a reality for many RN's of added work and resposibility.

Karen

estrogen · Apr 11, 2005

Estrogen,
Here where I am LPN's can't do initial assessments and must have the assessments there after co-signed by the RN. LPN's can't spike blood or give IVP meds. They can't mix any IV med. Actually our hospitals in this area do very little hiring of LPN's--and this is usually for their outpatient clinics. One area hospital does utilize them but they can't keep RN's there because it has made their workload too much. They must run around trying to reasses the LPN's patients, give her IVP meds, and do blood transfusions. I have seen both sides of the fence...what the nurse you responded to describes IS indeed a reality in many parts of the US. Across the US many hospitals have strarted to phase out LPN's. Do I agree? No! It is a reality even though it may not be at your door step yet. While it is a poor use of resources sometimes...it is also a reality for many RN's of added work and resposibility.
Karen

it's interesting to compare the differences... here, I can't spike blood either. We don't mix IV meds here, the pharmacy does that (xcept if you're talking about diluting something with NS for an IVP...) We can't do the initial admission physical assessment, but we don't have to have the qshift assessments co- signed.... How is it possible, that in other states LPN's are so under-utilized??? If this situation was to come to my state, I would be absolutely devastated...

I guess I'll have to rush back to school, huh?

NoCrumping · Apr 12, 2005

I am an LPN on a long-term vent unit and my job is no different than the RN's jobs, I do all IVs and so on. I make $18.54/hr., I graduated in 2003, so I am at the top of my pay scale LPNwise. But the RNs who do less than I do make $28-32/hr., that is why I am currently enrolled in RN school, to get paid $10 more/hr. to do the exact same job that I am doing now.

And when you get that responsibility that RNs have... you'll realize that $10 is worth all that and more.

NoCrumping · Apr 12, 2005

First of all- don't appreciate the sarcasm in your post. Secondly- How do you think I became a nurse in the first place? Had to have some education didn't I? It took me almost 2 1/2 years to finish my LPN schooling due to the fact that I went to a very small school and (the only school in my town) and had to wait for the pre-req classes I needed to open up before I could even start into the Nursing program. Then once I was in the actual Nursing program I went through it PG and gave birth toward the end of the last semester and was able to go back and finish after that. Another thing- in my post I stated "I feel this way because..." Not everyone is going to agree with me I know- that's why I stated it that way. So for you to post such a smarta** comment I feel was really inappropriate . And lastly- I went to school to be an LPN. Not an RN, Not to get my BSN or anything else. So, why should I have to "get education", take time away from my family, rack up more student loans, and create more stress for myself just for a raise? I am very good at my job and my residents tell me they "just love me". I am an LPN and proud of it - and BTW I make more than some of the RN's in my area as I am from a very small town in southwest Iowa. Most Lpn's make anywhere from $9-$12/hr. I make $16. You know it is possible to voice your opinion w/o being so sarcastic.

Yes, note.... it took you that long to FINISH....... the program was not that long.... There are MDs there are Nurse Mgrs There are RNs There are LPN's there are aids, in approximately that order. Pay and responsibility coincide with these titles. Like it or not. I have posted so many similar posts with regard to thes debate. It will go on and on.

MY OPINION IS THIS: THERE SHOULD BE ONLY ONE EDUCATION REQUIREMENT FOR A "NURSE".THAT IS A REGISTERED NURSE (EXCLUDING ADVANCED PRACTICE) AND CNAs. PERIOD. I THINK LPN AS AN EDUCATION OPTION FOR A NURSE SHOULD NOT BE AN OPTION. FLAME AWAY

Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN · Apr 12, 2005

Can we close this thread, please?

RN34TX · Apr 12, 2005

Yes, note.... it took you that long to FINISH....... the program was not that long.... There are MDs there are Nurse Mgrs There are RNs There are LPN's there are aids, in approximately that order. Pay and responsibility coincide with these titles. Like it or not. I have posted so many similar posts with regard to thes debate. It will go on and on.
MY OPINION IS THIS: THERE SHOULD BE ONLY ONE EDUCATION REQUIREMENT FOR A "NURSE".THAT IS A REGISTERED NURSE (EXCLUDING ADVANCED PRACTICE) AND CNAs. PERIOD. I THINK LPN AS AN EDUCATION OPTION FOR A NURSE SHOULD NOT BE AN OPTION. FLAME AWAY

What is your problem with LPN's?

Did some LPN steal your man or burn your house down?

You can wish all you want, LPN's aren't going anywhere anytime soon.

They've been talking about "phasing them out" for years.

They're still alive and well in health care.

And what sense does it make to have CNA's and throw out more trained/educated staff?

You want CNA's but you don't want LPN's.

BTW, pay and responsibility do not always coincide like in your perfect healthcare world. That's speaking from experience, not theory, from a former LPN.

ariella · Apr 12, 2005

Estrogen,
Here where I am LPN's can't do initial assessments and must have the assessments there after co-signed by the RN. LPN's can't spike blood or give IVP meds. They can't mix any IV med. Actually our hospitals in this area do very little hiring of LPN's--and this is usually for their outpatient clinics. One area hospital does utilize them but they can't keep RN's there because it has made their workload too much. They must run around trying to reasses the LPN's patients, give her IVP meds, and do blood transfusions. I have seen both sides of the fence...what the nurse you responded to describes IS indeed a reality in many parts of the US. Across the US many hospitals have strarted to phase out LPN's. Do I agree? No! It is a reality even though it may not be at your door step yet. While it is a poor use of resources sometimes...it is also a reality for many RN's of added work and resposibility.
Karen

I am well paid as an LPN but I work really really hard and have lots of responsibility. I do not expect to make an RN salary because I do rely on my supervisor, an RN when in doubt. I don't go running to her with every little thing but she is paid to be there for us. There are some signs that LPNs may be on the way out but I will deal with it when and if it happens. Right now, I Know I could not handle work and going back to school. I do not feel demeaned by not being considered qualified to do certain procedures. However, I am not in a facility where an RN has to recheck my work or give certain meds for me. Our RN supervisor does care plans and a lot of other paperwork whereas we, the LPN's work the med carts and do direct patient care. If LPNs are phased out, I will probably go to some other line of work. I love being a nurse but it is like the hardest job imaginable a lot of the time.

Mandylpn · Apr 12, 2005

OMG, enough already, please I vote to close the thread also. :eek:

Nurse Ratched, RN · Apr 12, 2005

Shocking not that an LPN versus RN thread went bad, but that it took a year for it to happen. Thread closed. I think we're arguing this one elsewhere :).