Drug Abuse/Nurses/Kristi

Nurses Recovery

Published

I tried posting a reply directly to your post, but when I typed in my ID, etc., it just flipped me back to your topic, and didn't let me post, so I started a new topic, but on the SAME topic. I can't help you as far as journal articles, but I am very interested in the topic. It seems like when we have these incidents of substance impaired nurses in our facility, they always try to keep it quiet, so we're never sure what happens to these people. Some get fired, some go to treatment and get rehired on certain conditions, some resign and show up at other facilities eventually, and some ya just don't know what happens. I personally have no tolerance for these folks. When they start talking that jive about their "recovery" and their "disease" I tune out. I feel it's a betrayal of their co-workers, their facility reputation, their family, friends, and esp themselves. I have seen so many go through treatmant after treatment, nurses included, and they just aren't motivated. I have a "loaded weapon theory" that I bet would motivate them quick! But since our society takes such a liberal approach to addicts/alcoholics, plus there's MONEY TO BE MADE since it's a DISEASE, why would they be motivated? After all, they're DISABLED, right??? OK, I've told you what I think, so go ahead everyone and lay it on me! This is just my opinion, but I would give anyone one chance to clean up their act, then it's out the door Lulu! It costs all of us, and I for one am tired of paying!

i just read your post i have been in recovery for 4 years and have been working for 2 years i became addicted during the care i received during a hosp. stay from an M.I. we do recover the constrihts from the P.A.P. in n.y. are strict bt the support is great i used my pain meds for 3 ,omths before i realized it was a problem i have never had a drink so or been around people who had substance abuse prblems i wonder with you remarks if you ever take a drink to "just relax" if so you have the potential to be an abuser of substances there are thousands of people in recovery who do very well and then are people in recovery who relapse but under no circumstances does that mean they can not try again i stayed out iof work for 15 months to deal with all those old ghost from the past and the present at the tie to make sure i would not succumb again and by the grace of god i have not i wonder if you look at your patients that are chemically dependent and think i would never do this let me tell you never say never because you could fall just like anyone else

no one is beyond falling from grace not even you a nurse is compassionate no matter what the dx. is are you?

The State Board of Nursing in South Carolina added to the RN Licensure fee (either $7 or $12-can't remember-last Nov. seems so long ago and it really didn't matter how much was added there was no choice) to help addicted nurses. I hope when the application comes for 2001 they include how many have been helped.

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Paula

Hi Paula. How do you feel about this practice? I don't know what if any portion of our state's fee goes to treatment for impaired nurses. One case I am familiar with, the nurse was responsible for the cost of treatment, or at least what the insurance didn't pick up. Also, there was no real enforcement of the restrictions that I could tell. It may make a difference as to how one is treated if they admit they're impaired and ask the state for help, then if they're caught and then forced into treatment. To nurse46, I had a little trouble following your post, but your situation sounds unusual in that people don't as a rule become addicted through the use of pain meds during hospitalization. I agree that as humans, we all have the potential to become addicted to one thing or another. Do you think a person can choose to become addicted to a healthy lifestyle as well as unhealthy? To answer your question, I treat my chemically impaired patients, and all my patients, with respect, unless they are very disrespectful, in which case, I get in and get out and spend as few heartbeats as possible.

Bunky, Does progressing from CAD to Acute MI to cardiac arrest require a psychiatric diagnosis from you. I am a recovering alcoholic. However, I got out of treatment on friday and started college on a monday. This was in 1993. By the Grace of GOD and the help of a 12 step program, I have not had a desire to drink or drug since. This was July 24, 1993. I don't see how you can be a compassionate nurse with all of your biases (or ignorance) whichever the caase may be. Alcoholism is a disease. It is usually familial in nature, like a lot of the diseases. If I were you, I would exam my on family tree before I started shaking everyone elses. I had much rather be a recovering alcoholic, than an unrecoverable dumb@#$.

Originally posted by bunky:

But whatever your reason for using, you knew when you took the demerol that it was against all the rules of nursing. Do you think that a prexisting mental illness caused you to do it? A lot of people toked up in highschool, but it doesn't mean that they went on to cocaine. This is the part I am trying to understand. Was there a prexisting condition in you that caused you to escalate your useage? In time it takes more and more to catch a buzz, and I understand that, but the escalation from pot to coke, to demerol and morphine seems to suggest more a psych issue.

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ADJ

Excuse me? I think it's YOU who has the bias! Or maybe YOU are just ignorant or your gene pool is too shallow to allow you to understand how anyone can view something differently than your limited insight allows. I am uncertain why I should be the object of your rantings, when all I am trying to understand is WHY. How on earth does that somehow make ME uncompassionate? I'd rather ask why and look for alternative reasons than to be like YOU and grow arrogant and rude!

[This message has been edited by bunky (edited July 17, 2000).]

Dearest Bunky, thanks for taking the heat off me for awhile! I'll just sit here in the shade, with an iced cup of Tim Horton's and enjoy my vacation! I can dig it!

PPL you dog! Enjoy the Tim's and the R&R!

ESDRN, no where have I professed to being an expert on the subject. I have however done a bit of reading, and in reference to my own family tree? I did in fact take a close look at it, and acknowledge that there is at least one alcoholic hiding in it's branches, which is why I don't feel bad if I've shaken someone else's. I am NOT pointing fingers of blame, so relax.

My idea of there being an underlying psychological problem is hardly ground breaking thinking either! I wonder about the nature vs nurture component to it. And alcoholism is listed in the DSM. As for familial tendencies, I am at risk, and me being forewarned of this risk, I rarely drink, which is a personal choice. Don't get on your bandwagon over this statement. I congratulate you for your achievements, but what I was trying to understand is if there was something going on before alcohol became involved? Is there an underlying personality that makes one more susceptible to begin with? The bit of reading I have done says that yes, in fact that may be a factor! Looking again at my family tree, oh yes, I can see how this idea may bare fruit. No pun intended. The person in question was sexually abused as a child. Did alcohol become an ineffective coping mechanism much later in life? In this case, yes, I think it did. Did you think I pulled all of this stuff out of a hat and decided to post it just to ridicule YOU?!

Go ahead and respond, but don't single me out as your whipping post here. Think about me as a family member of an alcoholic, and afford me a tiny smidge of credibility, understanding and respect from THAT view point!

Bunky, My deepest aplolgies to you. As you might have figured out, one of my character defects is becoming defensive when it is not necessary. Again, I APOLIGIZE arrogance and rudeness. You have made several good points in your postings. I agree, that there is underlying factors which could enhance one's potential for becoming alcoholic. On the other hand, I also believe that there are a lot of alcoholics who have never taken a drink. Yet, given the opportunity or the "reaon" to drink, they would become a practicing alcoholic. Yes, I also believe that a lot of alcoholics start using as an in effective means of coping (or as a means of excape). I didn't suffer anysexual abuse but I did come from a dysfunctional family with several alcoholics hanging on the tree branches. Also, my family divorced when I was 11 years old. I don't blame my alcoholism on this factor though. Although it did create more opportunities to drink without consequences. Yet, I look around and alcoholism doesn't discriminate. I t does not care who you are or what you have (rich or poor, black or white, male or female) can and do become alcoholics. The causes and reasons for one becoming (or being born) an alcoholic could go on for infinity. I will say this; after drinking for may years (20) I had lost my self-respect, my pride, had became depressed and even contemplated suicide (being chicken#*$#) stopped this thought. So I did have numerous psych problems which were related to alcoholism, yet these were after the fact. However, to be quite honest, I never did feel like I fit in anywhere, even as a child. So I would have to agree that there is some type of psychiatric issues but the list is probably infinite just like the reasons and causes. Again I didn't mean to lash out at you and if there is anyway I can help you in regards to this subject; PLEASE FEEL FREE TO ASK! I will answer questions honestly and to the best of my ability.

Originally posted by bunky:

PPL you dog! Enjoy the Tim's and the R&R!

ESDRN, no where have I professed to being an expert on the subject. I have however done a bit of reading, and in reference to my own family tree? I did in fact take a close look at it, and acknowledge that there is at least one alcoholic hiding in it's branches, which is why I don't feel bad if I've shaken someone else's. I am NOT pointing fingers of blame, so relax.

My idea of there being an underlying psychological problem is hardly ground breaking thinking either! I wonder about the nature vs nurture component to it. And alcoholism is listed in the DSM. As for familial tendencies, I am at risk, and me being forewarned of this risk, I rarely drink, which is a personal choice. Don't get on your bandwagon over this statement. I congratulate you for your achievements, but what I was trying to understand is if there was something going on before alcohol became involved? Is there an underlying personality that makes one more susceptible to begin with? The bit of reading I have done says that yes, in fact that may be a factor! Looking again at my family tree, oh yes, I can see how this idea may bare fruit. No pun intended. The person in question was sexually abused as a child. Did alcohol become an ineffective coping mechanism much later in life? In this case, yes, I think it did. Did you think I pulled all of this stuff out of a hat and decided to post it just to ridicule YOU?!

Go ahead and respond, but don't single me out as your whipping post here. Think about me as a family member of an alcoholic, and afford me a tiny smidge of credibility, understanding and respect from THAT view point!

Bunky, I will not get into a shouting match with you in regards to a subject that you evidently know nothing about. However, I will make a suggestion, that is if you are really interested in learning. I suggest that you do some critique reviews of research that have already been performed on this issue. Better yet, I suggest that you maybe conduct your own experimental research on the subject. Find out for yourself.

Originally posted by bunky:

Excuse me? I think it's YOU who has the bias! Or maybe YOU are just ignorant or your gene pool is too shallow to allow you to understand how anyone can view something differently than your limited insight allows. I am uncertain why I should be the object of your rantings, when all I am trying to understand is WHY. How on earth does that somehow make ME uncompassionate? I'd rather ask why and look for alternative reasons than to be like YOU and grow arrogant and rude!

[This message has been edited by bunky (edited July 17, 2000).]

Thank you esdrn! I didn't tell you that for pity, just to let you know that I wasn't a dumb#$$ entirely, but I thank you most sincerely for seeing what I was getting at and where I am coming from on this. I guess that one of the things about alcoholism and drug abuse that puzzles me is why some are able to recognize that it has the potential to become a problem for them and stop, and others can't, no matter what it's done to them and their loved ones. How does it escalate in some and not in others? Alcoholism, I can understand a bit more than drug abuse as it's the same drug just larger quantities needed over time. What I don't understand about the drug abuse issue is how one can go from pot at home to Demerol at work? These are two entirely different substances that act entirely different chemically in the body, both addictive, grant you, but why does it escalate to a totally different drug? Any thoughts on that anyone?

My thoughts on why one esculates from pot at home to demerol at work is this:Think of it like this-when I initially began drinking at age 13, it didn't take much to get me drunk. However, as the tolerance built up it began to take more and more to obtain the disired effect. This is the same way I believe with drugs. The drug which they are currently on has either stopped producing the effect they received initially and thus they progress to more potent drugs to obtain the effct. Also, they may have been out of their "pot" one day and dicided to try demerol at work. If they were already addicts, then this just set the ball in motion. On the other hand they may have been using more than pot initially; such as illicit drug use. but the best theory I have is that the drug they were taking has stopped producing the desired effect and thus as an addict new drugs are tried and tried and tried. Hope this helps.

Originally posted by bunky:

Thank you esdrn! I didn't tell you that for pity, just to let you know that I wasn't a dumb#$$ entirely, but I thank you most sincerely for seeing what I was getting at and where I am coming from on this. I guess that one of the things about alcoholism and drug abuse that puzzles me is why some are able to recognize that it has the potential to become a problem for them and stop, and others can't, no matter what it's done to them and their loved ones. How does it escalate in some and not in others? Alcoholism, I can understand a bit more than drug abuse as it's the same drug just larger quantities needed over time. What I don't understand about the drug abuse issue is how one can go from pot at home to Demerol at work? These are two entirely different substances that act entirely different chemically in the body, both addictive, grant you, but why does it escalate to a totally different drug? Any thoughts on that anyone?

OK ESDRN, here's a test of our tentative new found understanding. What do you think should happen if an RN gets caught drunk on the job, or stealing from the narcotic box?

I worked in a small community (only one hospital)where a local boy(turned God like Doctor), in the communities eyes,walked on water, specializing in OB, NOT an actual OB/GYN, but specialized GP. He got busted very publically by the FDA for stealing narcotics and he and his wife were both addicted, and both left the state to go to rehab. Of course he lost hospital privelages, and his license was yanked for a time. He came back, resumed his clinic, and was once again busted by the FDA, and rumor had it that they even found a heplock in his ankle! A year went by and now he not only has his practice back but he was just given his hospital privelages back! I feel this was insane! I don't think he should have had a license after the second drug bust. The amazing thing is that these women still flock to him to deliver their babies. What do you think of that?

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