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| No. 30 | 
Dec 04, 2006, 05:35 PM
 Re: Circulators Originally Posted by CSTCFA  So what you are saying is only a nurse can check lab values, consents, orders ect. This is a way for nurses to justify there numbers in the OR. I dont want to slam nurses either but come on. Im not saying nurses shouldnt be in the OR. What would a tech do for a conscience sedation case, or a code? Nurses are needed in the OR just not in large numbers. By the way if the Tech school you went to didnt teach basic ekg or labs then shame on that school and the student.
Yes, they can *check* the lab values, consents, orders, etc..... but without the knowledge of a nurse, what can they do with that information? And if the consent is wrong, for example, and the procedure is done, is a tech legally responsible, like an RN would be? ....No, they are not. I am not saying that to be an RN in the OR you do these highly complex things that nobody else can do, but what I am saying is that there are legalities. You can delegate to someone, for example, on the floor a cna can take your vitals, do your I&o's, but they cant sign the chart that this was done. A *licensed* person needs to do this. Same with the OR. Something simple like "checking a consent" has big implications, and nurses are taught to advocate for the patient. Techs, valuable as they are, are not taught that. It is not their scope of practice. All OR's need a RN circulator.
 | | Advertisement Sponsored Links | | | | No. 31 |
Dec 04, 2006, 05:43 PM
Re: Circulators Originally Posted by CSTCFA Well then we know, someone who is OJT is not A CST!
NO. I work with a tech, who, 12 years ago, became a tech, with ojt. Just recently, she took the exam that certifies her. Now , she is a bonafied *C*ST.....
| | No. 32 |
Dec 04, 2006, 05:44 PM
Updated
Dec 05, 2006 at 08:22 AM by ewattsjt
Re: Circulators Yes, there are on the job techs but there are not any on the job CSTs. One has to graduate a school accredited by the CAAHEP or ABHES. This is the only way someone within the last 10 years can sit for the National Board of Surgical Technologists and Surgical Assistants (formerly the LCC-ST) certification. This is one of the reasons that the AST is pushing for legislation for licensure of the CST. It would mandate the certification and hospitals would not be able to train or use on the job trained techs.
There is an area where techs pre ???? (I am not for sure of the exact date) can sit because of grandfather clause. One would have to have been a tech for at least 10 years, maybe more. Anyone that is within 10 years has to be from a CAAHEP or ABHES accredited program.
| | No. 33 |
Dec 04, 2006, 05:53 PM
Re: Circulators
Do any CST or ST bulletin boards exist on the net?
| | No. 34 |
Dec 04, 2006, 05:54 PM
Updated
Dec 05, 2006 at 08:58 AM by ewattsjt
Re: Circulators
By the way ortess1971, my comment about the education, etc... was aimed more toward attitudes like that of ORJUNKIE on page one. It is a general attitude that is seen in most ORs nation wide. I was just becoming familar with the posting design and has not found the quote button when I first posted.
Just some added info, not only is the training 9 month diploma to 2 years Associates (kind of like nursing LPN, LVN, ASN) but the exam is difficult. Here is the results of the previous year: In 2005, 3,762 candidates attempted the NBSTSA’s national certification exam for surgical technologists. Of these, 2,475 passed and 1,287 failed. Pass rate: 66%
I worked hard for my certification. It took me 2 years and a drive of 1 hour away for my core classes and clinical site. I "worked for free" during my training in clinical.
As I said before, I am returning to school to become a nurse. Getting back to the topic, CSTs do not have proper training to be the sole circulator. There has to be an RN. While a tech could be trained on lab values, etc... they are not currently trained and most states do not allow them to do things such as start an IV. Because of this, most programs do not teach it. This goes with scope of practice issues.
Some facilities use the charge as the RN that the CSTs are circulating under but the problem with this is patient safety. What happens when the is a code in two rooms at the same time or one room needs a blood transfusion stat and a code proceeds in another room. Tooooo much room for error. As a patient advocate I can not go along with this type of practice.
| | No. 35 |
Dec 04, 2006, 06:01 PM
Updated
Dec 04, 2006 at 06:13 PM by ewattsjt
Re: Circulators Originally Posted by RNOTODAY Do any CST or ST bulletin boards exist on the net?
Yes they do.
| | No. 36 |
Dec 05, 2006, 09:04 AM
Re: Circulators
This is off the main topic again but within the general posts. Have you ever noticed that there is a general concensus among techs that they have to become defensive about their education and role in surgery? Although you personally may not have made them feel that way, they did not come out of school with that attitude!
| | No. 37 |
Dec 05, 2006, 12:42 PM
Re: Circulators Originally Posted by RNOTODAY NO. I work with a tech, who, 12 years ago, became a tech, with ojt. Just recently, she took the exam that certifies her. Now , she is a bonafied *C*ST.....
This might help this argument. NBSTSA - LCC-ST – Certification in Surgical Assisting
OJT personell can take an exam, but they cannot label themselves CST..YOU must go to an accredited program to get that tagline.
I am a retired Navy corpsman 20 yrs active duty and 15 yrs as certified surgical tech.
I've been on both side of the coin here, I've circulated many, many case in my days, and yes a tech with the right training can circulate cases.
Techs can find out lab values and can even understand them, and act if the values are not in the normal ranges/values. Thats easy with the right training. Really how many people NURSES or techs can go to an O.R. without some type of training.
Nurses are valuable in the O.R. not all want to scrub, and not all tech want to circulate. I've known many really bad techs, and many really great techs, and the same goes for nurses.
Truly what it all boils down to is the root of all evil...MONEY. Techs believe they should be making more money. IMHO
Both professions are unique. A nursing job in the O.R. is stressful and the tech is right ther with HER/HIM. I believe the nurses job in the O.R. is more stressful, with all the paperwork and limb holding, scrub prepping, running around ,suture finding, instrument flashing....I CAN GO ON FOREVER.
We all value our professions, and want to stick up for what we do.
I'll bet even a ditch digger can say their job is more important, because without ditch diggers their would be no foundations laid for any hospitals, and without hospitals, this makes us UNEMPLOYED..
rant over.
| | No. 38 |
Dec 05, 2006, 12:48 PM
Re: Circulators Originally Posted by SOCALDAN This might help this argument. NBSTSA - LCC-ST – Certification in Surgical Assisting
OJT personell can take an exam, but they cannot label themselves CST..YOU must go to an accredited program to get that tagline.
I am a retired Navy corpsman 20 yrs active duty and 15 yrs as certified surgical tech.
I've been on both side of the coin here, I've circulated many, many case in my days, and yes a tech with the right training can circulate cases.
Techs can find out lab values and can even understand them, and act if the values are not in the normal ranges/values. Thats easy with the right training. Really how many people NURSES or techs can go to an O.R. without some type of training.
Nurses are valuable in the O.R. not all want to scrub, and not all tech want to circulate. I've known many really bad techs, and many really great techs, and the same goes for nurses.
Truly what it all boils down to is the root of all evil...MONEY. Techs believe they should be making more money. IMHO
Both professions are unique. A nursing job in the O.R. is stressful and the tech is right ther with HER/HIM. I believe the nurses job in the O.R. is more stressful, with all the paperwork and limb holding, scrub prepping, running around ,suture finding, instrument flashing....I CAN GO ON FOREVER.
We all value our professions, and want to stick up for what we do.
I'll bet even a ditch digger can say their job is more important, because without ditch diggers their would be no foundations laid for any hospitals, and without hospitals, this makes us UNEMPLOYED..
rant over.
Great first post Dan.
As a Certified Surgical Tech, instructor and future nurse, I am proud of both professions.
Nurses and techs will always have to work side-by-side to assure sucessful surgical outcomes.
| | No. 39 |
Dec 05, 2006, 03:23 PM
Re: Circulators
Thanks, I too am currently teaching in the private post secondary education system. I think my O.R. years are truly behind me... Teaching is a great way to stay employed and to mould the future of WHAT SHOULD BE in the surg tech profession.
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