The Circumcision Discussion - page 59

I know this can be a HUGE debate, and I'm not looking to start any arguments. I was just wondering as you are OB nurses. I'm expecting a boy in July and not sure if we should circ. or not. My... Read More

  1. by   GilaRRT
    Uhhhh, ok. The only difference I noticed between my self and my uncircumcised friends were a few ant eater jokes in the high school locker room.

    Yeah, I have seen an occasional case of phimosis/paraphimosis and people throw stats around about circ vs. uncirc and STD's, cancer, and UTI risks.
  2. by   sirI
    Posts # 413 - 415 merged with existing thread to maintain continuity.
  3. by   cursenurse
    Quote from secretspectrum
    As nurses, we have tremendous collective power and influence in the medical field. Every interaction we have affects the outcomes of patient's lives. While nurses do not take the Hippocratic oath, since we are working "under" doctors it applies to us too. I urge you to think deeply about the issue of circumcision and whether you think forced cosmetic surgery should continue to be inflicted on infants, often without anesthesia. Is this a true commitment to "First do no harm"? Please join other nurses in being conscientious objectors to this brutal practice.
    http://nurses.cirp.org/ Was begun by a group of nurses from Santa Fe, New Mexico. There are many other organizations such as http://nocirc.org/ that seek to preserve human rights. Isn't it logical that each person's body belongs to that person? There is legislation currently waiting for sponsership that would make the female genital mutilation act of 1996 gender neutral so that boys will experience the same protections as girls. http://www.mgmbill.org/usmgmbill.htm You can help by writing to your elected officials-congresspeople, president, governor. This cultural practice can only be stopped one person at a time, by practicing the golden rule. Nurses, please nurture and protect the babies in your care, and refuse to take part in this unethical practice any more.
    First off, I have never taken the Hippocratic oath, and nurses do not work "under" doctors. We work with doctors but they do not regulate nurses. Secondly, what is it about male circumcision that you have such a problem with? I'm sure that it is painful at the time, but are there any long lasting problems? Isn't it considered to be a hygiene issue also?

    Male circumcision cannot even be compared to female genital mutilation. For those women, there is no valid reason for those procedures. I find your argument that parents of infants have the right to determine what is done medically to their babies to be flawed. Infants do not have the capacity to decide what they want done- if we were so concerned with what a baby, or even older child wanted in respect to painful or unpleasant things, a kid would never get blood drawn, an immunization, or thorough exam for that matter. I'm sure that people will always disagree with what age a person can make that kind of decision, but it surely is not as an infant. Parents are entitled to raise their children as they see fit (w/in the confines of the law) and we should not push our personal feelings on them.

    For many, circumcision is part of their religious practices, and since you brought the Bible into this by urging nurses to follow the golden rule, let us please not forget that circumcision is mentioned many times in the Bible as being a necessary procedure.

    I think that it would be more beneficial to promote use of analgesics with circumcision.
  4. by   secretspectrum
    Also, the original poster of another thread said that after watching a circumcision she was "glad she was born a female." The sad truth is that she is lucky she was born a female in a country that doesn't practice genital mutilation on it's girls as well as it's boys.

    Compare these statements from http://www.fgmnetwork.org/intro/mgmfgm.php
    regarding cultural beliefs that perpetuate this continued unethical practice in both males and females.
    Female:
    "She loses only a little piece of the clitoris, just the part that protrudes. The girl does not miss it. She can still feel, after all. There is hardly any pain. Women's pain thresholds are so much higher than men's."

    "Female circumcision protects the health of a woman. Infibulation prevents the uterus from falling out [uterine prolapse]. It keeps her smelling so sweet that her husband will be pleased. If it is not done, she will stink and get worms in her vagina."

    Male
    "An uncircumcised penis causes urinary infections and penile cancer. It generates smegma and smegma stinks. A circumcised penis is more hygienic and oral sex with an uncircumcised penis is disgusting to women."
    "It's only a little piece of skin. The baby does not feel any pain because his nervous system is not developed yet."

    Watch a video of a circumcision being done: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIRANs0eXwI

    Look at pictures of female "circumcision"
    http://www.geocities.com/restoremain...m/fgm_pics.htm

    What is cruel to little girls, is also cruel to little boys. 140 million women worldwide have been mutilated.
    Last edit by sirI on Jul 8, '08 : Reason: threads merged
  5. by   Spidey's mom
    Quote from cursenurse
    first off, i have never taken the hippocratic oath, and nurses do not work "under" doctors. we work with doctors but they do not regulate nurses. secondly, what is it about male circumcision that you have such a problem with? i'm sure that it is painful at the time, but are there any long lasting problems? isn't it considered to be a hygiene issue also?

    male circumcision cannot even be compared to female genital mutilation. for those women, there is no valid reason for those procedures. i find your argument that parents of infants have the right to determine what is done medically to their babies to be flawed. infants do not have the capacity to decide what they want done- if we were so concerned with what a baby, or even older child wanted in respect to painful or unpleasant things, a kid would never get blood drawn, an immunization, or thorough exam for that matter. i'm sure that people will always disagree with what age a person can make that kind of decision, but it surely is not as an infant. parents are entitled to raise their children as they see fit (w/in the confines of the law) and we should not push our personal feelings on them.

    for many, circumcision is part of their religious practices, and since you brought the bible into this by urging nurses to follow the golden rule, let us please not forget that circumcision is mentioned many times in the bible as being a necessary procedure.

    i think that it would be more beneficial to promote use of analgesics with circumcision.


  6. by   Atheos
    No pain meds = Cruel and Unusual punishment. Just ask ANY man.

  7. by   KT-Jay731
    I asked a ped about pain control after the procedure when watching a circ last week (new RN, new to the floor). I knew from school that generally they get "sweetums" during the procedure but that's about it.
    The doc's reply?
    "They don't usually complain too much so we don't medicate." Um, yeah...

    Parents flip out when I give a Vitamin K shot and their baby cries but they have no issues when I wheel their baby out for a circ. I don't understand.
  8. by   GilaRRT
    Really strange, every circ I have seen had the patient premedicated with EMLA. Then again, I am not a baby nurse. I cannot say but suspect it is painful.
  9. by   Spidey's mom
    Quote from GilaRN
    Really strange, every circ I have seen had the patient premedicated with EMLA. Then again, I am not a baby nurse. I cannot say but suspect it is painful.
    We use a lidocaine injection . . .however there is one doc who refuses to use it due to a supposed rare occurance where a child lost his penis from the injection . . . . don't ask me how.


    steph
  10. by   GilaRRT
    I know how, somebody forgot the whole "no lido with epinephrine" in fingers, nose, penis toes."
  11. by   ElvishDNP
    Quote from cursenurse
    Isn't it considered to be a hygiene issue also?
    Not really. Intact penises are not any harder to care for than circed penises. It's just that in this country, we have little to no experience in caring for them and the thought of it freaks so many of us out....so we don't do ANYTHING, and that is where problems start.

    Most of the rest of the world does just fine with their intact penis.

    How in the world did this thread get resurrected???
  12. by   Spidey's mom
    Quote from Elvish
    Not really. Intact penises are not any harder to care for than circed penises. It's just that in this country, we have little to no experience in caring for them and the thought of it freaks so many of us out....so we don't do ANYTHING, and that is where problems start.

    Most of the rest of the world does just fine with their intact penis.

    How in the world did this thread get resurrected???
    Someone with an agenda and website has resurrected two circ threads. See "secretspectrum".

    steph
  13. by   GilaRRT
    Well, you can find research that supports the hygiene argument all day long. IMHO, I don't really care. No much of an issue with me. I cannot say I am any worse off without a foreskin nor can I say any of my uncirced friends are better or worse off. A crap shoot either way if you want to argue to circ or not to circ.

    Well, I did not want anybody calling me an ant eater in high school, so I guess there is 1 point in favor of circing.

    Actually, somebody started a new thread today and it was merged with an old thread.
    Last edit by GilaRRT on Jul 8, '08 : Reason: "iene"

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