Importing Foreign-trained nurses

Peeps Mcarthur · Nov 13, 2001

Shandi,

"Racist"? You want to call me a racist?.........That is the first word out of the mouth of the ignorant. Make a point will you?

Do you know what color my skin is?

Retract your statement.That is if you want to do anything more than just hurl insults.

Peeps Mcarthur · Nov 13, 2001

Shandi?

Your mother doesn't appear to have benefited from an exclusionary taxpayer-sponsored-bill.

specificaly I'm commenting about something called "reverse discrimination"

Let me give you an example........................In my class of about 40 students there's a person who comes to class late, and leaves early.takes tests whenever she feels like it(usually after the other students have thiers graded and handed back), takes phone calls on her cellphone.......during class! . The "tests" that she takes are administered in an unsupervised study hall, in other words, what you would call "open book".

Do you know why this person can get away with this obscene behavior, and get an "A" while doing it? Because to call someone a racist is sooooo easy. It is also the most damaging "guilty until proven innocent" thing you can say about anyone or any institution.

You called me a racist because I don't want to PAY for someone to come from another country and fill up the job market, when people like your mother WORKED thier way into the job market. YOU would be a racist then, wouldn't you? You are judging the people that made your mother qualify based on thier RACE aren't you? It doesn't sound like you based it on some standards or laws.

Before you start banging away on your "R" key let me give you an exercise:

Imagine that the authorities in the country you were applying for citizenship were the same race, just a different country with a specific set of laws. No action or sanctions taken by them could be seen as racism, could they? Then on that basis you cannot judge intent without judging race only. That would make your statements......................What then.

I have no further questions Your Honor.

The witness my step down.

Brad

Columbia, MD

NurseDennie, BSN, RN · Nov 13, 2001

Shandi -

First point, I was not insinuating that because you're not a nurse, you don't "see things." However, you don't see things as a nurse does. And you are posting to a NURSING forum, of which the focus has been what is good for NURSING in the United States.

I disagreed with you that the post criticized nurses from other countries and put minorities "in the same boat." Why do you assume that people from other countries are necessarily minorities, or that he assumes they are? The point I got from the post was this: As long as someone is available and willing to step in and fill in whenever a nurse makes a stand for better pay, better working conditions -- perhaps even accepting less pay and poorer conditions -- then the people in charge will not be required to address the problems at all.

It seems like your anger about something other than this thread is making it difficult for you to follow it. It seems like you're just venting, not actually responding to posts. Also the fact that you seemed to feel the need to attack me personally saying, "If you sometimes looked around at 'world' news," accusing me of being uniformed makes it seem like you've merely found a place to "Flame" rather than having a point to make.

Every country has requirements for testing for professionals trained in other countries. There's no alternative to that. Take a deep breath, take a nice drink of cool water, look at a sunset, do something to make yourself feel better because this kind of posting isn't going to do it for you.

Love

Dennie

rjlrn95 · Nov 13, 2001

First of all to Shandi I say: You need to reread Peeps first post. He was explaining the legislation, and its language, that is before the governing bodies. He was not, as I read it, being racist. The racists in the crowd may be whomever wrote the bill; gee, would that be a surpise??

Secondly, to Peeps I say: Bravo, and Thank you for the grasp you have of the "legaleze" (sp?) the gov puts in front of us.

There are two sides to everything--we have to hang together and reach that middle ground to make our work environment and our pt's environment better.

Peeps Mcarthur · Nov 14, 2001

Nursedennie,Rjlrn95,

Thank you for reading my post so thoughtfuly.

Yes, you have both grapsed the thoughts that I was sharing.

Shandi,

I think a public retraction is in order.

Now, let's all get on with this post. The subject has merit and it was a good idea for a post, so lets support it if you have any more input.

I will be happy to deal with any flamers personaly. We shouldn't be intimidated to express our views...................that's what this forum is for!!!

[email protected] · Nov 14, 2001

I worked with forgein nurses. they kept wages down. took all did the overtime, did not care to improve nursing in my state. and set nursing back 2o years with how they kissed &@@ to the doc's. they accecpt horrible working conditions. then they go home with the money they made and open up a business. so... im doing policy paper for Leadership and would appreciate any opinions. or sources..

fergus51 · Nov 14, 2001

tchachakis, the problem is a lack of organisation among nurses. I know in the States the hospital a mile away might be completely different from yours so they get away with hiring foreign nurses and keeping pay low. We are in a provincial union here so our wages are the same and set by our contract. A nurse can not be paid less than another nurse of the same experience level regardless of whether she is foreign or not.

yana94 · Nov 14, 2001

Hi! I am also a Filipina Nurse and had been recruited by a hospital in california. It's true that we are being offered free exams (CGFSN,NCLEX,TSE & TOEFL) plus housing for the first three months.

However, the present nursing trend in our country has already changed compared to the 1980's and 1990's. Enrollment in the nursing school has not increased tremendously. I guess for the reason that the younger generation would like to learn and work more on the I.T. side.

P.S. Even the hospitals here are having rapid turn overs of nurses because of so many reasons.

shandi · Nov 14, 2001

I was duly told that I have no business being on this forum, maybe that's true, Mr McArthurs reply expects me to give a public retraction. I think you will have to wait. It's really great that everybody else read it differently, I guess I read it from a different standpoint, I stand by it , too, no amount of bashing me and telling me what I don't know as a nurse will sway me. Venting, a little maybe, everybody interprets things in their own way. What was said smelled of bias. However, when I put forward the immensely racist experiences my mother, WHO IS A NURSE!!!, went through, that's just water under the bridge right? Of course, because she was foriegn, she had no say, nothing was given to her for free, in fact things were made as difficult as possible. But, never mind that, my point in bringing up my mother, who is a nurse and has been for a long, long long time, is that I think that in all this hoopla of the government's decisions things have to worked out fairly. The foreign nurses have no-one to complain to, have no-one to turn to because people say "Go back to your on country". Well, like the solution I gave before, close the borders and be done with it, and then the nurses here will get all they need. Sorry, no public retraction from me, try someone else.

shandi · Nov 14, 2001

Weelllllllll, Mom says.............just let them be. She told me she's gotten over what she endured here, and since she never has to come back, why fret? I was going to follow in my mother's footsteps in becoming a nurse when I got out of high school (laugh). Of course I chose something else! Anyway to each his own, I really hope the nurses get what they're fighting for, just as everyone else at a job they don't like has to fight for fairness, I have one almighty huge problem with the bias (is that better than saying racist?) in this country. But anyway no matter what color you are you can still be a bigot, racist etc. just because you are of the same color as someone doesn't mean that you're excluded, that's how I understood it anyway. And if you're not any of those things, proudly proclaim it and be done with it. So let it wash away in the dirty bathwater and get on with fighting the good fight. So don't be so angry that I voiced my opinions, that I chose to address a part of someone reply and not the whole daggone thing, don't be mad that I dared come on this forum and post something when I am not a nurse. By the way I work at a publishing company that may not be totally nurse oriented but is connected, we deal with the nurses and administrators who work with the elderly, the administrators and carers of those in need of mental health and other medical related issues. Nurses who care for the elderly probably get a just as bad a deal as those in the hospital or practice setting, so even though I am not a nurse, everyday I get to hear both sides of the story and make my own decisions and opinions.

Peeps Mcarthur · Nov 14, 2001

Shandi,

What do you think of income tax funded immigration?

shandi · Nov 14, 2001

Of course, sir, it is not right and funnels money into areas that one can say do not deal with the interests of the host country. It goes on however, in a variety of cloaked forms and the swell is getting bigger against it. It's just that the American public would need to be educated on the fact and fiction. Did I pass the test?