Venting about BON involvement in DUI - pg.4 | allnurses

Venting about BON involvement in DUI - page 4

:banghead:I am writing this because I am irritated that in the nursing field if you receive a DUI during your off duty time it can (and usually will) seriously affect your career. I have a colleague... Read More

  1. Visit  sissiesmama profile page
    0
    Quote from Spidey's mom
    As others have already pointed out - this is not true. There are many careers where this directly effects your job. My husband has a commercial license in California and if he gets a DUI - BIG TROUBLE. You lose your license for awhile AND you cannot be insured. The DMV is also an agency that protects the public - like the BON.

    I too have lost a friend to a chronic drunk driver - back in the early 80's - when the laws against driving while intoxicated were pretty lax.

    It does show a lack of good judgment. Which does make people wonder about your nursing judgment.

    steph
    Thanks you, steph - I didn't think I was that far off base. My ex dh was a police officer, and I know some of his coworkers lost their job and benefits after getting popped for a DWI. Not sure for how long or if they got their jobs back if they got into recovery.

    Also, OTR truck drivers, firemen, anyone in the emergency medical profession, and there have to be more, I just can't really pull any more from my brain right now.

    Anne, RNC
  2. Visit  CrufflerJJ profile page
    0
    Quote from AirforceRN
    Most likely true but it doesn't really matter in the end does it? Do you think if you tell the judge that you didn't intend to run over the 5 year old that the vehicular manslaughter charge will go away? Good intentions don't negate the fact that you made a stupid decision, got caught and now have to pay the price.
    In the case of DUI, I accept your position. If you imbibe EtOH, you probably shouldn't be on the road. In a more "global" sense, I strongly disagree with ghillbert's statement "Breaking the law is not a "mistake" - it's a conscious choice."

    There are so many freakin' laws in our wonderful country - local (city/town/township), state, federal, that no reasonable person could be expected to be aware of them all. What is perfectly OK in one area is highly illegal in another adjacent jurisdiction. Go ahead - ask multiple cops if it's OK to do something...it might be OK in his/her minds, yet a blatant violation of "The Law" in the mind of another cop or prostituting attorney. All it takes is one a-hole to ruin your future.

    Break just one "law" out of ignorance, run into an "Officer Friendly" on a bad day, and your future is screwed. It's not all about DUI. It's about the "dark side" of our legal system.

    The police/legal system is NOT your friend.
  3. Visit  jackstem profile page
    0
    I agree there are numerous laws that many of us are unaware of. However, drinking and then driving is NOT one of those situations. With all the commercials dealing with drinking and driving as well as the seat belt laws, finding someone who doesn't get it is a pretty lame excuse.

    There is definitely a cognitive dissonance in the profession when it comes to this topic.

    Jack
  4. Visit  blondnursey profile page
    1
    wow.
    sometimes people make mistakes.
    should your job suffer FOREVER because of a screwup?
    nobody plans on getting a dui, ever.
    i think the states put enough requirements on the convicted

    no need for the bon to get involved, unless the nurse was drunk at work.
    maybe the bon will start keeping track of our diets,sexual activity and parenting skills too......

    and if you are saying that it shows poor judgement, yes it does, but what about nurses who show poor judgement in other areas of life? sexually promiscuous nurses? tobacco abuse?

    and no i am not saying that smoking is like killing a family in a van when you were drunk, its about poor judgement and poor choices.

    not everybody can have perfect judgement at all times.
    Last edit by blondnursey on Jun 9, '09 : Reason: more to say
    Code55 likes this.
  5. Visit  blondnursey profile page
    0
    Re: Impaired Nurses
    Originally Posted by woody62
    Nurses should be monitored for the rest of their professional life. I wonder why physicians are not subjected to the same rules? Since the 'pee' test is totally random, it is impossible to guess when your phone is going to ring and you have to go in. And hand over a sample.

    I have an idea. How about requiring every nurse, in every state, to submit to random testing in order to retain their license. That way, we can ensure that no impaired nurse ever has access to patients. Or even legal drugs.

    All in favor
    saw this in another post.
    sounds like a good idea to me.
  6. Visit  jackstem profile page
    3
    Quote from blondnursey
    wow.
    sometimes people make mistakes.
    should your job suffer FOREVER because of a screwup?
    nobody plans on getting a dui, ever.
    i think the states put enough requirements on the convicted

    no need for the bon to get involved, unless the nurse was drunk at work.
    maybe the bon will start keeping track of our diets,sexual activity and parenting skills too......

    and if you are saying that it shows poor judgement, yes it does, but what about nurses who show poor judgement in other areas of life? sexually promiscuous nurses? tobacco abuse?

    and no i am not saying that smoking is like killing a family in a van when you were drunk, its about poor judgement and poor choices.

    not everybody can have perfect judgement at all times.
    Ahhhhhh yes, "they made a mistakake, a poor choice, they didn't intend to get a DUI"

    The impaired nurse...the nurse with the disease of chemical dependence, the disease that alters the brain, results in obsession with a chemical, the compulsion to use that chemical no matter what happens in their life. Should they be punished forever for a disease they didn't ask for but unfortunately have?

    No...but they are. They are blackballed for the rest of their lives...by people who, theoretically, are educated in health sciences with a basic understanding of how the disease alters their brains physically and chemically. As a recovering addict, I understand that people who lack training and education in the sciences of health care "don't get it" when it comes to this complex psych-social-biological-spiritual disease. Yes, people make mistakes. Yes it's possible to get a DUI without having this disease. Should the early sign of a potentially chronic, progressive, ultimately fatal disease be ignored? No. Anyone driving under the influence of mood altering substances should be evaluated for substance abuse and chemical dependence, just as anyone with bloody stools should be scoped for the possibility of colon cancer.

    While someone with a single DUI may not be chemically dependent, it's a significant event that may be a sign of disease. And just like the person who receives a DUI shouldn't be labeled for the rest of their lives, neither should those with chemical dependence. It sucks to get a taste of the stigma and discrimination associated with a treatable disease. Maybe this can help turn the tide for those who need treatment. Substance abuse and chemical dependence, if not the number one public health issue in this country is a close second. Maybe if a few more "poor choices" and "mistakes" by those who aren't chemically dependent will change the way we deal with this disease. It's the only one I'm aware of where the person who has the disease needs to be punished before they receive (inadequate) treatment and then get blackballed for the rest of their life.

    Jack
    zofran, NeedchangeofPace, and Cherybaby like this.
  7. Visit  AirforceRN profile page
    1
    Quote from CrufflerJJ
    There are so many freakin' laws in our wonderful country - local (city/town/township), state, federal, that no reasonable person could be expected to be aware of them all.
    The police/legal system is NOT your friend.
    Come on...we aren't talking about obscure laws preventing gentleman from wearing a hat on the shady side of the street on the second Tuesday of every month. This is driving while intoxicated...its a pretty well known (if not well followed) law.
    Maybe 50 years ago ignorance could have been pleaded but not now, no matter how rural you are. If you can drive a car then you will know this law.
    Tessaprn likes this.
  8. Visit  MurseMikeD profile page
    0
    Quote from Nursing NCO
    1) Nursing seems to be the only job, outside of the military, where if you get a DUI in your off time it directly affects your career.

    2) ...it doesn't involve patient care/safety the BON should keep their #$%#ed nose out of nurses' business.

    3) And please spare me the "Morals" speech because it has nothing to do with morals.
    1) Other professions where a DUI can seriously affect your licensure/certification/employability include fire/rescue, EMS, law enforcement, public transportation operators, teachers, and the list goes on. Pretty much anyone with a responsibility for public safety and health, or children.

    2) It is a potential patient care/safety issue. Your coworker may very well be an excellent nurse, who has never and will never come to work intoxicated. But how is the Board of Nursing to know this?! That she was found to be driving under the influence indicates that she may have a problem with alcohol, which might extend to the workplace. The state has a responsibility to ensure, for the public's sake, that any given nurse is capable of providing safe and effective care. If they allowed a nurse with a DUI to continue practicing unquestioned and unencumbered, they would not be fulfilling that responsibility.

    Imposing restrictions on licensure and requiring monthly blood draws is simply to ensure that this isn't a patient care/safety issue. That's a far better alternative, for your coworker, to losing their license at the outset. Those actions are completely reasonable, and we as professionals have a vested interest in supporting them both to protect our patients and our profession's reputation.

    3) I will spare you the morals speech, because I think it's unneccessary. Your colleague made a mistake, one that the BON couldn't rightfully ignore, and unfortunately this is where it has led.
  9. Visit  blondnursey profile page
    2
    but when you get a dui and go to court (in my state), you get evaluated for alcoholism.
    if they find that you dont have a problem, why does the bon need to further test you?
    once you have satisfied the legal system, why should you be further punished by the bon?
    unless you come to work drunk, the bon shouldnt get involved.
    who know what they will decide to moniter next.



    ps
    you can do as much damage by coming to work with little to no sleep,
    how many times have night nurses been up all day but still went to work?
    vivacious1healer and morte like this.
  10. Visit  blondnursey profile page
    0
    Quote from AirforceRN
    Come on...we aren't talking about obscure laws preventing gentleman from wearing a hat on the shady side of the street on the second Tuesday of every month. This is driving while intoxicated...its a pretty well known (if not well followed) law.
    Maybe 50 years ago ignorance could have been pleaded but not now, no matter how rural you are. If you can drive a car then you will know this law.

    but unless i am driving a car as part of my nursing job, why should the bon get involved? i am not saying its ok, its just not the bons business imho.
    Last edit by blondnursey on Jun 10, '09 : Reason: more to say
  11. Visit  CrufflerJJ profile page
    0
    Quote from AirforceRN
    Come on...we aren't talking about obscure laws preventing gentleman from wearing a hat on the shady side of the street on the second Tuesday of every month. This is driving while intoxicated...its a pretty well known (if not well followed) law.
    Maybe 50 years ago ignorance could have been pleaded but not now, no matter how rural you are. If you can drive a car then you will know this law.
    I agreed with you earlier "In the case of DUI, I accept your position. If you imbibe EtOH, you probably shouldn't be on the road." Yes, DUI laws are pretty cut & dried.
    Last edit by CrufflerJJ on Jun 10, '09 : Reason: just for because I said so
  12. Visit  exnursie profile page
    4
    Quote from blondnursey
    but when you get a dui and go to court (in my state), you get evaluated for alcoholism.
    if they find that you dont have a problem, why does the bon need to further test you?
    once you have satisfied the legal system, why should you be further punished by the bon?
    unless you come to work drunk, the bon shouldnt get involved.
    who know what they will decide to moniter next.



    ps
    you can do as much damage by coming to work with little to no sleep,
    how many times have night nurses been up all day but still went to work?
    Anyone who drinks and drives is making a POOR decision and and risking not only their safety but the safety of anyone who happens to be on the same road as they are. This is enough reason for the BON to be concerned, and to take action.

    Each state BON provides specific lists of what they will investigate, and includes many situations, including any criminal activity, not paying student loans, not paying child support, not filing state taxes all which have nothing to do with pt safety but do involve personal responsibility, integrity and ( a favorite expression in many states) " matters of "moral turpitude".

    What many nurss fail to grasp is that they are held to certain standards that include more than just their time on the job. It was repeated over and over when I was a student, maybe this is not included in the present day nursing school curriculums??
    NRSKarenRN, Tessaprn, sissiesmama, and 1 other like this.
  13. Visit  MurseMikeD profile page
    2
    I just graduated with my BSN and they made it very clear, time and again, that we are professionals and as such are held to a higher standard of conduct.
    Tessaprn and sissiesmama like this.


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