Staff RN's earn more than Nurse Manager?!

  1. 1 Eventually I'd like to get my BSN and become a Nurse manager after working a few years. However, it seems as if Nurse mangers may at times earn less than the staff RN, due to the fact that Staff RN get overtime, etc, whereas Mangers are salaried. It doesn't seem fair and worth all the extra effort. I'd like to know, do staff RN's who work overtime, weekends, etc end up earning more than their Managers? I live in IL, by the way.
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  3. Visit  haitianrn} profile page

    About haitianrn

    Joined Apr '08; Posts: 59; Likes: 7.

    31 Comments so far...

  4. Visit  Ginger35} profile page
    1
    claudette,

    Please have a look at my thread on "resigned from nrs mgr position" in this forum. I don't think I mentioned pay on there ~but~ I know how much my staff RNs made compared to what I made.... Hourly, they made a h#!! of a lot more than I did (hourly) and they were not responsible for the floor 24 -7!!! At least not at this organization I worked for.

    However, I do think it depends on the unit you are on. If you are thinking about being a Med Surg manager - I say forget it!!! That job stinks!!! Go for the "specialty" areas.

    Just my
    Ginger
    madinurse likes this.
  5. Visit  llg} profile page
    6
    That's common in many professions, not just nursing. The lower levels of the managment positions are less than the highest levels of the staff. So the senior staff members don't even have to work off-shifts and/or overtime to earn money than their manager.

    It isn't unitl you get some experience as a manager and move up in the salary range that you earn more than most of your staff. It may take many, many years to earn more than those staff members at the top of the staff nurse range who are also earning exta money by earning differentials, overtime, etc.

    Many staff nurses don't realize that and think their manager is being lazy and unreasonable when he/she doesn't work extra hours to cover short staffing very often, etc. They imagine their managers earning big bucks for sitting around doing nothing. In fact, the manager may be earning less than many of their staff and receive NOTHING for working off-shifts, weekends, or overtime -- not even regular, straight pay.

    As a member of the staff development department (also salaried), I was once asked by a staff nurse on a Friday afternoon if I would come in on Saturday and cover a shift. I explained that if I did, I would receive NO PAY for the shift and asked her how many time she came in and worked a shift for free. She was a friend and this was a friendly conversation -- not as "snippy" as it might sound. She simply hadn't realized what she was asking me to do and that her expectation that the leadership team pick up shifts on the weekend was unreasonable.
    Last edit by llg on May 10, '08
    Gold_SJ, JeanettePNP, elkpark, and 3 others like this.
  6. Visit  Ginger35} profile page
    0
    llg,

    You hit it right on the head!!!
  7. Visit  RN1989} profile page
    1
    I had nurses that worked OT and made more than me. I also had nurses that did NOT work any OT and still made more than me. And this was both hourly and yearly accumulation.

    I suppose that if you had at the very least a Master's with some certifications and 20 yrs experience that you might come out ahead of your staff money wise.

    Unfortunately turnover among managers is high becuase of the poor treatment and stress so relatively few managers remain in a position for long term to boost their salary. It is much easier for a staff nurse to keep the same job for 20 yrs than it is a manager.
    showbizrn likes this.
  8. Visit  llg} profile page
    0
    Quote from RN1989
    I had nurses that worked OT and made more than me. I also had nurses that did NOT work any OT and still made more than me. And this was both hourly and yearly accumulation.

    I suppose that if you had at the very least a Master's with some certifications and 20 yrs experience that you might come out ahead of your staff money wise.

    Unfortunately turnover among managers is high becuase of the poor treatment and stress so relatively few managers remain in a position for long term to boost their salary. It is much easier for a staff nurse to keep the same job for 20 yrs than it is a manager.
    Definitely.
  9. Visit  Ginger35} profile page
    0
    I had 14 years expereince plus a MBA - the story is the same.....
  10. Visit  showbizrn} profile page
    0
    EXPERIENCED STAFF NURSES MAKE MORE $$$ THAN NURSE MANAGERS!!!

    If you're looking
    to make the big bucks
    Go for top level management positions
    (Associate/Assistant Director of Nursing/Dept Head, Director of Nursing).

    Or else you will burn out
    like so many
    Nurse Managers do.
  11. Visit  ICRN2008} profile page
    0
    I am now salary and make slightly less than I did as a staff RN due to losing my overtime, differentials, etc. When they calculated out my salary as an hourly rate it sounded like more, but after working 14 extra hours last pay period with no extra compensation....

    I am learning that I need to put limits on the number of hours I work each day, because I could stay for 12 hours each day and I would still have piles of work on my desk when I leave

    Being salary has its benefits, though. I can leave campus for lunch each day. Heck, I get to eat lunch at all- that's a change from working as a staff nurse I am looking forward to a three day weekend if I can only get out from under all the work I have to finish tomorrow! If I was a staff RN, however, I would be working 12's all weekend.
  12. Visit  SteveNNP} profile page
    0
    Exactly.... you don't make the weekend, night and holiday differentials because you DON'T have to work nights, weekends and holidays like RNs do.....

    IMHO, I avoid overtime. I was mandated by my last job to take 3 12-hr call shifts every 6-week schedule, and ALWAYS got called in. I had no choice but to come in, while getting paid OT.
  13. Visit  Katnip} profile page
    3
    Quote from SteveRN21
    Exactly.... you don't make the weekend, night and holiday differentials because you DON'T have to work nights, weekends and holidays like RNs do.....

    IMHO, I avoid overtime. I was mandated by my last job to take 3 12-hr call shifts every 6-week schedule, and ALWAYS got called in. I had no choice but to come in, while getting paid OT.
    Managers work OT. I'm often here 3-5 hours later than what I get paid for because of one crisis or another. I'm called at home at all hours for some very simple things that the staff should have been able to handle themselves or turned over to the house supervisor.

    And at my place, managers DO have to work holidays. I'm here at work now on a holiday. We are expected to have at least one manager working as house supervisor on each holiday. We do not get paid time and a half. We don't get paid for taking the holiday off unless we use our vacation time. And in a crisis we HAVE to come in at night or weekends.

    My base pay started $.50 more than my pay as a staff nurse. I also got paid shift diff and charge pay. I just now managed to get a raise that takes me a tiny bit more than I was making as charge.

    There aren't many benefits to being a manager. It's just that if the job suits your skills and personality better, then it can be a better fit than bedside.
    JeanettePNP, NRSKarenRN, and llg like this.
  14. Visit  SteveNNP} profile page
    0
    That's too bad that they make you work holidays....

    I'm pretty sure I didn't see any management other than the house supervisor for a few shifts around Christmas, New Year's, Easter, Memorial Day, July 4th, Labor Day, MLK Jr Day and Thanksgiving. Not to mention Mother's Day, Valentine's Day, etc....

    Sorry if I sound cynical. I went from an excellent Magnet facility with one manager who cared to a huge hospital with 6 backstabbing managers.

    Case in point: I made sure when I was hired I could work primarily weekends to accommodate school. He said fine. We are required to work 26 weekends a year. So I requested that I work only one weekend this month, as I am off school, and have already put in around 18 weekends. (1 measly weekend off) He says, "oh no.... you made a special request to work those weekends, and I did you a favor by allowing you to work extra weekends. Those don't count. You still need to work your 2 weekends a month."

    You just wait and see if I stay a second longer than I need to in this job.....
  15. Visit  Katnip} profile page
    0
    Quote from SteveRN21
    That's too bad that they make you work holidays....

    I'm pretty sure I didn't see any management other than the house supervisor for a few shifts around Christmas, New Year's, Easter, Memorial Day, July 4th, Labor Day, MLK Jr Day and Thanksgiving. Not to mention Mother's Day, Valentine's Day, etc....

    Sorry if I sound cynical. I went from an excellent Magnet facility with one manager who cared to a huge hospital with 6 backstabbing managers.

    Case in point: I made sure when I was hired I could work primarily weekends to accommodate school. He said fine. We are required to work 26 weekends a year. So I requested that I work only one weekend this month, as I am off school, and have already put in around 18 weekends. (1 measly weekend off) He says, "oh no.... you made a special request to work those weekends, and I did you a favor by allowing you to work extra weekends. Those don't count. You still need to work your 2 weekends a month."

    You just wait and see if I stay a second longer than I need to in this job.....
    I don't blame you a bit for that. Always, always get things in writing. We're having difficulty here with things like that. But in our case, the staff just sort of changed their schedules to accomodate their own needs, while leaving huge gaps in the schedule where none should be. This went on for years before I started here, now it's our job to straighten out the mess. And it is a mess. I need two nurses per shift. Sometimes I get 6, and other days none. And people are screaming about it because it's been their way for so long.

    But I do digress. I love the staff on my unit. Most are extremely responsible and competent. A few need some improvement. But as a manager, I really do make less than I did before. And didn't know when I was hired as manager that I'd have to work holidays. Heck I have to give 30 days notice if I want time off. That was fun when my washing machine broke.

    You can bet, if I don't go back to bedside and look for another place, I know what questions to ask up front.


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