"Baby Friendly"

Specialties NICU

Published

Is anyone else going through the Baby Friendly designation at their hospital right now? We have done all of our training and are now waiting for the visit. I'm having some issues with it though.

Not much has changed in our unit as far as our practices, which I'm thankful for. What I am noticing is an increase in admissions from NBN of babies who are dehydrated because the nurses and/or practitioners are refusing to give breastfed babies formula when needed.

I'm really concerned that with this training, people are learing to become very inflexible and not giving formula when really medically necessary.

I can understand not wanting to give formula for the majority of breastfed normal newborns but sometimes the mother's milk supply isn't sufficient enough and the baby suffers for it.

We have seen an major increase of babies being admitted because of low blood sugars and lethargy and/or seizures. When we do our lab work, we are finding that these babies are dehydrated but before we get that diagnosis these babies are getting full septic workups including urine caths and lumbar punctures.

I am really feeling that the designation of "Baby Friendly" is being misapplied or some education is missing.

I want to talk to someone about this. I'm probably going to start with my unit director becuase this really bothers me.

Has anyone else experienced this? What are your thoughts?

How would you present this as a concern? Ideally I'd like to bring this up with the unit directors and the medical directors to find out what exactly is going on.

Specializes in Pediatrics, High-Risk L&D, Antepartum, L.

You are very uneducated about breastfeeding. I suggest you read the following....

http://drjaygordon.com/pediatricks/startingout/supplement.html

Having a baby is an instant change in responsibility and lifestyle....sad people can't accept that.

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Specializes in Pediatrics, High-Risk L&D, Antepartum, L.
trauer, I said I'm a NICU RN. Do you think I don't know the importance of colostrum? That's what a pump is for! I'd much rather pump than fall asleep with my kid and possibly smother them. I've seen it happen and the kids that come to our unit are already gone, just need an EEG to confirm. I should note that I'm not at a delivery hospital and we're 100% referrals so we get kiddos all over my region. Somehow I don't think that being hopped up on pain meds, lack of sleep, soreness, and middle of the night feeding is ideal in the first 24 hours. If women want to do it, more power to them. But women shouldn't be shamed if that's not something they want to do. Formula isn't evil.

I think the kid and I will survive if mama gets some rest after her long athletic event...

Wow...just wow. Your opinion is so far from facts. That's what a pump is for? You seriously think moms should pump rather than feed at the breast? You clearly know very little about lactation. You also don't know much about post partum.

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Specializes in Pediatrics, High-Risk L&D, Antepartum, L.
You put IV's in kids for that? What if they are a bad stick? I'd rather give a kid formula than put in an IV which is a source of infection. I don't see that as baby friendly at all!

You need to research the effects of formula. They are life long and can be severe.

http://drjaygordon.com/pediatricks/startingout/supplement.html

I'd prefer an iv over formula. That maintenance of the virgin guy is so important.

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Specializes in Pediatrics, High-Risk L&D, Antepartum, L.
No offense to any Lactation Consultants out there, but it's the LC's that are driving this nutty practice. Someone who has been smoking weed and allowed to practice came up with the idea that the baby's stomach holds only 2 to 3 ml, so if the mother cannot produce breast milk that is OK.

I personally think it is cruel an inhumane to let a baby scream it's head off in hunger, get stressed, etc., over breastfeeding. It is dangerous to allow the blood sugar to drop and anyone who has worked in the NICU, once a NICU admission happens, that baby is subjected to all kinds of needles, IV fluids that is 100% preventable.

One or two days of formula isn't going to kill the baby until the milk comes in and once it goes home, if it gets hungry enough IT WILL breastfeed.

http://drjaygordon.com/pediatricks/startingout/supplement.html

You are offensive. What makes you think that suggesting IBCLCs and weed belong in the same sentence?

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Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.

I think we need to be respectful of other opinions especially when they differ from ours. I think some "baby friendly" facilities have become mother aggressive. I think that there are some mothers that for whatever reasons don't produce enough milk. I watched a co-worker slowly starve her baby into a failure to thrive situation because she was getting advice from sources that we giving her what was in my opinion.....extremist advice about breast feeding and being a good parent.

I breast fed exclusively.....I enjoyed the experience but I didn't feel it was "easy"...I had a really hard time and I had to supplement after a "home visit nurse" from my insurance gave my baby thrush...long story!!!!!!!!!!

I think we can agree to disagree as long as we are polite.

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Specializes in NICU.
Wow...just wow. Your opinion is so far from facts. That's what a pump is for? You seriously think moms should pump rather than feed at the breast? You clearly know very little about lactation. You also don't know much about post partum.

Yes, I'd rather use a pump during first 12 hours after delivery so that I don't fall asleep with my baby and smother her (my body is pretty naive to sedation drugs, so I know that my epidural and pain meds will not leave me with 100% alertness, plus the fact that oh yeah I spent a few hours pushing a baby out, I'll be exhausted!).

And yeah...it's happened. Mom's do smother their babies on accident. I've seen the babies who come to my facility and they are DOA and I've had those parents stare at me with dead eyes while we wait for their kid to die (because you can live with sats in the 50s for quite awhile).

Not to mention that if you read the entire thread, you would know that I was only referring to myself, not to all mothers, and ONLY during the first day or so. If some mothers do it naturally or have it together enough to do it post-delivery, go them! It's not for me. And that's okay. But shaming my choices is not appropriate and is an anti-woman sentiment. We all want what is best for our babies. But every woman's situation is different.

Moms on illegal street drugs should not be breastfeeding. Moms who are on psych drugs with bad side effects shouldn't be breastfeeding. Moms who have to work in order to keep the roof over her family's head and who don't have the time or emotional energy to pump shouldn't breastfeed. There are dozens of reasons why breastfeeding may not be best for mom, baby, and family.

We NEED to get rid of this GUILT trip that people like you put on these moms. We need to be there to encourage them, not shame them!

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Specializes in Pediatrics, High-Risk L&D, Antepartum, L.

Yes, I'd rather use a pump during first 12 hours after delivery so that I don't fall asleep with my baby and smother her (my body is pretty naive to sedation drugs, so I know that my epidural and pain meds will not leave me with 100% alertness, plus the fact that oh yeah I spent a few hours pushing a baby out, I'll be exhausted!).

And yeah...it's happened. Mom's do smother their babies on accident. I've seen the babies who come to my facility and they are DOA and I've had those parents stare at me with dead eyes while we wait for their kid to die (because you can live with sats in the 50s for quite awhile).

Not to mention that if you read the entire thread, you would know that I was only referring to myself, not to all mothers, and ONLY during the first day or so. If some mothers do it naturally or have it together enough to do it post-delivery, go them! It's not for me. And that's okay. But shaming my choices is not appropriate and is an anti-woman sentiment. We all want what is best for our babies. But every woman's situation is different.

Moms on illegal street drugs should not be breastfeeding. Moms who are on psych drugs with bad side effects shouldn't be breastfeeding. Moms who have to work in order to keep the roof over her family's head and who don't have the time or emotional energy to pump shouldn't breastfeed. There are dozens of reasons why breastfeeding may not be best for mom, baby, and family.

We NEED to get rid of this GUILT trip that people like you put on these moms. We need to be there to encourage them, not shame them!

Do you realize you may not have success pumping in the first 24 hours? Do you realize that the epidural wont make you tired? Do you realize pain meds for a lady partsl are frequently Tylenol and Motrin?

You are not educated about lactation. Moms on psych meds shouldn't breastfeed? There are actually many psych meds that are safe...safer than formula.

You are speaking about something based on opinion and that my dear....doesn't mean much. There is a way to become educated about lactation and until you have done that your opinion is means nothing more than the opinion of my neighbor.

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Specializes in NICU.

Yes, I know I may not have pumping success in the first 24 hours. But that doesn't mean I shouldn't try it. If I don't get opioids after delivery (I was talking more about a c-section), then I think the act of labor will make me exhausted. I don't do very well on little sleep.

I didn't say that all moms on psych meds shouldn't breastfeed. I said moms who are psych meds with bad side effects (relating to lactation) shouldn't breastfeed. I think I do know what I'm talking about because we just went over psych meds contraindicated in lactation in my pharm class in graduate school. Plus our LC tells us when we shouldn't give breastmilk based on mom's psych drugs.

Again, you're trying to shame my choices and the choices of every woman who cannot or does not want to breastfeed. I notice that you didn't respond to that part of my reply. Moderators, I think this discussion is going nowhere. I think you should close it.

Goodness me, what drama in the NICU forum! I haven't seen this much drama for years in here!

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Specializes in Pediatrics, High-Risk L&D, Antepartum, L.
Yes, I know I may not have pumping success in the first 24 hours. But that doesn't mean I shouldn't try it. If I don't get opioids after delivery (I was talking more about a c-section), then I think the act of labor will make me exhausted. I don't do very well on little sleep.

I didn't say that all moms on psych meds shouldn't breastfeed. I said moms who are psych meds with bad side effects (relating to lactation) shouldn't breastfeed. I think I do know what I'm talking about because we just went over psych meds contraindicated in lactation in my pharm class in graduate school. Plus our LC tells us when we shouldn't give breastmilk based on mom's psych drugs.

Again, you're trying to shame my choices and the choices of every woman who cannot or does not want to breastfeed. I notice that you didn't respond to that part of my reply. Moderators, I think this discussion is going nowhere. I think you should close it.

Goodness me, what drama in the NICU forum! I haven't seen this much drama for years in here!

I am not shaming anyone. I'm simply stating that your opinions are nothing more than...opinions and not back by evidence. You make very blanket statements that sound like an individual with no lactation education. The majority of meds out there...safe with breastfeeding. You list all the reasons women shouldn't breastfeed. How about we focus on all the reasons women should breastfeed? Are you aware of the dangers of formula? You do realize that comes with significant life long risks...correct?

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Specializes in NICU.

oh lordy. I just. can't. mods. please?

edit: I took a look at your article. A few of the references were from the 1920s (seriously!!). Two articles from 2000. A couple in the 80s and 90s. I don't think I can take it that seriously or believe that all the best research is in that article.

also: I will admit my ignorance in whether or not pumping is a "good" thing or a "bad" thing in the immediate postpartum time. My assumption is that pumping can't hurt your supply unless you get oversupply, but I do concede, if pumping causes your supply to decrease, I have no idea.

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Specializes in Pediatrics, High-Risk L&D, Antepartum, L.
oh lordy. I just. can't. mods. please?

edit: I took a look at your article. A few of the references were from the 1920s (seriously!!). Two articles from 2000. A couple in the 80s and 90s. I don't think I can take it that seriously or believe that all the best research is in that article.

also: I will admit my ignorance in whether or not pumping is a "good" thing or a "bad" thing in the immediate postpartum time. My assumption is that pumping can't hurt your supply unless you get oversupply, but I do concede, if pumping causes your supply to decrease, I have no idea.

Not all women respond to a pump. Plus if you pump you need to pump every 2-3 hours in the early days and this still creates a risk of supply issues. A pump is not equal to a baby and never will be.

Call the mods...whatever. You don't like being called out. That's it. Oh and the nasty weed comment.

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Specializes in NICU.

I have no problems admitting when I'm wrong and I admitted my own ignorance for pumping in the immediate postpartum period. All I do know is that the majority of our premature infants can't breastfeed and pumping is the only way to go. I'd rather that the moms try to pump than not pump at all. I don't understand the "nasty weed" comment? I didn't talk about marijuana??

You came onto this thread with an intent to incite its posters based on the language that you've used thus far. This gets us nowhere except two exasperated people who are no closer to reaching the goal that we both have: supporting what is best for baby and mom based on their unique circumstances.

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