Content That ChristaRN Likes

Content That ChristaRN Likes

ChristaRN 2,953 Views

Joined Aug 9, '05. Posts: 74 (59% Liked) Likes: 159

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  • Feb 1 '14
  • Jan 30 '14

    MarissaHu,

    I am aware that one cannot be sure of the tone a poster has when they comment online but some of your posts are coming across as argumentative and sarcastic. As it has been repeated MULTIPLE times, we are in a discussion forum speaking with our peers, not at Jahi's bedside, therefore we should be able to use any medically correct terminology that we choose to. I don't see the point of beating a dead horse on the politically correct terminology to use, and I don't want to see this thread closed because we can't just agree to disagree.
    As others have said, I would also not use the term corpse around the family, but when speaking in a nursing forum I should be able to say the things that I really feel and I do feel that she is a corpse, although I respect your position on the subject.
    For hopefully the last time, can we all just agree to disagree?

  • Jan 30 '14

    In medical journals, someone in Jahi's condition is described as a "beating-heart cadaver" (or BHC).
    I thought "corpse" sounded mild after reading that...

  • Jan 30 '14

    Oh my gosh I just realized what song I'm humming . . . . . .

    [FONT=DroidSansRegular](Mayor)
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]As mayor of the Munchkin City
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]In the county of the land of Oz
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]I welcome you most regally

    [FONT=DroidSansRegular](Judge)
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]But we've got to verify it legally
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]To see...

    [FONT=DroidSansRegular](Mayor)
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]To see...

    [FONT=DroidSansRegular](Judge)
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]If she...

    [FONT=DroidSansRegular](Mayor)
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]If she...

    [FONT=DroidSansRegular](Judge)
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]Is morally, ethically

    [FONT=DroidSansRegular](Munchkin 1)
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]Spiritually, physically

    [FONT=DroidSansRegular](Munchkin 2)
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]Positively, absolutely

    [FONT=DroidSansRegular](Munchkin Men)
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]Undeniably and reliably dead!

    [FONT=DroidSansRegular](Coroner)
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]As Coroner, I thoroughly examined her
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]And she's not only merely dead,
    [FONT=DroidSansRegular]She's really most sincerely dead

  • Jan 30 '14

    Quote from Spidey's mom

    A corpse, to me, means no life whatsoever - like a cadaver. DEAD. No spontaneous respirations, no heart tones, the blood stops circulating. No pulses. Eyes fixed and dilated. It is what I have to assess in a dead hospice patient as I'm the person who declares them dead. If they were on a vent, oxygen was being exchanged in their lungs, their heart was beating . . . .I could not declare them dead.
    With all due respect, Jahi has NO spontaneous respirations, her pupils are fixed and dilated, and any circulation is 100% artificially driven. The only responses she has had are clearly spinal reflex arcs, no brain mediated action whatsoever.

    I get what you are saying, though. I personally MIGHT say "body" after a bit of frustration, probably would never say "corpse." I get that perspective, too, but it would not be my own personal tactic.

    However, no matter how we want to refer to her, this child's brain has been deprived of oxygen going on six weeks. No blood flow to the brain AT ALL, noted on the CBF scan. When you think about it in those terms (what would your foot look like after weeks of absolutely no blood flow?), you have to know that this child is COMPLETELY gone and what is left is just a lump of skin, compromised tissue, and bones lying there with a machine forcing oxygen into the circulatory system so that someone in denial can remain so. I find that just as horrifying as using the word "corpse" in front of a grieving mother. It's just SICK.

    Remember the note from the coroner who has examined a hundred or more brain dead patients after removal from the vent? He said after a few weeks on a vent that the brain of a previously diagnosed brain dead patient had the appearance of SOUP. That's DEAD. No one recovers from soup brain-NO ONE. Anyone participating in the continued effort to preserve the appearance of life for this mother's benefit is participating in one cruel hoax. And that is the worst thing I have read in this entire thread. IMHO.

  • Jan 30 '14

    Quote from pookyp
    Little ol jahi is not filling up anyone's bed. There are plenty of hospitals to go around. Stop with the faux outrage please.
    This is the SECOND time I've seen that term used on this thread. It is not for you or anyone else to decide that someone else's outrage is "faux."

    As someone who worked for years in the ICU where our beds were ALWAYS being requested, often to the detriment of a very sick patient who had to go to the floor to accommodate another even sicker patient, I can well understand the argument against keeping brain dead patients in the ICU for weeks. Jahi is now in another facility, but for several weeks she took up an ICU bed while deceased that a living child should have been able to access. ICU beds are NOT always in abundance.

  • Jan 30 '14

    Quote from pookyp
    So if you were taking care of Jahi you would refer to her as a corpse? In front of her mother? Because that's what she is? A 'decomposing corpse' as you put it?
    I would rather quit my job than deal with the stress of maintaining a body that has been brain-dead and decomposing for weeks. I am not a mortician, even if that sounds unkind.

    And, no, I would not want to deal with her unreasonable family. 6+ weeks of keeping a corpse warm is being unreasonable, IMHO.

  • Jan 30 '14

    Quote from pookyp
    So if you were taking care of Jahi you would refer to her as a corpse? In front of her mother? Because that's what she is? A 'decomposing corpse' as you put it?
    Not necessarily in the beginning, but if it becomes clear to me that the family is having a difficult time grasping the circumstances then I'm definitely going to try a less gentle approach. I may not refer to her as a "decomposing corpse," but I most definitely will state in no uncertain terms, "Your child is dead. She is dead. There is nothing further we can do for her and there is nothing further you can do, for that matter, other than laying her body to rest."

  • Jan 30 '14

    Quote from pookyp
    So if you were taking care of Jahi you would refer to her as a corpse? In front of her mother? Because that's what she is? A 'decomposing corpse' as you put it?
    Maybe someone needs to be that blunt with her right now.

  • Jan 30 '14

    Quote from Yemayah
    I agree. It's so unkind and insensitive .
    The truth is sometimes unkind and insensitive. However, this doesn't change the fact that it's the truth, verified by multiple medical professionals. Jahi McMath's body is a decomposing corpse because she has been dead 6+ weeks.

    She is no longer someone's living child. She is a corpse.

  • Jan 30 '14

    Quote from pookyp
    Yes wooh does. You can get your point across without calling someone's child a corpse.
    Jahi McMath is dead. She was pronounced dead on December 9th, 2013.

    Therefore, her body is a corpse. A child is a living being, and Jahi McMath is not living. What part of 'dead' are you not comprehending? Jahi McMath is dead, deceased, moribund, and met her demise last year. She is DEAD!

  • Jan 30 '14

    Quote from pookyp

    Yes wooh does. You can get your point across without calling someone's child a corpse.
    That's what a dead body is called.

  • Jan 30 '14

    Quote from pookyp
    Little ol jahi is not filling up anyone's bed. There are plenty of hospitals to go around. Stop with the faux outrage please.

    And isn't she rumored to be in a long term care facility and not in a PICU bed. It's also rumored that she may even be home. So relax a bit.

    Plenty of hospitals? Probably. Plenty of hospital with PICUs and staff trained to care for critically ill children? Nope.

    Wooh doesn't need to relax. She was merely explaining the difficulties of providing care to critically ill children.

  • Jan 30 '14

    Quote from pookyp
    Little ol jahi is not filling up anyone's bed. There are plenty of hospitals to go around. Stop with the faux outrage please.

    And isn't she rumored to be in a long term care facility and not in a PICU bed. It's also rumored that she may even be home. So relax a bit.
    Apparently there are not enough hospitals to go around -- or at least enough PICU beds in many areas -- based on the discussion here. And if Jahi's mom had had her way, Jahi would still be taking up a bed in a PICU somewhere. I think it's probably easy to admonish people to "relax a bit" if you're not the one trying to manage critically ill children in a hospital setting.

    I don't believe anyone's grief allows them to run roughshod over people, which Jahi's family was rumored to do while the child was at CHO. I also don't believe grief entitles a person to make outrageous demands or to expect to have HER situation handled specially and separately from every other.

    A lot of folks seem more than happy to enable Mrs. Winkfield in denying that her daughter has died, in demanding special treatment for her child who she chooses to believe is still alive, and in taking no responsibility to handle the situation as an adult and the mother of other children still living. I have to wonder why. As many here have already pointed out, if every parent of a sick or dead child behaved as Jahi's mother has, there would be no hospital beds available anywhere, and dead children would be stacked to the rafters in homes and alternative care facilities.

  • Jan 30 '14

    And the hospital had to be released of liability to do the transfer. And donated funds are paying for it. The problem isn't the one single Jahi, it's the precedent this sets for the many kids that die in hospitals all over the country.

    When it's your kid that can't get a PICU bed because it's full, YOU won't care about the other patients either. You won't care that their mommas are grieving and can't handle their child having been declared brain dead a month before and isn't ready to let go yet. We'll see how "faux" YOUR outrage is when the beds YOUR child needs are full of corpses because Jahi set a precedent.


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