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ProfRN4, MSN 15,989 Views

Joined Apr 5, '03. ProfRN4 is a Staff Educator. She has '22' year(s) of experience and specializes in 'Pediatrics'. Posts: 2,282 (23% Liked) Likes: 1,385

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  • Feb 25

    I think that a facility being willing to interview an applicant with months of experience for a job that should require years of experience is a huge red flag. With as little experience as you have, it is quite likely that you don't know what you don't know. Even as a nurse with nearly 10 years of experience, I had quite the eye opening experience when I got to the hands-on part of my MSN with a focus in nursing education program. It's not only knowing and having the experience to provide education on what it is you're providing that education, there's also a lot of information about how to provide the education that needs to be understood.

  • Feb 25

    You did not like when your experience was called into question in this thread. If you take this job, your lack of experience surely will be called into question. We are being honest with you. That job is not for someone who has only been a nurse for 8 months. It just isn't. If you want to do well in a job like that, why not work at a SNF for a while as a nurse and then maybe as a unit manager? This way you will get your lay of the land. Where I work they don't orient you to charge for a few years because they don't want overwhelmed, frazzled, inexperienced charge nurses. I'm sure you can eventually do this job, but ease your way into it. SNFs are notorious for being lawsuit hothouses and you will be one of the first names that comes up in discovery.

  • Feb 25

    Don't confuse your getting an interview or even getting hired with actually being qualified for the job. They aren't indicators for that and you're not qualified.

  • Feb 25

    Quote from cbrue645
    You are skeptical of management degrees and MBA's? Interesting. Thanks for your honest feedback!! I will see how my interview turned out!
    No, I think the poster is skeptical of your nursing qualifications. It's hard to teach what you barely know. You're still a novice. People tend to chafe at the idea of being "educated" by someone who is a rank beginner. This is true in all walks of life not just nursing. Sorry you don't like what you're hearing here. And a word of warning. Nursing homes are notorious for putting under-qualified people in leaderships roles (like new grads as charge nurses) and then throwing them under the bus when the poo hits the fan. I'm sure you're pretty chuffed about getting this interview, as anyone would be. But you need to think long and hard about this. You will get push back from nurses and CNAs who have been doing the job longer than you. You've gotten pretty defensive here with perfect strangers who have challenged your qualifications. How will you respond to people you have to work with every day?

  • Feb 25

    Quote from cbrue645
    I did ask, but figured we were all mature adults and did not need to make snarky or rude comments. I believe there was a better/more mature way of replying, but perhaps that is too much to ask on a public forum. I guess the stereotypes of veteran nurses are true, with the exception of my relatives who are nurse practitioners and have all given me valuable input! Have a good night, and thanks for trying to assist! I definitely appreciate opinions and feedback, especially when they are constructive as opposed to belittling.

    You are not qualified for that job, irrespective of your masters and administrative positions. You have to have some clinical expertise or at least a lot of clinical exposure. You don't have it.

    The other comment may have bene overbearing, but I find your indignation over it a little misplaced. It should be obvious, even to you, that you don't have adequate experience for that job.

  • Feb 25

    I liked the job - when I could do it like I was supposed. All the STAT shifting gears was awful.

    And of course whenever there was problem, it was always 'they need more training'. NOOOOOOO! They need more supervision and followup!

  • Feb 25

    Quote from Cola89
    Why are you following what I'm doing so closely? Are you a crappy nm too? It doesn't matter if a nurse has a gazillion years of carefully strategized experience, s/he might not necessarily be a good manager. I'm surprised hospitals are still filling managerial positions with these nurses who couldn't care less about their subordinates, the patients, or nursing in general. They should hire MBAs, real business professionals and be done with it.
    MBAs? Really? Yeah, I really want a manager who has never wiped a butt that wasn't her own.

  • Feb 25

    Is this the same manager you were complaining about last month? And the month before? I thought you were getting a new job?

    And yes, if every manager you have had is a jerk, and every charge nurse or long time nurse you've worked with is backbiting and a gossip, I would say that you are the common denominator.

  • Feb 25

    I have worked for some real jerks... both in nursing and outside of nursing.

    I have worked with some wonderful managers, ones that listened, improved working conditions, and supported my own career goals... both in nursing and outside of nursing.

    People are people. And middle management is the worst place to be no matter what your profession is.

    My own experience has shown me that when I don't know someone, or what their job requires, I am more likely to judge their abilities. When I find out more about them and their role, I mostly see people doing the best they can with what they have.

  • Feb 25

    Believe me I wasn't always a jerk. Let me tell you its a thankless job, but I keep at it and come in each day trying to make a difference. But you are stuck between a rock and hard place. Trying to advocate for staff, trying to please the higher ups. I was a CNA, LPN, RN, Supervisor and now nurse manger. No one wants to work and those that do are getting burnt out. I tried to protect my staff from angry family members and angry administration. They on the other hand are trying to please the owners and state and keep the facility open so people still have jobs. I do not ask anyone to do what I wouldn't do myself. But there is sometimes not enough time in the day to do it all. I am on the cart at times. One time I was on two carts and doing care. I didn't get my care plans done. Guess what I was told I better find a way to get it done. So tell me, what would you do? Some people get in power because they like the power and they are jerks. Some get in power because they hope they can make a difference and get burnt out. If you look around I bet you will see many many openings for nurse managers, supervisors, ADONs and DONS. There is a reason. I won't quit, but some days I just want to go home and cry. So please don't generalize. I don't get paid enough to do this. Its in my heart.

  • Feb 25

    If you perceive one person as a jerk, that person probably is a jerk. If you perceive everyone (or in your case, all managers) as a jerk, you might want to indulge in some self-reflection. Nurses are human, so some are jerks.

  • Feb 13

    I am so over joyed by all of the positive responses I have received. I am now reading them as I am riding back to the metroplex. I was not expecting this level of support; I honestly feel refreshed! I am also taking the not so positive comments into consideration... as many of them are also valuable.

    Many of you have offered great suggestions. I am doing many of them now, and will try the new ones!

    Wow, thank you everyone! I will keep you udated as time goes by.

    To answer a burning question: Yes, I was a nurse before being the manager. I was PRN, a staff nurse, a clinical supervisor, and then manager. All within that same unit. It's been an exciting journey!

  • Feb 12

    It is refreshing to read this, as you care and want to try. I just want to tell you, that in and of itself, is absolutely awesome!

  • Feb 12

    Quote from I.Am.A.Nurse.
    Do you know what it's like to not have anyone like you? To know that everyone hates you? That's my life as a nurse manager. They now see me as the enemy. I have to deny vacations, write people up, give not so good performance evaluations, tell people how to do their job better, short the unit. They think I am sitting in my office everyday doing nothing when I am drowning in work. Blah!!!! I spend almost all my time in meetings. Sometimes I literally have 30 minutes outside of meetings. So then I work at home or on my days off. When I am in my office, sometimes I close my door. I literally cannot get a thing done when my door is open because people always come in to talk. I cannot send people away because I don't want to unapproachable.

    What they don't know is how hard I fight for them. They forget about all the new equipment I fight for. They forget all about the changes I have made so they have it easier. I talk about these in our staff meetings but very few people come. I send out weekly emails but people don't read them.

    I was so happy to take this job. It has proved to be the hardest job ever. I have senior leaders handing never ending tasks down to me and staff level employees complaining so much. It's exhausting. Was I like that as a staff nurse?

    Balancing the schedule for 70 people is nuts. No one gets 100% of what they want. That makes people very angry but someone has to work!

    People complain and gossip but refuse to get involved. They won't come to staff meetings, they won't join committees, they won't offer solutions.

    I love my job and I love the team. However; it is so exhausting. I am on call 24-7. People tend to forget that too. I respond to calls and messages all day long.

    I just want people to meet me in the middle.

    I try to get to know the staff members, send thank notes monthly, ask people what they think.

    I can't seem to get ahead. I think a big part of the problem is that I came from this unit. People wonder why I got the job. I'm sure some people even hate it. No matter how hard I try, I can't get them to understand that I work for them. I want them to grow and succeed. I want us to be a great unit that everyone wants to work on.

    Any tips??? Any advice???
    You're not the enemy -- you're the one protecting your staff from frivolous edicts from on high, from abusive patients and family members, from ill-conceived policies that will negatively impact their paychecks, their schedules or their working day. Staff nurses don't know what you do because they don't see you doing it. But they do know when you have their backs.

    The best managers I've ever had (and I've had some good and some bad) realize that despite Press-Ganey, you cannot please everyone. There are some folks that just cannot be pleased, no matter what. Make sure your staff sees you standing up for them to those folks that just cannot be pleased. Trying to please THEM is wasted effort -- standing up for your staff is an investment in your staff. Your staff ought to be able to count on you to run interference with ranting and raving medical staff as well. Your staff may not always be in the right, but they need to know you'll keep an open mind until you've investigated the complaint, that you won't automatically take the side of the physician or upper management or the visitor who claims to be best buds with the CEO.

    Start scheduling the staff meetings into their schedules. If they don't show up, it's an occurrence unless they've cleared it with you in advance for solid reasons such as they'll be on a previously scheduled vacation, they're taking final exams at that moment or they're scheduled for surgery. Make committees a prestigious thing. I was in my first year of nursing when my head nurse asked me to represent our unit at Nursing Grand Rounds . . . I was so flattered! I was primed to volunteer for committees after that.

    My current manager ascended through the ranks, and there was some pushback at first from the nurses who were more senior to her when she got the job. Most of them have moved on now, the newbies never knew her before she was a manager and those of us in between have grown to respect the way she stands up for us. Hopefully you'll be as respected as she is!

  • Feb 12

    Quote from AliNajaCat
    Wonderful. When I was a clin spec and classed as middle management, I wore street clothes and a well-fitting lab coat with my scissors, clamp, steth, and suchlike in the pockets. They got pretty regular use, but I still put on scrubs and worked a shift in the ICU about once a month to keep my hand in. Once somebody said to me, "Oh, Ali, you look like a nurse today," and fortunately I had the presence of mind to say, with a smile, "I look like a nurse every day."

    On a related note, in my present role I get asked when the last time was I worked as a nurse. Same answer. "I'm working a a nurse today, counselor." Opportunities for education are boundless.
    I've run into that a lot. I even wrote a paper about it for grad school. For some nurses, if you are not doing the same job they are doing .... then they don't consider you to be working. We can't allow that. We have to speak up for ourselves and teach them that we also have legitimate jobs.

    It's sort of a "reverse NETY."


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