Walking on eggshells at clinicals - page 4

Anyone else feel like this? My group has had a few bad encounters with the RN staff. I feel like we are bothering them and they HATE us. One of them flogged another student on Thursday evening... Read More

  1. by   charlies
    Quote from 2008RN2B
    Another RN on the unit tries to avoid the students, and our instructor says it's because she's afraid were going to ask her questions that she won't be able to answer, and she'll look dumb. Makes sense...

    Of course that is the reason. That nurse is a big giant dummy who is only there because the hospital is so desperate in this time of need. It sounds like you have a fantastic instructor who really knows alot and is giving you a realistic view of nursing.

    On the other hand, maybe she avoids the students because when she was a little girl, a student nurse said 'boo' to her really loud, and scared the bejesus out of her, and now she has an irrational fear of students. That makes sense too...
  2. by   Beeanurse
    I too experienced this when I was in nursing school. The staff always acted like we were bothering them. The whole group of us would be friendly, try to stay out of their way etc... but clinical after clinical it got worse. Finally after our instructor did not give us the answer we were looking for, a solution, we as a group went to the nursing supervisor of the floor and told her how we felt. The last 3 or 4 clinicals I had were the best the staff totally changed.
  3. by   S.T.A.C.E.Y
    OMG! We had this problem during my last clinical semester before my preceptorship. It was terrible. The nurses on the floor told us we could only look at one chart at a time....between all of us, couldn't go behind the nurses station, had to share one BP/Temp thing between all of us, couldn't do anything. We were told to all share this little ledge along a window at the far end of the hall to do our charting, then we were complained to about how we're always all huddled down the back hallway. Our clinical instructor was mistaken for a student several times, and even had her head chewed off. We had some plain ignore us, one even asked if we were stupid when we asked why she was doing something. We brought their lack of co-operation up several times with our clinical instructor, with our nsg director, and she had numerous meetings with the floor manager. Apparently it has been a problem on this floor for years, and they've treated all students the same way.

    But, some payback.....they've been desperatly trying to hire staff for years, and since we're the only nursing school around they kinda rely on my schools new grads to fill positions. Our nsg director told the manager that the reason no student wanted to do their placement on her floor, or work for them was directly related to the way they treat/treated their students. My classmates have gone on to work on other floors at this hospital, but everyone knows to stay clear of this floor. The few new grads that have ventured there haven't lasted more than a few weeks. Good grief!
  4. by   PedsNurse322
    Of course that is the reason. That nurse is a big giant dummy who is only there because the hospital is so desperate in this time of need. It sounds like you have a fantastic instructor who really knows alot and is giving you a realistic view of nursing.

    On the other hand, maybe she avoids the students because when she was a little girl, a student nurse said 'boo' to her really loud, and scared the bejesus out of her, and now she has an irrational fear of students. That makes sense too...
    Well, I'm just repeating what the instructor told us... and she's worked as an instructor on this unit for a long time and knows the RNs pretty well, and how they practice, etc. She's a fantastic instructor, knows her stuff, so I don't question her judgement. Apparently this nurse has done some questionable things, practice-wise that my instructor has taken notice of.

    You really don't have to be so snotty, either. :-)
  5. by   classicdame
    someone needs to contact the Chief nursing officer and/or the Director of Education. This is wrong on many levels.
  6. by   WDWpixieRN
    Quote from charlies
    ....the patient you work with is not my patient. Lol, the patient you work with is most likely Daytonite's patient. All four of us are much happier that way. All six of us if you include the charge nurse and the instructor.
    ...We spend 8+ hours wishing for the he!! that is that day to be over -- and quickly.

    I do find this attitude very sad, however. I can't imagine where it comes from or why. I can only say I am so very grateful for the Daytonites and others like the circulating nurse in my OR obs today who are so willing to help us understand how to be good, contributing members of the profession someday.
    Last edit by sirI on Apr 5, '07 : Reason: quoted and referred to edited post
  7. by   WDWpixieRN
    One thing to keep in mind....these student nurses will one day be real nurses in a hospital where YOU may end up.

    One would think it would be in EVERY nurses' favor to help train their replacements and do so in the manner in which they hope to be treated as a pt.
  8. by   PedsNurse322
    But whatever, you teach the students all you want, I don't care. Unless your teaching of the students means your not getting your job done and I have to take up the slack. Because I will not do that.
    Charlies, you were a nursing student at one time, right? Do you remember what it was like as a green student in those first clinicals? Why do I sense that you resent students? Believe me, when I'm in clincals, I rarely bother my RN unless I absolutely have to, and leave the teaching up to my instructor. But today, I was working under a wonderful RN who made sure to let me know that she was there for me if I needed her in any way. Once she gave me report, I think I asked her a question about something only a couple of times during the course of my shift... and in no way did I interfere with her time. Actually, I saved her time by doing things she would have otherwise had to do for this particular patient (pushing meds thru a dobhoff, hanging IVPBs thru a PICC via pump, BGMs w/insulin coverage, maintaining pt's continuous tube feed, trach care, JP drain care, etc...) I was busy with him all day. She thanked me when I left for the day for my help - not my "hinderance".

    We're not so bad, really. Give us a chance :-)

    Peace... Laurie
    Last edit by PedsNurse322 on Apr 3, '07 : Reason: typos
  9. by   Tweety
    Quote from wdwpixie
    Yeah, I neglected to add that I'm in another hospital this semester and it's like night and day. I'm EXCITED to think about working with this group of nurses, techs, etc. They are kind, answer questions, don't roll their eyes, hide equipment, and they HELP us!! I've applied for an internship with this facility and their sister facility based on this experience. I let my CI and also the recruiter when she called to talk about the position know how MUCH I enjoy being there and love the staff.
    I'm glad to hear you've realized not all places are that bad. I was thinking as I was reading the op that they are missing a vital chance at recruiting and helping themselves out. Nursing students are not going to work for a facility that is unwelcoming. Nursing students will gladly join a short-staffed busy stressful unit if it has the right team spirit.

    I recently took a charge nurse position and the one thing I said was "the worst part about is I won't be able to be with the students." I precepted all the time. I was going to get a senior student for precepting later this month and had to assign her to someone else and I ached a little bit. Every Thursday a couple of accelerated BSN students came and I always took on a beginner for the day for one-on-one work (they do a preceptorship for all clinicals rather than appear as a group with an instructor)

    Having students though is rough, I love to teach and explain things and challenge the students with questions. At the end of the day when they say their goodbyes, I'm there longer finishing up what I couldn't get done. It's not always about having someone do my work for me making my job easier. But I love it and wouldn't have it any other way.

    I completely totally agree with the concept that it's every nurses job to guide the next generation of nursing students. And that might entail "picking up the slack" from time to time.
  10. by   PedsNurse322
    Whoa... stop the presses.

    I just went back and read thru some of your posts, Charlies... and here's a nugget from you dated 3/4/07:

    Hi,

    what is the difference between CCU, ICU, and acute care?

    also, what is the best way path to getting onto a trauma team, like the ones you see on 'critical hour' for example.

    thanks
    Ummm... how long have you been a nurse?

    From you on 2/19/07:

    I am in my final semester...
    Oh, I'm sorry, you're still a STUDENT, right?

    I am LMAO right now.
    Last edit by PedsNurse322 on Apr 3, '07 : Reason: add-on
  11. by   queenjean
    However suspect Charlie's credentials are (and there are many of us who are nurses and students simultaneously, myself included, just FYI), he has a point. This is one of the few professions where, almost no matter where you go, you are expected to mentor/precept students. Not everyone is cut out to be a teacher (as we all are well aware). While I know our charge nurse tries to ask a nurse's permission before placing a student with him/her, she primarily makes her assignments based on the patients--which ones are appropriate for students.

    I think in this discussion, I don't necessarily completely agree with Charlie or his/her attitude, I do agree that it is difficult and professionally dangerous at times to have a student. I'm not sure that the ANA's Code of Ethics (is the ANA *THE ONLY* authority on all things nursing?) necessarily means that every nurse must appropriately mentor all students in any environment the student or school sees fit. It could also be interpreted as donating time or money to your alma mater. Supporting organizations that in some manner -- through scholarships, classes, or legislative lobbying -- that support continuing education or primary education of nurses. Being a member of an organization such as the ANA, or a specialty organization (like AWOHHN, etc) would be an example. Helping organize a conference, raising money for scholarships, teaching a CEU class--all these things are also supporting the education of nurses and nursing students.

    If we are ALL expected to be mentors, part of our education should be HOW TO TEACH NURSING STUDENTS. Would you want your child educated by someone who has never had any experience or guidance in teaching? Why is your education any less important?

    I wish that when schools sent students onto the floor, they at least communicated more specifically with the charge and floor nurses about what to expect. Not "These are third semester med/surg students, do you have any interesting patients for them?" Something like "These are third semester med/surg students who have checked off on X,Y, and Z and need experience in A,B, and C. They are more than able to independently perform E, F, and G, but have not yet had instruction in M, N, and O and should not be expected to know how to do these things. Some of our goals for this clinical rotation are R, S, and T. We are new to your facility, so please help them with the computer system and the charting."

    Why, if schools utilize the same facilities semester after semester, is not some continuing communication like that available to the preceptors? Would it kill the school to give each unit, prior to the start of the clinical rotation, a single sheet of paper briefly outlining what the students have already learned, what their specific objectives are for that clinical rotation, and a list of specific tasks, procedures, etc that the nursing students should either be performing independently, or should be assisted with/exposed to during that clinical rotation? The problems that Charlie and I have presented in this discussion are not necessarily always (or even mostly) the fault of the student or the floor nurse--it seems to me that the school and the floor director have some culpability here in terms of providing the floor nurses with enough specific information to be optimal, prepared preceptors.
    Last edit by queenjean on Apr 3, '07
  12. by   WDWpixieRN
    Quote from tweety
    but i love it and wouldn't have it any other way.
    thank you!!

    on behalf of all ns who have had bad days with their rns and staff, it's the rns like you that make us continue on to another day and hopefully, eventually, graduation!!

    :kiss
  13. by   PedsNurse322
    I wish that when schools sent students onto the floor, they at least communicated more specifically with the charge and floor nurses about what to expect. Not "These are third semester med/surg students, do you have any interesting patients for them?" Something like "These are third semester med/surg students who have checked off on X,Y, and Z and need experience in A,B, and C. They are more than able to independently perform E, F, and G, but have not yet had instruction in M, N, and O and should not be expected to know how to do these things. Some of our goals for this clinical rotation are R, S, and T. We are new to your facility, so please help them with the computer system and the charting."

    Why, if schools utilize the same facilities semester after semester, is not some continuing communication like that available to the preceptors? Would it kill the school to give each unit, prior to the start of the clinical rotation, a single sheet of paper briefly outlining what the students have already learned, what their specific objectives are for that clinical rotation, and a list of specific tasks, procedures, etc that the nursing students should either be performing independently, or should be assisted with/exposed to during that clinical rotation?
    That is exactly what my school/instructor does. Perhaps that is why we haven't yet had any major problems thus far. And no, I do not expect the RNs to "teach" me, per se, or be responsible for me... but I think that if I have a question about their patient or that patient's care, I would hope that they would be approachable and helpful, that's all. For anything requiring involved teaching, I go to my instructor.

    Does that make more sense?

    ~Laurie

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