Online BSN - Is it taken seriously? - page 3
I am specifically posting this in the Nursing forum to get advice from actively practicing nurses, so please don't move! I have heard some recommend online ADN-BSN programs from those... Read More
Oct 25, '12That's not to say that an MSN from Yale, Georgetown, or UCSF isn't going to impress more than one from one of the for-profit online. But BSN is really just a box-check, the curriculum is pretty much standard.
Oct 25, '12Quote from GeneralJinjurAre you taking in consideration lost wages for attending a brick and mortar school? You can potentially work full time while getting your degree online where as doing the same in a traditional school would next to impossible (depending on your job and hours of course).It's accepted where I live, but you can do much better price-wise with one of the many statethat also offer online classes. In my case, I can get my RN-BSN for a little over 5K, whereas UOP wanted to charge me around 20K.
Quote from GrnTeaTrust me, online education is not less challenging, only challenging in a different way. Some of us don't need to be spoon fed and hand-held through our entire educational process and some of us work much better at our on pace and teaching ourselves (take it from me, a classic introvert).Um, no, it's not. The letters are the same and the piece of paper is the same, but the education sure as heck is not. Alas, the people who know this from experience will never convince the ones who like their education with fewer challenges -- and fewer genuine interpersonal relations and collaboration-- than the real thing.
Discuss with your study group and make a presentation to the class.
See how rude it is to make snide comments about people who may not learn the same way you do? ;-)
I'm glad you got a lot from your traditional education, but it isn't for everyone because people have different learning styles and obligations. I've done both and frankly found online more challenging because you have to be so self-disciplined and motivated.
That being said, brick and mortar or online, your education will only be as good as the effort you put in to learn and understand the material.
Oct 25, '12Quote from JZ_RNGee, the people who went 4 years straight, probably have debt from over-priced tuition and who sat through class after class to get their BSN will do anything to feel superior to us ASN nurses, even when we get our BSN, but in the more convenient and less expensive way. NEWSFLASH- BSN is BSN. And an RN is an RN. We take the same classes and the same NCLEX-RN. Proud to be an RN who started ADN and who used online BSN. Don't like it? Too bad. Go pay your loans.
Just so tired of being put down for doing things that are actually positive. Don't have a BSN. You're crap. Didn't go to a physical class at a 4 year school? You're crap.
Get off your high horses people.
The debt from people who went "4 years straight" will generally have debt in the same ballpark whether they took their classes online or not at the same, or a similarly ranked institution. Many private online curriculums (e.g. UOP) are typically more expensive.
I am a hard advocate for online curriculums, I think it's ridiculous that it took this long for institutions to get their head out of the sand and start using online formats... that said, it's very unfortunate that many people (especially prospective students) don't have even a working grasp of how various programs differ in rigor, and how such can affect later education pursuits... irrespective of what occupation is being sought.
A 3.0 GPA from a school like University of Phoenix (UOP) isn't respected the same as a 3.0 from a school like LSU, which requires at least College Algebra and General Chemistry to earn the BSN... and that's relatively speaking near the bottom of the BSN requirement scale. There are schools that require several courses of Chemistry and Calculus.
So... if you're applying to a practitioner program at Johns Hopkins, or applying to an anesthesia program at Rush, *all else being equal*, which candidate seems more qualified and better educated based on their degree alone? (1) The nurse who completed a UOP RN-BSN program (2) the nurse who took at traditional route at school that required her to take college algebra and general chemistry (not that intro chem. that some schools accept) (3) the nurse who had to take calculus, general and organic chemistry.
Remember "all else being equal"...
1. Which is statistically most likely to be successful at a top 10 program?
2. Which is statistically most likely to have an easier time with understanding biochemical concepts?
Look, it isn't a secret to those of us who've been around higher education enough to know that students used to major in "easy" majors just so they could apply to grad school with a high GPA.
Majors like psychology, sociology, etc., have historically been used by many for that very purpose... it's a lot easier to get accepted with a 4.0 in Psychology, and apply to a limited seat MSN program (for those with previous degree) than having a 2.8 GPA in Chemical Engineering and doing the same, because many schools just plug your numbers into a formula (e.g. GPA + test score)... and that's unfortunate.
The brighter side is that many schools (law schools, med schools, etc...) have started to really pay attention to the RIGOR of a particular person's degree program. It isn't the "name" of the school that is bad, but rather flimsy non-rigorous programs that particular types of schools are mostly associated with.
Saying a BSN is like any other BSN just isn't true, nor even reasonable to think so. The reality is that a rigorous program (whether it's online or traditional doesn't matter) will prepare you for things that most people don't think about. When you take the GRE, GMAT, MCAT (should you want to branch off into other aspects of the medical field); the courses you took in your BSN curriculum could be the difference between you making a few points higher on your standardized test score, which could make the difference between you getting accepted to that PA (Pathology Assist.), Anesthesia (CRNA or AA), or NP program at a well respected university. Truth be told, it (the rigor of your BSN) can even make a decisive difference on how well you do on the analytical section "games" of the LSAT !
Just because two RNs passed the NCLEX doesn't mean they have even *remotely* close to the same *quality* of education and that's a very important reality. Whether it all makes a difference or not depends on what you want to do with your life and career.
To answer the OPs question: No one really cares whether your body warmed a seat in a traditional format or whether you took classes online in your bathrobe and slippers with screaming kids in the background. It doesn't matter. Generally you get the same diploma whether you did most of your work online or otherwise. I would be less concerned about whether the program is "online" and most concerned with how the curriculum and institution measures up to traditional standards. Accreditation is only the bottom rung of standards to be met as two schools can be accredited by one of the accrediting bodies that matter, but one school might have high standards and the other school might give out diplomas that aren't worth the paper it's printed on as far as anyone is concerned. Know the difference!
It's not about people on their "high horse" or people ragging on ASN nurses. It's about the type of people that you *usually* get in the applicant pool (whether it's for a job or degree), when the nurse (or initial applicant) has already been subjected to a high educational standard.
Oct 25, '12My online BSN included 180 clinical hours, face to face lectures, and group projects, including a presentation. I had to visit the campus once per semester, and twice during one semester. A lot of these types of degrees are somewhat hybrid, with the majority being done online.
Oct 25, '12Quote from Aurora77I'm another one who dislikes group work, and not because I don't work well with others. You need to do well in school and make it through. If a few of us didn't take the lead, I would most assuredly have failed nursing school. The sad fact is, some people either don't care, or don't have the aptitude to actually understand the task, yet you're stuck with them in a group situation. Everyone knows these types. As a result, a few students do most of the work and everyone receives the credit.So true. My LPN-ASN bridge used lots of study groups and group work. Drove me batty! I learn best when I can listen to the lecture, then be left alone somewhere quiet where I can read, review, and do homework. Group work just meant I had to spend more time studying less efficiently. My online BSN program is perfect for me. We have classes that we can attend in real time or listen to later. I've learned so much and it's from a reputable state school, so I don't see why getting my BSN online is going to hurt my career.
Oct 25, '12While I've heard people say a degree from places like U of P is considered a joke, I've never actually heard of anyone having an issue. I work for a very large hospital corporation, who is the biggest health care provider in the area I live. They have 5 hospitals, 2 home care agencies, tons of clinics, etc. They have actually just paired with Phoenix. Online programs are improving and becoming way more popular. Working nurses, with families, many can't go to class, they can't afford to pay sitters, have the time out of the house on top of work. So it seems people are getting on board with that. I'm in an online program for RN to BSN. Compared to a friend who actually goes to class, honestly our course work is very similar. Big difference is, we read the book on our own, they have someone who pretty much just reads it to them. My school also has a brick and mortar behind it.
Oct 25, '12Quote from GrnTeaGrntea....I agree with you. There is a difference with curriculum in a brick and mortar schools and online.Um, no, it's not. The letters are the same and the piece of paper is the same, but the education sure as heck is not. Alas, the people who know this from experience will never convince the ones who like their education with fewer challenges -- and fewer genuine interpersonal relations and collaboration-- than the real thing.
Discuss with your study group and make a presentation to the class.
Oct 25, '12Quote from jtmarcy12What's the difference? Can you post some specific examples?
Grntea....I agree with you. There is a difference with curriculum in a brick and mortar schools and online.
Oct 25, '12Quote from GrnTeaI'd say this may be partly true - but only with respect to those schools who deliver on-line content only (and who tend not to be regionally accredited either). Many brick and mortar schools offer their programs both on on-line and as traditional classroom courses. The curriculum is identical, but the delivery is different - though admitedly, only one has actual face to face contact. The fact is though, more and more schools are offering coursework on-line so for the most the part, it's become a distinction without a meaningful difference. On a related issue, in real terms, how does anyone know if you were an on-line or traditional student when your diploma - along with those of all the other grads - says "Bachelor of Science (Nursing) , Brick and Mortar University, State College, USA"?Um, no, it's not. The letters are the same and the piece of paper is the same, but the education sure as heck is not. Alas, the people who know this from experience will never convince the ones who like their education with fewer challenges -- and fewer genuine interpersonal relations and collaboration-- than the real thing.
Discuss with your study group and make a presentation to the class.
Oct 25, '12Quote from joanna73I completed the traditional classroom MBA program at a top 40 US B-school that required a significant number of group projects. I hated them because you inevitably got paired with some slackers and you did twice (or more) the amount of work they did, yet got the same grade. The point is, this happens whether it's a traditional classroom or a virtual setting. Actually, life is exactly the same - Pareto's principle writ large - where 80% of the work gets done by 20% of the personnel. In my company, your reward for doing a good job is to get more work. After all, someone's got to pull the wagon for the others to ride on . . .I'm another one who dislikes group work, and not because I don't work well with others. You need to do well in school and make it through. If a few of us didn't take the lead, I would most assuredly have failed nursing school. The sad fact is, some people either don't care, or don't have the aptitude to actually understand the task, yet you're stuck with them in a group situation. Everyone knows these types. As a result, a few students do most of the work and everyone receives the credit.
Oct 27, '12I think that the only way someone would really know that it was online instead of face to face is if your address was like California, with a current California job and work experience and your school was like New York University or something at the same time.
Oct 27, '12Quote from tnmarieI guess I wasn't completely clear. Here it is again: "It's accepted where I live, but you can do much better price-wise with one of the many state schools that also offer online classes. In my case, I can get my RN-BSN for a little over 5K, whereas UOP wanted to charge me around 20K."Are you taking in consideration lost wages for attending a brick and mortar school? You can potentially work full time while getting your degree online where as doing the same in a traditional school would next to impossible (depending on your job and hours of course).
My state schools' RN-BSN is offered online, as are all the other state RN-BSN programs I have looked at. I won't lose any wages to do online classes through a state school. UoP has an uphill battle trying to persuade me that their online courses are worth 2-3x the price of any other school.