help, i didn't know i did something wrong - page 3

hello everyone, hope somebody can help. i'm a per diem nurse and work at several hospitals. two of the hospitals require acls. when i went for my recert, i billed both hospital for fulfilling... Read More

  1. by   jjjoy
    Maybe there was an element of not understanding what the extra payment was for -was to function as reimbursement or was it some kind of incentive or bonus pay?

    If policy is that whenever an employee got recert'd that they get a little bonus from the facility, then it's not a problem. If on a holiday or for nurses' day or whatever, a facility gives out a small financial bonus, it's not wrong to accept such a bonus at more than one place.

    But if the policy of payment is supposed to be for either reimbursement of time (to take the class) or for class costs, then to submit two different reimbursement requests for the same item is a problem.

    Yes, it's not fair that one facility would end up footing the bill while the other one still benefitted, but it would be even less fair for the nurse to actually make more money back than was invested in the cost of the course.

    I can see where some confusion might come up if the facility is paying for one's time as that pay is usually a token amount that doesn't come close to matching one's wages and thus isn't as clearly "double-dipping" as it would be if both were clearly paying full hourly wage for class time.

    I can also see where someone might rationalize the questionable pratice of submitting for time reimbursement at two places since each was willing to pay for it and there's no clear receipt of amount owed as there would be if it were the facility were specifically reimbursing the nurse for the cost of the class. It would easy to conclude that one has just gotten lucky that both facilities are willing to pay for the class time. And it might even work out that way in some places with each facility not having any question of whether or not the time was reimbursed elsewhere.

    To me it sounded the the OP wasn't really sure exactly where she went wrong and to just tell her it should be obvious it was wrong doesn't do much to enlighten her. I know I hate when someone ascribes a reason to my mistake than doesn't fit with my experience. In this case, hey, if a person can get paid twice for the same thing and it's okay, why not? But it appears that the OP misjudged the situation and has ended up in some hot water.

    So... was the mistake that she thought she could get away with getting paid twice for the same thing? Was the mistake made in assuming that the policy was more like a bonus than a reimbursement? Was the mistake in thinking only about her benefits and not about the costs to the facility and the purpose of the payment? Heck, maybe the OP only got found out because she made the mistake of bragging to colleague about the double payment.

    Regardless of what the OP's intent was (deliberate, unthinking, chosen ignorance), the OP now has to deal with it. Some good advice has been given on how to move on with minimal damage.
  2. by   TazziRN
    Quote from jjjoy
    To me it sounded the the OP wasn't really sure exactly where she went wrong and to just tell her it should be obvious it was wrong doesn't do much to enlighten her.
    Umm.....go back and reread the posts......I do believe that several, if not all of us, spelled it out.
  3. by   strive4mores
    hi
    thank you all for your response and help. i'm embarrassed that i used poor judgment and got myself into such a mess. i'm hoping i do not lose my job for my error.

    i did want to clariify that i never billed two hospital for the cost of ACLS. Both hospitals allow me 16 hours education time per year for job requirements, skills pertaining to my job, etc. That was how i made my bad judgment. i asked for reimbursement for 8 hours education from two facilities that required a particular certification.

    thanks again for all your help and direction.





    Quote from jjjoy
    Maybe there was an element of not understanding what the extra payment was for -was to function as reimbursement or was it some kind of incentive or bonus pay?

    If policy is that whenever an employee got recert'd that they get a little bonus from the facility, then it's not a problem. If on a holiday or for nurses' day or whatever, a facility gives out a small financial bonus, it's not wrong to accept such a bonus at more than one place.

    But if the policy of payment is supposed to be for either reimbursement of time (to take the class) or for class costs, then to submit two different reimbursement requests for the same item is a problem.

    Yes, it's not fair that one facility would end up footing the bill while the other one still benefitted, but it would be even less fair for the nurse to actually make more money back than was invested in the cost of the course.

    I can see where some confusion might come up if the facility is paying for one's time as that pay is usually a token amount that doesn't come close to matching one's wages and thus isn't as clearly "double-dipping" as it would be if both were clearly paying full hourly wage for class time.

    I can also see where someone might rationalize the questionable pratice of submitting for time reimbursement at two places since each was willing to pay for it and there's no clear receipt of amount owed as there would be if it were the facility were specifically reimbursing the nurse for the cost of the class. It would easy to conclude that one has just gotten lucky that both facilities are willing to pay for the class time. And it might even work out that way in some places with each facility not having any question of whether or not the time was reimbursed elsewhere.

    To me it sounded the the OP wasn't really sure exactly where she went wrong and to just tell her it should be obvious it was wrong doesn't do much to enlighten her. I know I hate when someone ascribes a reason to my mistake than doesn't fit with my experience. In this case, hey, if a person can get paid twice for the same thing and it's okay, why not? But it appears that the OP misjudged the situation and has ended up in some hot water.

    So... was the mistake that she thought she could get away with getting paid twice for the same thing? Was the mistake made in assuming that the policy was more like a bonus than a reimbursement? Was the mistake in thinking only about her benefits and not about the costs to the facility and the purpose of the payment? Heck, maybe the OP only got found out because she made the mistake of bragging to colleague about the double payment.

    Regardless of what the OP's intent was (deliberate, unthinking, chosen ignorance), the OP now has to deal with it. Some good advice has been given on how to move on with minimal damage.
  4. by   ♪♫ in my ♥
    This whole situation brings up a point that's worth remembering for all of us.

    Often, when deciding something, it's not simply a matter of whether one thinks it's OK. One should also consider how others might view the situation. If one finds themselves having to justify their action to themselves then it's likely that said action might not be well-received by others.

    Sometimes it doesn't matter whether you're justified in what you decided; sometimes the likely opinions of others should be the deciding factor.

    The more that you have to debate something with yourself, the more likely it is that you'll find opposing opinions in others.
  5. by   llg
    Quote from ♪♫ in my ♥
    This whole situation brings up a point that's worth remembering for all of us.

    Often, when deciding something, it's not simply a matter of whether one thinks it's OK. One should also consider how others might view the situation. If one finds themselves having to justify their action to themselves then it's likely that said action might not be well-received by others.

    Sometimes it doesn't matter whether you're justified in what you decided; sometimes the likely opinions of others should be the deciding factor.

    The more that you have to debate something with yourself, the more likely it is that you'll find opposing opinions in others.
    Wow! Great post.

    When I have to think about a situation a lot in order to figure it out or justify a decision I am trying to make ... I find it helpful to get a few other opinions. That's especially true if the person who might disagree or have a problem with my decision is my boss.

    Sometimes, I'll decide to take a risk an make the controversial decision. But I'll only do that when I am willing to pay the consequences if other people disagree with me.

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