union pro or con - page 4

does your hospital have a union for the nurses? if so has it helped or not? why do nurses constantly eat each other rather than say have a more powerful labor voice when... Read More

  1. by   Chico David RN
    Quote from laborer
    Lets get real, " Employee Free Choice Act " will pass hands down this year....... Praise the Lord and pass the bullets http://www.aflcio.org/joinaunion/voiceatwork/efca/
    In my book EFCA will be a very good thing for the workers of America, including nurses - BUT, by making organizing easier it will trigger a land rush of non-nurse unions fighting to sign up as many nurses as possible as fast as possible. While the process of organizing today is very difficult and the boss has all the upper hand, the one good thing about that is that it forces unions to do a really thorough job of educating and communicating with those they are seeking to organize. RNs are some of the highest paid hourly workers in the US, simply because we are so educated and so much in demand, so lots of unions will be anxious to sign us up. It's my firm belief that RNs are best served by a union that understands our professional issues - not by a union that largely represents steelworkers, or truck drivers or building maintenance people or even teachers. They may be fine unions (or not) but their issues and concerns are not the same as ours. The state nurses associations that are also effective unions, like NYSNA, PASNAP in Pennsylvania, MNA in Massachusetts and CNA/NNOC are the models to look to.
  2. by   HM2VikingRN
    Quote from Iam46yearsold
    Unions will never solve the problem, only add to the problem. Unions exhibit greed like anyone else. The single most important item on any strike is "PAY" everything else is just smoke.
    Pay always enters into every discussion about working conditions. I know that MNA has fought for safe staffing language, No mandatory OT laws and pensions. The last strike was primarily driven by nurse concerns about patient safety in MPLS/St Paul hospitals.

    Strong unions lead to better run organizations.
  3. by   HM2VikingRN
    Quote from Iam46yearsold
    But lets not forget the extremely high amount of corruption and criminal activity that has plagued the history of union activity in this country. And where is Jimmy Hoffa buried anyway. Does all this corruption become sanctified just because we think it is for our benefit.

    Nursing does very well at keeping all of us comfortable. The number of nurses Ive known who have raised their 4 or 5 or 6 and even one I know who f
    has raised his 7 children and put them through college. I think that sounds like nursing is successful to me. Nurse who get into trouble are really a small per centage. Everyone else like anything else gets by nicely if they apply themselves. You dont need a union with a history of corruption for that.
    Sources for your corruption allegations???? (And not a Chamber of Commerce astroturf press release or a Readers Digest article.)

    I know of more than one person who was ran out of an organization by an unethical manger. Employees with long histories of good service to their organization who were not troublemakers and the union saved them.

    Corruption in any organization is wrong. (I don't tolerate it in my own local.)

    Compare human outcomes for states with a strong union history to those of "Right to Work for less" states. On every outcome the Unions have been the advocates for good schools and access to good health care.
  4. by   OrthoRN09
    I currently work for a non-union hospital. I prefer it this way.
  5. by   Honnte et Srieux
    Quote from HM2Viking
    Sources for your corruption allegations???? (And not a Chamber of Commerce astroturf press release or a Readers Digest article.)

    I know of more than one person who was ran out of an organization by an unethical manger. Employees with long histories of good service to their organization who were not troublemakers and the union saved them.

    Corruption in any organization is wrong. (I don't tolerate it in my own local.)

    Compare human outcomes for states with a strong union history to those of "Right to Work for less" states. On every outcome the Unions have been the advocates for good schools and access to good health care.
    There is insufficient room on this forum to share the extensive, chronic, and routine behavior of corruption in labor unions.

    Would a reference by the CNA about the corruption of the SEIU be sufficient? http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/s...f,353391.shtml

    So please tell us just what you've done to address the corruption in your "own local."

    We know it's there, I'd just like to hear what you've done, especially since you claimed to be intolerant of it.
  6. by   Honnte et Srieux
    Quote from RN4MERCY
    So, the question is, "union pro or con." And your response just doesn't make any sense to me. Oh, I get the fact that you're anti-union alright. But you're trying to taint the whole labor movement because of a corrupt individual? Do you disparage religion because of a greedy pastor or two? Do you disparage government because of a crooked politician?

    I don't recall reading a post anywhere in this forum where the author spoke about corruption being of benefit to anyone.
    Might have a point except the whole labor movement is tainted...it's not just a "greedy union steward or two."
  7. by   Honnte et Srieux
    It seems to me that pro-union people are often pro-universal health care.

    Doesn't make sense.

    Why would they think that the gov't is the best agency to provide health care, but a non-gov't union is required to take care of employees. Why can't the gov't do better at both?
  8. by   RN4MERCY
    Quote from Honnte et Srieux
    It seems to me that pro-union people are often pro-universal health care.
    Doesn't make sense.
    It makes perfect sense. If you're not healthy, you can't work.
    According to Professor Michael Yates,
    "Unions are still one of the best hopes for working people, whether it involves nitty gritty issues like protecting workers against unjust firings or enforcing safer workplaces, or larger concerns like securing more control over the work process or democratizing the entire economy. With the world economy in recession some employers see this as the moment to crush unions once and for all. Now is the moment for unions to build a broad social movement that can advance labor's vision of a better society, centered on the needs of all working people.
    I happen to agree with him. If you don't, go out and enjoy your eight hour day, your lunch break, your weekend and holiday pay, and safer patient care in California, due to legislated standards for safe RN-to-patient staffing ratios. And the fact that there are laws against child labor, unsafe work places, mandatory overtime, and discrimination against women and people of color in the workplace. Courtesy of labor union members' social and political advocacy. You're welcome.
  9. by   Honnte et Srieux
    Quote from RN4MERCY
    It makes perfect sense. If you're not healthy, you can't work.
    According to Professor Michael Yates,


    I happen to agree with him. If you don't, go out and enjoy your eight hour day, your lunch break, your weekend and holiday pay, and safer patient care in California, due to legislated standards for safe RN-to-patient staffing ratios. And the fact that there are laws against child labor, unsafe work places, mandatory overtime, and discrimination against women and people of color in the workplace. Courtesy of labor union members' social and political advocacy. You're welcome.
    And California is broke and ranks 32 out of 42 states on healthcare (in an article published on WebMD).

    No thanks.

    BTW, laws against gender/racial discrimination, child labor, and unsafe work places are not some elements unique to Cali.

    Oddly, I work in a non-union facility (not in Cali, I left years ago) where I always get a lunch break, make weekend and holiday pay, and never exceed 1:2 ratios in the ICU where I work. We are the only tertiary facility of it's kind to make the Fortune's "100 Best Companies to Work For."

    Can you explain why the only Cali Hospital to make that list is a non-union hospital? I thought unions were supposed to make things better for the employees?
  10. by   K98
    The only tangible difference the SEIU has made at our facility is the 840.00 per year drain they have put on each RN's paycheck. They come around every 3 years and hand out some purple and yellow buttons, then fade away and collect their 1.1 million dollars per year in dues from our cash cow, er, I mean hospital. Unions can be a good thing, especially in health care, but avoid ServingEmployerInsteadOfUs like the plague.
  11. by   herring_RN
    i'd rather work without the pompons, hot dogs, cheerleaders, and even the $900.00. there are no nursing care or patient care criteria.
    what makes it so great?
    last year managers at the nonprofit hospital hand-­delivered success shares of nearly $900 per employee for improvements in patient satisfaction and held rallies with pompons, hot dogs, cheerleaders.

    http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortu...pshots/59.html
    violations:
    - the hospital failed to ensure that pharmacists responding to medical emergencies (code blue) were trained and competent before recommending doses of all medications used in a medical emergency. inadwequate dose of narcan recommended - http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...1-20080418.pdf

    - [color=#4c4c4c]the hospital failed to develop and implement policies a procedures to protect patient safety related to the use of controlled substances. a fentanyl patch was applied following surgery for acute post operative pain which is a contraindication according to the black box warning statement... - http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...1-20080307.pdf

    - [color=#4c4c4c]the hospital failed to protect a patient's right to considerate and respectful care. the patient had undergone an invasive cardiac procedure, and was lying on a gurney awaiting transfer to an intensive care unit, when the physician who had performed the invasive procedure proceeded to verbally and physically abuse the patient. - http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...ent-bm3p11.pdf

    - [color=#4c4c4c]the hospital failed to implement policies and procedures to provide for effective surgical service infection control. - http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...ent-zskg11.pdf

    - [color=#4c4c4c]the hospital failed to ensure the patient safety in the surgical department when a patient fell off an operating table during surgery
    http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...ent-hjze11.pdf

    - [color=#4c4c4c]the hospital failed to have a safe, effective and timely system for dispensing and administering medications. - http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...ent-n64l11.pdf
    -
  12. by   Honnte et Srieux
    Quote from herring_rn
    i’d rather work without the pompons, hot dogs, cheerleaders, and even the $900.00. there are no nursing care or patient care criteria.

    violations:
    - the hospital failed to ensure that pharmacists responding to medical emergencies (code blue) were trained and competent before recommending doses of all medications used in a medical emergency. inadwequate dose of narcan recommended - http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...1-20080418.pdf

    - [color=#4c4c4c]the hospital failed to develop and implement policies a procedures to protect patient safety related to the use of controlled substances. a fentanyl patch was applied following surgery for acute post operative pain which is a contraindication according to the black box warning statement… - http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...1-20080307.pdf

    - [color=#4c4c4c]the hospital failed to protect a patient's right to considerate and respectful care. the patient had undergone an invasive cardiac procedure, and was lying on a gurney awaiting transfer to an intensive care unit, when the physician who had performed the invasive procedure proceeded to verbally and physically abuse the patient. - http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...ent-bm3p11.pdf

    - [color=#4c4c4c]the hospital failed to implement policies and procedures to provide for effective surgical service infection control. - http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...ent-zskg11.pdf

    - [color=#4c4c4c]the hospital failed to ensure the patient safety in the surgical department when a patient fell off an operating table during surgery
    http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...ent-hjze11.pdf

    - [color=#4c4c4c]the hospital failed to have a safe, effective and timely system for dispensing and administering medications. - http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...ent-n64l11.pdf
    -
    and ironically, this was still the best in california.

    one can only shudder to think what is happening in the rest of the state if this is the best-foot-forward for employees.

    is the implication here that the hospital does worse in treating their patients than unionized hospitals that didn't make the list?

    are you thinking that i couldn't go to the cdph website and find reams of violations in facilities that are unionized?
  13. by   herring_RN
    Let me know if I'm wrong.
    It seems that 60% of all Admistrative Penalty assessments in San Diego County were regarding Scripps hospitals.

    http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/facil...ySanDiego.aspx

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