Why would anyone do this? ACNP + CRNA

  1. 0 From Vanderbilt's Website......

    Students who complete the Master of Science in Nursing (MSN) Program within the Acute Care Nurse Practitioner (ACNP) Program at VUSN and who meet other criteria for admission to Middle Tennessee School of Anesthesia (MTSA) will be eligible for an early interview and potential acceptance decision at MTSA. An early interview/admission process is one that occurs before the general MTSA interview/admission process that occurs in January of each year. The student will be awarded the MSN degree by Vanderbilt upon successful completion of the ACNP program at VUSN, and will be awarded the Master of Science with a Focus in Nurse Anesthesia degree by MTSA upon successful completion of the nurse anesthesia program at MTSA. A student who completes both degrees will be expected to be trained to function in the advanced practice roles of ACNP and certified nurse anesthetist (CRNA). Students who are interested in this option need to contact MTSA for further information about their admission requirements and application process. MTSA contact information:
    Why would you need/want both?

    Donn C.
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  3. Visit  UCDSICURN profile page

    About UCDSICURN

    40 Years Old; Joined Feb '04; Posts: 287; Likes: 12.

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    23 Comments so far...

  4. Visit  Kiwi profile page
    0
    I also read about this in MTSA's catalog (which is available on their website).

    If you are not aware of it, MTSA does early interviews. The candidate for the early interview has to have a 3.5 overall GPA, and 3.5 science GPA to be afforded an early interview.

    Then, there are the "feeder schools", with relationships to MTSA in regards to early interviews. The candidate from a feeder school doesn't necessarily have to have the 3.5 GPA. Graduates from these schools are automatically given an early interview if they meet all of the requirements for MTSA. Besides Vandy, there are a few more schools that are feeder schools.

    Over half of the students accepted to MTSA were accepted after an early interview, to quote the dean.
  5. Visit  zrmorgan profile page
    0
    could you practice as icu arnp with this degree as well as anesthesia? looks like a dual specialty program.
  6. Visit  catcolalex profile page
    0
    Well, if you had way too much money and felt as if you needed to spend more on tuition, books, fees, etc. it might be just the thing to do.
  7. Visit  sproutsfriend profile page
    0
    The assistant dean at the nursing school where I'm obtaining my CRNA training from has indicated to many of us that obtaining both CNP and CRNA credentials would allow you to broaden your practice in rural small town areas. You could practice some of the week as a CRNA and CNP. This doesn't appeal to me. Although a CNP has prescribing privileges and this could help the CRNA possibly branch into pain management to a greater degree.
  8. Visit  nursetim profile page
    0
    How about this scenario. Unable to work ICU due to back injury so unable to get ICU experience. Gets ACNP degree and works ICU for a year or two. Viola! ICU experience, light on the back. More expensive I'll grant you, but an alternative. Clever!, no???? :caduceus:
  9. Visit  dfk profile page
    0
    not even sure one could practice both roles at the same time.. where i work, an RT became an RN, and could only practice one role at a time.. whether it's insurance purposes/hospital based/... whatever, but not even sure it would be a good idea.. maybe tho -
    wouldn't be my choice, and definitely not worth it for the prescriptive authority alone...
  10. Visit  MaleAPRN profile page
    4
    I for one, am an example of a future DUAL ROLE APN. I will be graduating in a few weeks from Nurse Anesthesia school. I am also a Nurse Practitioner (been working as NP in ED in California for a few years until I decided to move to go to NA school). Since this thread, I didn't think there were a lot of dual role NP's out there...i.e., NP + CRNA (maybe there are a handful of them). I was determined to function in these 2 roles (NP/CRNA) and I will soon manage to make it work.

    A few months ago, I had offered my services as an NP to the anesthesia group that also signed me on as a future CRNA. I will be providing my NP services in the Pain Management clinic where these group of doctors are managing patients with chronic pain. Hiring an NP is new to them. I will be the first NP in their group and they have given me a tremendous opportunity to develop this role as I see fit. I will be working 2 days a week in Pain Management as an NP, and 3 days a week as a future CRNA.

    Being that I will also work for them as a future CRNA, the docs all felt that having me there as an NP as well, will help extend the continuity of care to those patients in the pain clinic that may also present for surgery at some point in time. I will also be helping them see new patients, follow-ups, consults up on the floors, performing nerve blocks and trigger points, and most importantly for them...having my prescriptive privileges (for those med refills). Oh and let's not forget, that hiring an NP is way cheaper than hiring a pain management doctor. PLUS, since I'll be seeing a majority of the in-house pain consults, it'll free some of the docs from doing this, abling them to perform more of the profitable anesthesia procedures up in the surgery suites. CHAAA-CHIIIING!

    WHY DID I DO THIS?

    Well, it's not that I was bored and wanted to SPEND MORE MONEY ON TUITION. I truly believe that having these 2 APN roles are invaluable. (Primarily for me...since it has been a long-term goal of mine.) Especially in a setting wherein an anesthesia group also provides pain management services (rural areas). OR, even as an independent provider for anesthesia and pain management.

    WHY NOT JUST BECOME A DOCTOR? SINCE IT PRETTY MUCH TOOK THAT LONG TO GET HERE.

    I just didn't want to. I wanted to become a nurse and NURSING got me to where I am now. This is an exciting point in my career and if I help pave the way for other APNs out there who may someday want a 2nd, or 3rd and 4th APN degree...then, more power to all of us!
    Last edit by MaleAPRN on Jul 26, '06
  11. Visit  DC+ profile page
    0
    I too have been considering getting both degrees. However, It is my understanding that pay for an NP and for a CRNA are vastly different and that it would be financially wise to max time in the surgical suite as a crna. Is this true for your position? Are you mainly taking on this increased role for love of carreer and sacraficing income or is there a reimbursement equality available with the dual role?
  12. Visit  Ventjock profile page
    0
    Quote from nursetim
    How about this scenario. Unable to work ICU due to back injury so unable to get ICU experience. Gets ACNP degree and works ICU for a year or two. Viola! ICU experience, light on the back. More expensive I'll grant you, but an alternative. Clever!, no???? :caduceus:
    (substitute ACNP for PA-C.)
    now would this work as well for a PA who goes through Excelsior, gets the RN, then works ICU? (AA school seems very limited so far)

    just wondering
  13. Visit  MaleAPRN profile page
    0
    Quote from DC+
    I too have been considering getting both degrees. However, It is my understanding that pay for an NP and for a CRNA are vastly different and that it would be financially wise to max time in the surgical suite as a crna. Is this true for your position? Are you mainly taking on this increased role for love of carreer and sacraficing income or is there a reimbursement equality available with the dual role?
    Although NP and CRNA pay vary greatly, one has to take into account the overall profitability that a dual role APN brings in for a medical organization. There would definitely be a difference in pay for a dual role APN who decides to work in 2 different areas say, not in the same field such as NP in general practice + CRNA.

    But, if you decide to work as an NP in Pain management for the SAME organization and as a CRNA as well, then there is definitely a profit margin that you as a dual role APN will bring into the practice. For example as an NP, one is able to free up Anesthesiologists from seeing pain consults, follow-ups, etc and instead have them do nerve blocks and other more invasive anesthesia related procedures. This brings in more money for the organization in addition to the money that one gets as an NP from insurance companies/medical reimbursements for services rendered.

    So, to answer your question on whether I am doing this for the love of having a dual role under my belt and having to sacrifice a decrease in income...

    I am doing this for the love of being an NP and a soon-to-be CRNA, and I will not be sacrificing a cut in pay.
  14. Visit  MaleAPRN profile page
    0
    Quote from ramiro_ac
    (substitute ACNP for PA-C.)
    now would this work as well for a PA who goes through Excelsior, gets the RN, then works ICU? (AA school seems very limited so far)

    just wondering
    I believe a PA-C practicing in acute care who later decides to get his/her RN/BSN degree will have a very hard time applying to nurse anesthesia school. What ALL NA schools require from RNs are NURSING experience and not patient provider experience.

    IMO, Vanderbilt's decision to admit ACNPs into their Nurse anesthesia program stems from the fact, that these APNs have had acute care nursing experience prior to becoming ACNPs and therefore satisfies their requirement for "acute care nursing experience".

    I, for example got accepted into NA school not because of my NP experience (I am an FNP who practiced in ER for over 2 years prior to applying to NA school), but because I had several years of ICU/ER nursing experience.

    If a PA-C decides to go to NA school, then one would first acquire their RN degree (RN/BSN) and work in acute care for at least one year to be able to be eligible to apply to NA school.

    Hope this helps answer your question.
  15. Visit  Ventjock profile page
    0
    Quote from vinnysca
    I believe a PA-C practicing in acute care who later decides to get his/her RN/BSN degree will have a very hard time applying to nurse anesthesia school. What ALL NA schools require from RNs are NURSING experience and not patient provider experience.

    IMO, Vanderbilt's decision to admit ACNPs into their Nurse anesthesia program stems from the fact, that these APNs have had acute care nursing experience prior to becoming ACNPs and therefore satisfies their requirement for "acute care nursing experience".

    I, for example got accepted into NA school not because of my NP experience (I am an FNP who practiced in ER for over 2 years prior to applying to NA school), but because I had several years of ICU/ER nursing experience.

    If a PA-C decides to go to NA school, then one would first acquire their RN degree (RN/BSN) and work in acute care for at least one year to be able to be eligible to apply to NA school.

    Hope this helps answer your question.
    How about this scenario. Unable to work ICU due to back injury so unable to get ICU experience. Gets ACNP degree and works ICU for a year or two. Viola! ICU experience, light on the back. More expensive I'll grant you, but an alternative. Clever!, no????
    thanks i was wondering because of the post above. if it is true that a NP could do it why couldnt a PA-C/RN? i completely understand that that is how the system works right now. another question tho.... if one was a NP or PA in critical care, wouldnt you consider that a better foundation for CRNA school than being a ICU nurse? ok heres why, look at this...
    http://sh.webhire.com/servlet/av/jd?...i=1775537&sn=I (NP) more in detail description
    http://sh.webhire.com/servlet/av/jd?...i=1779880&sn=I (PA) cut and past job descript.
    both practitioners have same duties and look at what the Critical Care midlevels do (procedure wise as well). doesnt that seem like a MUCH better prep for CRNA school? (intubation, vent management, alines, etc). so if one was a PA-C/RN, or NP, in critical care you wouldnt think one could handle CRNA school, as well as if not better than a ICU nurse? im not trying to stir a debate. i do think critical care experience is important b4 CRNA (ive seen from my short experience the "bad" pts in the ICUs and it takes a different skill set to manage those pts and thats why i mention NPs and PAs in CCM ONLY, not FP, IM, Peds, OB,etc), but why only in the role of ICU nurse? i THINK more midlevels (NPs and PAs) would follow the CRNA route in order to expand their scope of practice. maybe not. at this point i would love to do both, maybe im only dreaming, but would it seem like a great job to not just be "stuck" in the OR, but also have a few days rounding in the ICUs, seeing the progress of pts, and maybe even working in a pain management clinic as well....

    ok that was too much, but its always nice to dream right? ok m rant is over, hopefully others will respond.
    Last edit by Ventjock on Aug 20, '06


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