"Where do climate change deniers, anti-GMO activists, and vaccine conspiracy theorists overlap one another? According to a recent study, described in Mother Jones, they seem to triangulate on a tendency to believe in conspiracies. And evidently, according to the study authors, no single theory has a stronger hold on the minds of such like-tending folk as the vaccines pharmaco-governmento-medico conspiracy theory does. According to Chris Mooney, author of The Republican Brain: The Science of Why They Deny Science-and Reality, and writing at Mother Jones:
The finding may cast a great deal of light on the strange persistence of anti-vaccine views, which have centered on the claim that childhood vaccines are behind an alleged "epidemic" of autism. This assertion has been rejected by scientists. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and the Institute of Medicine have both weighed in strongly on the matter; and one chief proponent of the vaccine concerns, Andrew Wakefield, has even seen his original 1998 paper raising concerns about the MMR (measles, mumps, rubella) vaccine retracted by the journal that published it, The Lancet.
Yet vaccine fears have persisted in the face of all scientific refutation (not to mention medical and public health experts saying that the failure to vaccinate is downright dangerous). And if these beliefs are often conspiratorial, that might help explain why. Almost by definition, conspiracy theories are irrefutable; rejections by scientific authorities just become part of the conspiracy."
Paul Offit is a pediatrician, infectious disease expert, and vaccine expert and has decades of education/research in all of those subjects.
Really? He has decades of education and research on autism? Can you show me something to substantiate that? Has he ever even treated an individual with autism?
Autism was brought up and ASD is most commonly associated with MMR vaccination. It has been proven with or without vaccinations that ASD rates are the same.
Indeed it is, but I was not talking about it. Maybe one day we can. Feel free to discuss what I mentioned. Or don't. Either way, fine by me.
And gluten free diets through meta-analysis/literature reviews have not panned out in CS patients. You are not reviewing articles you are simply looking at abstracts which is often misleading. And again if you think they are pertinent articles then you should post them.
Abstracts can be misleading, which is why I said I would try to take the time to read a few full studies when I had the time. Sorry I haven't had the time yet. I'll get on it as soon as I can. Promise.
I am saying there is no link between vaccines and autism. I think that is pretty plain.
No, you weren't pretty plain, hence my question. Your statement reflected a clear lack of knowledge concerning how the CDC collects its data on the autism prevalence numbers. Unless you are referring to some sort of data that says vaccine compliance was in decline in say 2002 (with relation to the latest numbers), your statement of "In general vaccines administration to children in the United States has gone down and ASD diagnosis has continued to rise" is woefully ignorant of the process. Do I have to provide peer-review science to back that up or is your deliberate dodge of that factoid as close to an admission of being wrong on something I should ever expect to receive from you?
Provide some peer-reviewed scientific evidence to debate. You haven't provided anything of substance to debate that has not been disproven over and over again.
Would you like me to link to something that states that the increase cannot be fully attributable to better diagnosis? Because I'm pretty sure that's the only claim I've made.
Really? He has decades of education and research on autism? Can you show me something to substantiate that? Has he ever even treated an individual with autism?
Indeed it is, but I was not talking about it. Maybe one day we can. Feel free to discuss what I mentioned. Or don't. Either way, fine by me.
Abstracts can be misleading, which is why I said I would try to take the time to read a few full studies when I had the time. Sorry I haven't had the time yet. I'll get on it as soon as I can. Promise.
No, you weren't pretty plain, hence my question. Your statement reflected a clear lack of knowledge concerning how the CDC collects its data on the autism prevalence numbers. Unless you are referring to some sort of data that says vaccine compliance was in decline in say 2002 (with relation to the latest numbers), your statement of "In general vaccines administration to children in the United States has gone down and ASD diagnosis has continued to rise" is woefully ignorant of the process. Do I have to provide peer-review science to back that up or is your deliberate dodge of that factoid as close to an admission of being wrong on something I should ever expect to receive from you?
Would you like me to link to something that states that the increase cannot be fully attributable to better diagnosis? Because I'm pretty sure that's the only claim I've made.
You can link to the studies referenced at the bottom of the page and have a ball with them if you're so inclined.
I never stated he was an expert on Autism, but Offit is a pediatrician and I am sure he has treated more than his fair share of autistic children. It is nearly impossible to be in the healthcare field and not treat an autistic child.
The author states, "Our working assumption is that there are both more children affected and more detected.". I do believe this is possible even though there isn't any current research that can say for sure that this true, and there probably will not be until we know exactly what things can and do cause ASD.
There still isn't one peer-reviewed scientific article that has shown that vaccines are attributable an increase in ASD.
I never stated he was an expert on Autism, but Offit is a pediatrician and I am sure he has treated more than his fair share of autistic children. It is nearly impossible to be in the healthcare field and not treat an autistic child.
As big a fan of his that you care, I would think that you'd be able to reference something in one of his books, particularly the one with "autism" in the title, where he talks about treating kiddos with autism. Does he even practice as a pediatrician anymore?
As big a fan of his that you care, I would think that you'd be able to reference something in one of his books, particularly the one with "autism" in the title, where he talks about treating kiddos with autism. Does he even practice as a pediatrician anymore?
Nurseworks, ASN, RN
77 Posts
Really? He has decades of education and research on autism? Can you show me something to substantiate that? Has he ever even treated an individual with autism?
Indeed it is, but I was not talking about it. Maybe one day we can. Feel free to discuss what I mentioned. Or don't. Either way, fine by me.
Abstracts can be misleading, which is why I said I would try to take the time to read a few full studies when I had the time. Sorry I haven't had the time yet. I'll get on it as soon as I can. Promise.
No, you weren't pretty plain, hence my question. Your statement reflected a clear lack of knowledge concerning how the CDC collects its data on the autism prevalence numbers. Unless you are referring to some sort of data that says vaccine compliance was in decline in say 2002 (with relation to the latest numbers), your statement of "In general vaccines administration to children in the United States has gone down and ASD diagnosis has continued to rise" is woefully ignorant of the process. Do I have to provide peer-review science to back that up or is your deliberate dodge of that factoid as close to an admission of being wrong on something I should ever expect to receive from you?
Would you like me to link to something that states that the increase cannot be fully attributable to better diagnosis? Because I'm pretty sure that's the only claim I've made.
Here's Thomas Insel's commentary:
NIMH - Autism Prevalence: More Affected or More Detected?
You can link to the studies referenced at the bottom of the page and have a ball with them if you're so inclined.