RRNA or SRNA for title, What is your opinion?

Nursing Students SRNA

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I have seen RRNA and SRNA quite often here and just wondered what you all thought of the 2 titles. I like RRNA myself. They way they explained it to us at TCU is that it can ease some pt anxiety when they see SRNA they are thinking oh my goodness a student doing my anesthesia. And if 16months or longer is not a residency I don't know what is. After all we, like some medical residents will be spending plenty of time sleeping at the hospital (maybe not sleeping, but sleep-walking). I think if all programs switched to the RRNA it also looks better on the profession for everyone to be more uniform. Just interested in what everyone else has to say.

No one group should have a monopoly on a title and resident does not mean just mean MD or DO. ...

Physicians call themselves doctors, but there are other people who are not MDs or DOs that refer to themselves as "doctor so-and-so" (professors and scientists ect). These people have every right to give themselves credit for receiving their doctorate.

A friend of mine was considering going to DO school and my parents told him that when THEY were young, DOs were considered (even by MDs, much less the general public) to be less qualified and were put in the same class with Chiropractors. So, how is it now that they are treated as equals with MDs but APNs are still lacking? Is DO school "equivelant" to MD school? (I would assume since that seems to be the big beef in the MD vs APN debate) If so, why have different schools. Seems to me, and this is my limited understanding of the whole thing, someone jump in if I'm wrong, that DOs are similar to APNs in that they train to do "the same" things as MDs, but in a different way and with a different background.

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A friend of mine was considering going to DO school and my parents told him that when THEY were young, DOs were considered (even by MDs, much less the general public) to be less qualified and were put in the same class with Chiropractors. So, how is it now that they are treated as equals with MDs but APNs are still lacking? Is DO school "equivelant" to MD school? (I would assume since that seems to be the big beef in the MD vs APN debate) If so, why have different schools. Seems to me, and this is my limited understanding of the whole thing, someone jump in if I'm wrong, that DOs are similar to APNs in that they train to do "the same" things as MDs, but in a different way and with a different background.

DO's have 4 years of osteopathic medical school - they are considered the equivalent of MD's. APN's are not. Although their main focus is primary care, many now specialize, and if they do, they often are in the same residencies as the MD's. There are lots of DO anesthesiologists, orthopedists, general surgeons, etc. Many states have combined MD/DO medical boards.

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Specializes in Educator.
Referring to any student, whether that be a nursing student or a medical student, as a resident at the hospital is misleading. The term resident has a defined meaning, and most people who have seen medical drama on TV are aware of that definition. If they haven't and they go to look it up in the dictionary they're going to find something like this -

RESIDENT - A physician receiving specialized clinical training in a hospital, usually after completing an internship., The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition, Copyright 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.

While I commend your desire to make patients feel more comfortable, I think most people would agree that misleading them is an ethically suspect way of doing so. You have to ask yourself why using the term 'resident' makes them more comfortable than the term 'student'? Nobody is confusing any of you for a 20 year old 3rd year nursing student, as one of the posts stated. But the fact of the matter is, you are students, graduate level professional students, but students none the less.

I agree that patients are uncomfortable with the idea of students doing their anesthesia, but that's the fact of the matter. I just don't think that misleading them is the right way to handle it.

I have to agree. I think some ethical boundaries are being crossed when a student is not clearly defined as one. and, by the way, "student" nurse midwives do tons of hours and on call. so should I be a "resident nurse midwife"??? this is not about who does or does not have a monolpoly on a descriptive title, but if I was in the hospital and someone did not clearly identify they were a student I would complain. individuals have the right to choose whther they are attended to by a student or not. you are still a student.

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I have to agree. I think some ethical boundaries are being crossed when a student is not clearly defined as one. and, by the way, "student" nurse midwives do tons of hours and on call. so should I be a "resident nurse midwife"??? this is not about who does or does not have a monolpoly on a descriptive title, but if I was in the hospital and someone did not clearly identify they were a student I would complain. individuals have the right to choose whther they are attended to by a student or not. you are still a student.

But on that same note, I do not hear residents introducing themselves as "Dr. John Smith, resident physician." They stop at Dr. Smith. Is it right for them to not include "resident" in their introduction?

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Specializes in CRNA.

I'm a TX Wesleyan RRNA. At my cliinical site, I have had some of the MDA's introduce me as a Resident Nurse Anesthetist or Nurse Anesthesia Resident, as well as Nurse Anesthesia student, but usually it's this is __________, he's part of the anesthesia team. It doesn't seem to be a problem with the MDAs where I practice. That being said, It doesn't matter to me...I'll answer to 'hey you'. ASU also uses my clinical site...they refer to their ppl as SRNAs, but since our program has been using the site longer, everyone is referred to as RRNA.

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A friend of mine was considering going to DO school and my parents told him that when THEY were young, DOs were considered (even by MDs, much less the general public) to be less qualified and were put in the same class with Chiropractors. So, how is it now that they are treated as equals with MDs but APNs are still lacking? Is DO school "equivelant" to MD school? (I would assume since that seems to be the big beef in the MD vs APN debate) If so, why have different schools. Seems to me, and this is my limited understanding of the whole thing, someone jump in if I'm wrong, that DOs are similar to APNs in that they train to do "the same" things as MDs, but in a different way and with a different background.

This is such a great discussion although it is something that we probably won't acheive a consensus on!

Just to clarify, DOs complete 4 years of medical school and then a residency, just as MDs do. Although I went to a big pre-med school for my undergrad and applying to DO school was still kinda looked down upon-- usually the people that applied to DO school were the ones with lower GPAs and MCAT scores, but they were a lot more personable. People kinda looked at applying to DO school as a last resort if they couldn't get into MD school-- not to say that they don't make great doctors, but the focus in DO school seems to be more primary care.

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This is such a great discussion although it is something that we probably won't acheive a consensus on!

Just to clarify, DOs complete 4 years of medical school and then a residency, just as MDs do. Although I went to a big pre-med school for my undergrad and applying to DO school was still kinda looked down upon-- usually the people that applied to DO school were the ones with lower GPAs and MCAT scores, but they were a lot more personable. People kinda looked at applying to DO school as a last resort if they couldn't get into MD school-- not to say that they don't make great doctors, but the focus in DO school seems to be more primary care.

I agree that DO's are more looked down upon because it is easier to get into school and you are right, some do it as a back up when they don't get into medical school. They do function the same as MD's clinically. I believe that it is harder for them to get fellowships when competing with MD students though. From my own personal opinion I have dealt with both DO's and MD's and for the most part (and there are exceptions) I have not been overly impressed with DO's. You are right though that it prob really doesn't matter in primary care. NP, DO, MD all function the same way. If things get too complicated they will all refer to a specialist.

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I've worked with both MD and DO cardiologists, and many surgeon specialties including cardiovascular, OB/gyn, ENT, orthopedic, plastic, etc. Don't see a big difference between MD vs DO in skill or expertise. Good or bad is, IMO, lack of skills/education/training of the individual, not necessarily the program. The only tangible difference I've personally observed is the DO OB docs tend to spend more time in the labor room with the patient especially close to delivery. The MDs tend to sit out at the desk and chat with the nurses while the RN coaches the patient, calls the MD doc in 'to catch'. Again, a generalization based on personal observation at one facility.

DOs learn a more holistic approach in diagnosis and treatment of their patients. However, I don't see a vast difference comparing the two disciplines. The above example in OB is the only difference I've personally observed.

An Yogi

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i believe it is also misleading for patients to assume that a "resident" has more experience than a "student" nurse anesthetist... but it happens. and you are absolutely WRONG - when you say i am a nurse anesthesia student - they hear nurse and student...bypassing the anesthesia part...it is akin to equating a resident w/ a premed student - and insulting at that. by way of explaination and show of intelligent confidence it is usually not a problem - however there must be some way for nurse anesthesisa students to get their "credit" as well. the same way a 3rd yr resident would like to be distinguished from a 1st yr.

Athomas, I disagree. It is not misleading for a patient to assume a resident has more experience than a nurse anesthetist student ... it may be wrong, but 'misleading' implies a deception by definition. When someone tries to disguise their status as a student, that's a deception, that's misleading.

And I want to make sure I am correct in what you are trying to say. Because patients, when they hear 'nurse anesthetist student' only hear 'nurse' and 'student', you should be allowed to disguise your status as a student in order to get "credit" for your experience? Furthermore, I don't understand how you think it's insulting that they only hear 'nurse' and 'student'. I don't think they're trying to actively reduce your status, they're nervous about being put to sleep and cut into. If they think you're a 'nursing student' then take the 15 seconds required to tell them you long ago graduated from nursing school, have X number of years experience in ICU nursing and now are a graduate level nurse anesthetist student in X year of clinical training - it didn't even take me 15 seconds to type it.

I would also like to add that medical residents are still "students" too.

I know, we're all students of anesthesiology, from the med student on their anesthesia rotation to the department chair. When I open up my copy of Barash and read "To All Students of Anesthesiology", I don't think it's just referring to nurse anesthetist students and I imagine, neither does anyone else.

I have worked with plenty of anesthesia and surgical residents over the years as they learn to place PA caths and A-lines in the ICU. Well, now it is me that is learning to place PA caths and A-lines ect. I am a student but I could just as easily be called a resident. I spend a lot of time sleeping in the hospital and getting calls in the middle of the night to do cases, intubate on the floors, or place an epidural cath in OB. How is my training (other than number of hours) any different than that of a medical resident? It isn't!

You could just as easily be called an attending, or an astronaut for that matter. It doesn't make it true. But it's just as easy. And do we really want to make this a discussion of the difference in training an anesthesiologist vs. a CRNA? You're wrong, our training is different. I don't even know why you would say something like that.

Finally, thanks for the linguistic lesson Deepz. I disagree. I think by definition, dictionary definitions are somewhat proscriptive. Yes, they are descriptive, they describe what words mean, and therefore LIMIT what those words can be used to describe. You can't call an 'orange' an 'apple' because that's not what an 'apple' is.

I eagerly await your replies.

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RNAI is used in my program. By the way anesthres, you may not be able to call an "apple" a "orange" but by definition they are fruit..

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RNAI is used in my program. By the way anesthres, you may not be able to call an "apple" a "orange" but by definition they are fruit..

RNAI???

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RNAI???

I think that means Registered Nurse Anesthesia Intern. Correct me if I am wrong...

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