What would you have said to this CNA

Nurses Relations

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I was almost done posting this but it went away? Sorry if it comes up twice???

Anyway, I am an RN on a busy day shift med-surg/onc floor. The other day it was crazy. It was about 1400 and I had not eaten or peed. I was starting to feel a bit sick. I told the HUC that I was not feeling well and that I was going to take a quick break to pee and eat something real quick. I told her to tell the CNA I was working with that I was not feeling good, would be back quickly, and to give her this note.

The note said - Take temp in 502 and get water for 507. Thanks

Well when I got back, the CNA working with me was livid. She demanded to talk to me in private. She says (and I quote) "I am not your N-word" (but she says the word if ya know what I mean) "You can't just leave me notes and expect me to do what you say"

I was just so shocked! First that she would use the N word (we are both white) and second, that she seemed to not care that I had to get off the floor for just a few min.

So I end up apologizing to HER, explaining why I left the note, and telling her how bad I had to take a quick break. She really didn't care, didn't even give the water or take the temp, and just talked trash about me for the rest of the shift. I heard her later telling the other cna's that 'she put me in my place"

this type of behavior is so dishearting for me, We should ALL be there to support eachother and the patients. What would you guys have done?

This is a topic of increasing interest to me. I read through many of the posted replies and it seems the consensus is that the CNA in this scenario was insubordinate and could have been written up legitimately for a couple of valid reasons...reality though; Then what?

1. In my facility- I'm a charge nurse when most senior RN of the shift or "on the floor" though most of us kind of share the burden together if there are more than one working at a time...Many refer to this mythical power of being able to "write up" someone of equal or lesser ranking...but basically what would be done involves either a union grievance or calling a supervisor or unit manager- who then determines the path of the complaint and there are complex, somewhat uncontrollable repercussions most of us deem "not worth the headache".

-so we do what was done in this scenario...we handle it ourselves, in the moment, professionally, respectfully and 'smooth and soothe'...but sometimes it sticks in your side and you want to do more to address the issue. You have to act so that you maintain your own authority and respect while promoting a sense of insight and understanding of others issues without breaking down the "team".

2. The CNA described is a personality I have seen before...ever vigil for someone out to disrespect her so she can pounce and shout about how undeserving she is of that and what a "not-so-awesome" person you(RN) are, like she imagines you think you are...(confusing, there I know) but, I'm sure that she frequently behaves inappropriately in situations because this is a personality issue. (Does she do enough good to outweigh her bad points though?) The complication that can happen if you do the formal reprimand is that the CNA person never gets the message that she was wrong. She probably isn't able for too many reasons to go into... She gets angrier and begins to recruit supporters via venting about you- wherever. Next thing ya know you have this low level air of tension that can escalate, and negative opinion spreading through your "team" of co-workers that can lead to uncooperative staff. In my setting, I've seen it get unbearable for someone over something small that was just misinterpreted and the poor nurse who didn't mean anything by "leaving a note..." is now subjected to no less than a hostile working environment to deal with daily. *So much of this is something that either you understand about people or you don't (and I think you are one who understands).

I know many would disagree with me on this and keep it simple and concrete by doing a "write-up" because she has it coming, period, and move on...but I would be tempted to sit down with this person and "have it out". My show of respect, which I would point out very clearly and firmly is that I would do it behind closed doors and not involve managment/or formal paperwork that would reflect on her negatively but- "I'm sorry that I offended you by leaving you a note, etc... like I did. I was interested in saving time so I could do what I needed to do and the important info- (what I needed you to do) didn't get lost- but do not forget what I listed for you to do, is what I expected to be done. That's your job and it's important you 'get that part' so patient care isn't compromised. I will try to be more considerate of your sensitivity in the future but you also need to improve how you address me...because I am offended by all the things you implied about me- not the least of which is that you think I will take that kind of crap from you- ever- in the future... that you can use the tone, the language- as if you thought it's even a little okay to use that word with me..." (etc...ad lib) After I was done, I would give the CNA free reign to unload any attitude she had/has with me without repercussion and listen to it without getting defensive. Then I would say ultimately, sincerely, with a smile..."Is this over? We can move on, issue resolved?"

Smooth and soothe...but we have to be a team and the team has to function. So you, as the leader, have to figure out a way to keep it functioning the best way you can. I know I struggle with that more often than I wish I had to. Even, on occasion, with some co-workers whom I absolutely love who have moments of unacceptable, inappropriate behavior.

Specializes in med/surg.
This is a topic of increasing interest to me. I read through many of the posted replies and it seems the consensus is that the CNA in this scenario was insubordinate and could have been written up legitimately for a couple of valid reasons...reality though; Then what?

1. In my facility- I'm a charge nurse when most senior RN of the shift or "on the floor" though most of us kind of share the burden together if there are more than one working at a time...Many refer to this mythical power of being able to "write up" someone of equal or lesser ranking...but basically what would be done involves either a union grievance or calling a supervisor or unit manager- who then determines the path of the complaint and there are complex, somewhat uncontrollable repercussions most of us deem "not worth the headache".

-so we do what was done in this scenario...we handle it ourselves, in the moment, professionally, respectfully and 'smooth and soothe'...but sometimes it sticks in your side and you want to do more to address the issue. You have to act so that you maintain your own authority and respect while promoting a sense of insight and understanding of others issues without breaking down the "team".

2. The CNA described is a personality I have seen before...ever vigil for someone out to disrespect her so she can pounce and shout about how undeserving she is of that and what a "not-so-awesome" person you(RN) are, like she imagines you think you are...(confusing, there I know) but, I'm sure that she frequently behaves inappropriately in situations because this is a personality issue. (Does she do enough good to outweigh her bad points though?) The complication that can happen if you do the formal reprimand is that the CNA person never gets the message that she was wrong. She probably isn't able for too many reasons to go into... She gets angrier and begins to recruit supporters via venting about you- wherever. Next thing ya know you have this low level air of tension that can escalate, and negative opinion spreading through your "team" of co-workers that can lead to uncooperative staff. In my setting, I've seen it get unbearable for someone over something small that was just misinterpreted and the poor nurse who didn't mean anything by "leaving a note..." is now subjected to no less than a hostile working environment to deal with daily. *So much of this is something that either you understand about people or you don't (and I think you are one who understands).

I know many would disagree with me on this and keep it simple and concrete by doing a "write-up" because she has it coming, period, and move on...but I would be tempted to sit down with this person and "have it out". My show of respect, which I would point out very clearly and firmly is that I would do it behind closed doors and not involve managment/or formal paperwork that would reflect on her negatively but- "I'm sorry that I offended you by leaving you a note, etc... like I did. I was interested in saving time so I could do what I needed to do and the important info- (what I needed you to do) didn't get lost- but do not forget what I listed for you to do, is what I expected to be done. That's your job and it's important you 'get that part' so patient care isn't compromised. I will try to be more considerate of your sensitivity in the future but you also need to improve how you address me...because I am offended by all the things you implied about me- not the least of which is that you think I will take that kind of crap from you- ever- in the future... that you can use the tone, the language- as if you thought it's even a little okay to use that word with me..." (etc...ad lib) After I was done, I would give the CNA free reign to unload any attitude she had/has with me without repercussion and listen to it without getting defensive. Then I would say ultimately, sincerely, with a smile..."Is this over? We can move on, issue resolved?"

Smooth and soothe...but we have to be a team and the team has to function. So you, as the leader, have to figure out a way to keep it functioning the best way you can. I know I struggle with that more often than I wish I had to. Even, on occasion, with some co-workers whom I absolutely love who have moments of unacceptable, inappropriate behavior.

Excellent, excellent post! However, when I was fired, a "protected minority group" who refused requests to do certain duties listed in her job description, and was a member of a strong clique that management would not deal with, I was at a loss. Bottom line, it was a strong, in control group of ethnic cnas and ethnic nurses. I did the same thing you did, talk to the cna privately, but was just laughed at. They did not fire me for being a "non member" of the clique, but took some different tacks, like staff continually interrupting me when I was pulling my meds, cnas telling me what to do, you name it. So I was fired for "med errors" on the pxysis, which was kind of dumb because of being able to do documentation from that and various documentation about the new system and all the errors made on the pxysis by other nurses which was investigated by my union. It cost me a lot emotionally, but filing a grievance I was monetarily compensated. Also, the union returned my separation status as resigned instead of fired. But this strong hold by groups that are in control are all too common in the hospitals in CA. What the heck can you do? Right now I am taking telemetry courses, etc. and trying to find some other nursing alternatives.

health_meter.png Good option! It appears to be a bigger problem not just in your area, but other places the county also! My experiences were much like yours. Unfortunately Admin. had been sued once for discrimination I think, and took the approach of cow cowing to the CNAS! All that kind of did was create more tension, and problem in the work place! When superiors don't solve the problem it can escalate. When admin tell you to write someone up for what ever the reason, and then admin does not difuse or right the problem it creats hostility, and bad work relations! I finally felt there was no other ans for me, couldn't subject myself to that any more and resigned! The irony of it is I know personally 2 other nurses in another state that also got right out of nursing as they didn't want to subj themselves to that kind of treatment! Where I'd worked admin. seemed to have favorites, and little was done even when CNA's continually clocked in late, or no show! When that happened admin. just gave double assignment to the nurse, instead of calling in someone from temp service. When you are over worked repeatedly and have to do your job and CNA's too it gets old fast, and under pd who could blame a nurse from hanging up her cap she worked so hard to get! Looking back today....you couldn't pay me enough to go thru that! Every employ does things alittle diff, but come on; give the employees respect in each their job description. When a nurse is held accountable to do her job as a profesional, and other employees are not what signal does that send! Admin, and chain of command was no help for me! One thing is nurses today need to think about these things, and situations and how they would handle them if they take place, for you're own sanity, and employ!
Specializes in med/surg.
health_meter.png Good option! It appears to be a bigger problem not just in your area, but other places the county also! My experiences were much like yours. Unfortunately Admin. had been sued once for discrimination I think, and took the approach of cow cowing to the CNAS! All that kind of did was create more tension, and problem in the work place! When superiors don't solve the problem it can escalate. When admin tell you to write someone up for what ever the reason, and then admin does not difuse or right the problem it creats hostility, and bad work relations! I finally felt there was no other ans for me, couldn't subject myself to that any more and resigned! The irony of it is I know personally 2 other nurses in another state that also got right out of nursing as they didn't want to subj themselves to that kind of treatment! Where I'd worked admin. seemed to have favorites, and little was done even when CNA's continually clocked in late, or no show! When that happened admin. just gave double assignment to the nurse, instead of calling in someone from temp service. When you are over worked repeatedly and have to do your job and CNA's too it gets old fast, and under pd who could blame a nurse from hanging up her cap she worked so hard to get! Looking back today....you couldn't pay me enough to go thru that! Every employ does things alittle diff, but come on; give the employees respect in each their job description. When a nurse is held accountable to do her job as a profesional, and other employees are not what signal does that send! Admin, and chain of command was no help for me! One thing is nurses today need to think about these things, and situations and how they would handle them if they take place, for you're own sanity, and employ!

Bless your heart. You expressed it better than I could. I swore up and down like you I would never go back to nursing. Now that I am a little bit saner, here I am again, probably not having learned that I shouldn't try it again. My God, I just thought, WHAT AM I DOING? It brings back all the trampling on my body and soul! You know what, I am so glad this came up. But you know what is so scary, is being a patient yourself. I saw things at this hospital and the treatment of patients that made me want to cry. The 2 worst things I remember was an 80+ year old woman who had just had a hip replacement. The surgical dressing had not been changed by the surgeon. I happened to go past her room and saw 2 CNAs getting this woman up to the bathroom with the dressing hanging down her leg with surgical site bleeding. Another patient I had was a young military mva with multiple wounds with staples from the neck to the coccyx. I went in to change his dressing and the wound had green discharge from probably never being changed. I immediately went to the nurse manager to look at it. She said, "does it glow in the dark?" What was even more of a shock, was when I picked up my Sunday paper, and there was about a 4-page (short paper) of nothing but a tribute to nurses and this nurse managers face smiling face. I really feel something very bad is happening in this country. It was brought to it's knees by wall street and corporations. There were no ads or anything else, just a "tribute to nurses." Curiously, almost 99% of all the pictures were of white, american nurses. Do you think the tide is beginning to turn against these groups, or are the hospitals paying the newspapers, who are sorely suffering from the recession and many going out of business? I am starting to get sick thinking about all of this. I remember asking my union rep about a particular hospital who was always rated in the newspaper for being a good place to work. He said it was not a good place to work, same problems. They paid the newspapers to run these "best place to work" ads. Now that I am thinking about this, I am starting to get sick. Even my GI doc who does my endoscopic procedures, said you don't want to go to a hospital. This doc belongs to the largest hospital chain in this city. These particular hospitals in this chain made the newspapers for being reported to the public health administration by many nurses for dirty conditions, dangerous patient care, poor equipment. Strangely, in the last several months, the have been designated as "magnet" hospitals." What do you think, is this our country anymore, is this America?

Help!!!!!!!!

Oh, my, I shouldn't have read all this since I have an interview on an oncology unit on 7/16 - am I crazy to even consider going back to med/surg?

DeLana :eek:

P.S. But then again, you haven't seen anything like the insubordinate UAPs (dialysis techs) in outpatient dialysis - they make hospital CNAs with bad attitudes look like saints!

Specializes in med/surg.
Oh, my, I shouldn't have read all this since I have an interview on an oncology unit on 7/16 - am I crazy to even consider going back to med/surg?

DeLana :eek:

P.S. But then again, you haven't seen anything like the insubordinate UAPs (dialysis techs) in outpatient dialysis - they make hospital CNAs with bad attitudes look like saints!

DeLana:

I, and I am sure many other nurses are hoping this will be an exception for you and wish you the best of luck. But I was wondering, isn't oncology strictly oncology? Not just a med/surg unit? Best of luck to you. Please let us know how you do. All our fingers are crossed for you.

damn i dont know what to say.:eek:

if she said that to me i'd be like..uhh.. ok wont happen again.

DeLana:

I, and I am sure many other nurses are hoping this will be an exception for you and wish you the best of luck. But I was wondering, isn't oncology strictly oncology? Not just a med/surg unit? Best of luck to you. Please let us know how you do. All our fingers are crossed for you.

It's an inpatient medical oncology (e.g, chemo) unit, but they also get CA post-ops, sickle cell crisis pts and some med/surg overflow. I'd say it's a med/surg specialty unit.

Thanks for the wishes, and good luck to you.

DeLana

Specializes in med/surg.
It's an inpatient medical oncology (e.g, chemo) unit, but they also get CA post-ops, sickle cell crisis pts and some med/surg overflow. I'd say it's a med/surg specialty unit.

Thanks for the wishes, and good luck to you.

DeLana

Well, it sounds interesting. Love your cat. Keep us posted! Best wishes.

I am going to compare this situation to the military chain of command. In the Army, the CNA would be the junior enlisted while the RN would be the officer. Both the CNA and RN can learn from each other, but when the day is done, it is the RN who is the boss and who is ultimately responsible for what happens with the patients.

That said, this CNA-like a lot of junior enlisted-has a real issue with taking direction. This can be further complicated if the CNA is older than the RN, feels that she has more IRL experience,etc. It can also be complicated if the RN has an attitude of "My way or the highway", an attitude that many officers have. I am 35 and am hoping to be a nurse by 40. I know I will have superiors half my age. I live by the adage, "Every man is my superior in that I may learn from him" and hope this attitude helps me.

OP, I am not a nurse yet but know many nurses who will attest to simply not having enough time to do xyz. I would not have apologized but can understand that you were broadsided by the CNA's comment. I am white and I was offended by what she said to you. It's sad that people are blaming you, the victim, for the CNA's lack of professionalism.

I would write her up. If she snaps on you, then who is to say she won't snap on a patient?

Well the hospital I worked at on the oncology unit several yrs, and it was pretty much just that, but sometimes you would get other post op pts, but most of the time it was pretty much chemo. The med/surg floor that I worked on was several types of pts. Everything from elderly waiting to get into the cities one nursing home, or some pts that were sent to our floor 1st in their acting out; psych, or(alcoholics.) Once they got on the meds, and manageable they would be sent to the appropreate units respectfully; alcoholic closed door unit, or the psych closed door unit for duration of their tx! We would get even isolation pts, Hiv, and other. Lot of pre-op, and post-op care pts, and it was like a step down, step down unit from ICU. You kinda got a well rounded experience working that unit, and I loved it as it was not boring at all. You were busy doing bedside care, and more, and the time just flew by so fast you wondered where the time went! We had a fantastic team who worked extreemly well tog and a few months before I left due to relocation south, that floor was getting quite a bit of neuro pts, pre, and post ops, as several Drs felt the unit was worked so well that they actually felt great sending their pts there. When I first started working at that hospital it was run pretty much by the Nuns. Later it all changed and a big corp took over its management, etc, and then lots of things changed, and alot of staff went elsewere to work! By then they had added on new wings and things and the out pt care thing....chemo went to out pt care on a pretty much in and out same day. I think I left at a good time as nurses I kept in contact with after word said the new chngs, were not liked very well, and good share of the nurses left also for better positions at new clinics, or the prison system. Older nurses were given option of retireing early with bonus! After moving to another state, and taking some time off, I worked at a few nursing homes, but found them, sad to say, inferior to hospital. The 1st nursing home I was hired at said they gave good week of orientation. The wk was alot of paperwork, and films, and etc, then they just put you on a floor and expected you to be superwoman! Unbelievable!!! I and another nurse that started when I had also saw, and felt as I did, and day 2 of on the job I resigned, and she followed the day after! They expected you to do care on pts without proper equipment, or supplies:nurse:I was good, and I was McGiver nurse, but they stretched the line beyond smart or safe! The other nurse and I felt we were tought and expected to work under clean or sterile conditions as worented, and the place were out of supplies , and expecting you to make do? Excuse you me........make do didn't cut it in my book when you were dealing with MERSA, and other neat little buggars! One trach irrigation that was mersa and no tx pks to work with and I said my own safety, and health was not going to be jeperdized so they could save a few bucks! The next place I got hired wasn't much better! Finally got hired at what was suppost to be great medical corp to work for! They were big; owned about every medical facility around for miles; nursing homes, and hospitals. It was great, and though a nurse was assigned a whole unit to be charge of, and meds, tx's, etc I loved working with the older pts. They had worked for yrs, pd their taxes, and at the end of their autumn yrs put into nursing homes as their families couldn't or wouldn't want care for them! So sad it was! I felt these people had worked hard their lives and they deserved respect, and good care, but when companies get too big, or decide they want to be into the business of making $$$ at the expense of a lower standard of care these pts it is sad! Then you have to act like a sitter for the CNA's that are working under you, and if they are wrote up for whatever, they show you little respect, and pts as well, it gets testy fast for work conditions! I did work through my breaks, and lunch lots of times because I did care about those pts, and couldn'y stand to see them like that! The work is piled on you, and you have to stay over after shift just to fill out reports, nurses notes, etc, and you get told you need to budget your time better? Unbelievable!!! Some of the places even tell their nurses, and CNA's that they need to clock out on time, and might not get paid any time over unless it is okayed by Unit manger or DNA. Unbelievable!!! One place I worked, the CNA's were told to get the pts up, in their w/c's, and into the dinning hall by a certain time or else, so lots of times I found pts having not had morning mouth care, or peri care before breackfast!!! Usually any c/o's fell on closed ears. It was usual to have meds and tx, etc for 40 some pts, and insubordinate CNA's, and admin. that didn't sem to have a clue, so under pd, over worked, and felt I had not worked hard to become a good nurse, and hard work to be abused, and yes used, so I resigned and never went back! The past few yrs though I see places as such are being watched closer, and fined, or closed down for "lack a daisy" approaches to their pt cares! Where is the medical business headed today, who knows. With more cutbacks every day, and now the peoples care will get squeezed from both ends even more! I will not go to a nursing facility my golden yrs!! I have nightmares today at the thought! My husband assures me that won't even be an option! I will stay at home and have someone come into the home to do cares I might need! I hope in telling of these things new nurses coming in to the medical system will make sure they know what their options are legally, medically, and morally themselves, and the pts in their care!

Specializes in med/surg.
Well the hospital I worked at on the oncology unit several yrs, and it was pretty much just that, but sometimes you would get other post op pts, but most of the time it was pretty much chemo. The med/surg floor that I worked on was several types of pts. Everything from elderly waiting to get into the cities one nursing home, or some pts that were sent to our floor 1st in their acting out; psych, or(alcoholics.) Once they got on the meds, and manageable they would be sent to the appropreate units respectfully; alcoholic closed door unit, or the psych closed door unit for duration of their tx! We would get even isolation pts, Hiv, and other. Lot of pre-op, and post-op care pts, and it was like a step down, step down unit from ICU. You kinda got a well rounded experience working that unit, and I loved it as it was not boring at all. You were busy doing bedside care, and more, and the time just flew by so fast you wondered where the time went! We had a fantastic team who worked extreemly well tog and a few months before I left due to relocation south, that floor was getting quite a bit of neuro pts, pre, and post ops, as several Drs felt the unit was worked so well that they actually felt great sending their pts there. When I first started working at that hospital it was run pretty much by the Nuns. Later it all changed and a big corp took over its management, etc, and then lots of things changed, and alot of staff went elsewere to work! By then they had added on new wings and things and the out pt care thing....chemo went to out pt care on a pretty much in and out same day. I think I left at a good time as nurses I kept in contact with after word said the new chngs, were not liked very well, and good share of the nurses left also for better positions at new clinics, or the prison system. Older nurses were given option of retireing early with bonus! After moving to another state, and taking some time off, I worked at a few nursing homes, but found them, sad to say, inferior to hospital. The 1st nursing home I was hired at said they gave good week of orientation. The wk was alot of paperwork, and films, and etc, then they just put you on a floor and expected you to be superwoman! Unbelievable!!! I and another nurse that started when I had also saw, and felt as I did, and day 2 of on the job I resigned, and she followed the day after! They expected you to do care on pts without proper equipment, or supplies:nurse:I was good, and I was McGiver nurse, but they stretched the line beyond smart or safe! The other nurse and I felt we were tought and expected to work under clean or sterile conditions as worented, and the place were out of supplies , and expecting you to make do? Excuse you me........make do didn't cut it in my book when you were dealing with MERSA, and other neat little buggars! One trach irrigation that was mersa and no tx pks to work with and I said my own safety, and health was not going to be jeperdized so they could save a few bucks! The next place I got hired wasn't much better! Finally got hired at what was suppost to be great medical corp to work for! They were big; owned about every medical facility around for miles; nursing homes, and hospitals. It was great, and though a nurse was assigned a whole unit to be charge of, and meds, tx's, etc I loved working with the older pts. They had worked for yrs, pd their taxes, and at the end of their autumn yrs put into nursing homes as their families couldn't or wouldn't want care for them! So sad it was! I felt these people had worked hard their lives and they deserved respect, and good care, but when companies get too big, or decide they want to be into the business of making $$$ at the expense of a lower standard of care these pts it is sad! Then you have to act like a sitter for the CNA's that are working under you, and if they are wrote up for whatever, they show you little respect, and pts as well, it gets testy fast for work conditions! I did work through my breaks, and lunch lots of times because I did care about those pts, and couldn'y stand to see them like that! The work is piled on you, and you have to stay over after shift just to fill out reports, nurses notes, etc, and you get told you need to budget your time better? Unbelievable!!! Some of the places even tell their nurses, and CNA's that they need to clock out on time, and might not get paid any time over unless it is okayed by Unit manger or DNA. Unbelievable!!! One place I worked, the CNA's were told to get the pts up, in their w/c's, and into the dinning hall by a certain time or else, so lots of times I found pts having not had morning mouth care, or peri care before breackfast!!! Usually any c/o's fell on closed ears. It was usual to have meds and tx, etc for 40 some pts, and insubordinate CNA's, and admin. that didn't sem to have a clue, so under pd, over worked, and felt I had not worked hard to become a good nurse, and hard work to be abused, and yes used, so I resigned and never went back! The past few yrs though I see places as such are being watched closer, and fined, or closed down for "lack a daisy" approaches to their pt cares! Where is the medical business headed today, who knows. With more cutbacks every day, and now the peoples care will get squeezed from both ends even more! I will not go to a nursing facility my golden yrs!! I have nightmares today at the thought! My husband assures me that won't even be an option! I will stay at home and have someone come into the home to do cares I might need! I hope in telling of these things new nurses coming in to the medical system will make sure they know what their options are legally, medically, and morally themselves, and the pts in their care!

I would call Jack Kevorkian before you could send me to a nursing home. Here in CA the governor vetoed a bill that the State DHA would have stronger oversights on patient care, abuse, dangerous or neglectful care. Some people are killed in nursing homes, and if you doubt this, pm me. Besides, the State DHA only give slaps on the rest for violations of patient care. I believe since the advent of Corporations taking over nursing homes, a great number of the nursing homes actually kill patients. Also, I guess you know, it is very hard to sue these corporations, because they have many ways to diverse and divide ownerships of these corporations so it is very difficult to prove who owns what.

I am so tired of that trite, tedious phrase, "you don't manage your time" to justify the slave labor and the pursuit of $$$$ to justify the greed at the expense, not only of the patients, but the danger of the responsibilities placed on nurses.

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