During my current rotation (I'm a student) in OB, something kind of struck me as odd about how my postion was being represented to the patients. Let me explain a bit...
During my initial med-surg rotation last semester, I was on an ortho floor and was providing care to men and women, both young and old. When my mentor would go into a room, we'd both go in and she'd introduce me simply as "a student" and we'd proceed to provide the requisite care. None of the patients voiced any concerns during this time regarding having a guy in the room during "personal care" or when assessing wound sites below the waist.
Skip to the present...
Upon hitting the OB floor, this all changed. Now, I can't even enter a room before it's announced that a guy is in tow and is it ok if I come in and assist.
Yes, it seems to make sense. Yes, it seems appropriate to do in terms of just being polite. Yet, it still nagged at me a bit. Why?
Well, when observing my classmates going into rooms to perform skills such as D/C of a foley on a male patient, there was never any notification that a female student would be involved. No option given to opt out. No bow to modesty. Similarly, when patients are sent to other depts, such as x-ray (ultrasound), there isn't any notification that the tech's performing the work were of the opposite sex. Similarly, when the doc's were making the rounds with their entourage of students, no special steps were taken regarding modesty issues. And when it came to the OB cases, no mention was ever made that the RNFA's assisting the doc's on the C/S were men, or the anesthesiologists, etc. etc. Does it strike anyone else as a bit odd that the only people in the hospital that seem to be identified according to their sex are the male (student) nurses?
I realize that there are going to be exceptions noted by the readers of this forum. I understand that patients can refuse treatment from anyone they choose for whatever reason they find - no problem. I'm wondering, are the nurses that make this differentiation for the male part of the student body unconsciously setting an expectation that needn't be there? Regardless of who we're treating, or who's providing the treatment, isn't the "secret" to setting people at ease regarding modesty the act of performing your duties with a high degree of professionalism? If we're doing that, shouldn't the issue of our gender be a secondary consideration instead of the default one? If not, then shouldn't we be extending the same considerations to the male patient population? Does announcing a provider's gender just move the modesty issue to the fore, making it a self-fulfilling prophesy?
PS - I don't think that this was ever an act of discrimination on the part of my clinical mentors. Just an act of politeness.
Specializes in Step-down/tele, home care, corrections.
I just witnessed what the OP was referring to in the most clear way imaginable.
Just finished L/D and have several males in my class. One nurse took one male, one nurse took another male. Nurse A walked into the room and said, This is ________, he's a nursing student who will be assisting me today" and that was the end of the conversation about his gender. In one day he watched a c-sec and a vag delivery.
The other nurse had the student wait outside while she explained the situation to the mom. Guess what? The mom refused his presence.
Both women had male MD's. So sure, there could have been extenuating circumstances in the second instance, but I doubt it. I think presentation had a LOT to do with it.
I had that second situation happen to me several weeks ago. The nurse (a crusty old manager) told me "she had to check with the pt and see if she minded if I took care of her. She's a nurse here and doesn't want a male student". My instructor had already talked to the pt (and the nurse), so I told the nurse that I would ask the client how she felt. The nurse turned right around, and rushed back into the room. As I listened outside the door, the whispering began, followed by the client saying, "Oh he'll be OK". The nurse had a "look" on her face as she came out of the room - no eye contact. The client and I got along well; it turns out she was not a nurse, but did work at the hospital. BTW, this was a post-partum clinical, so I had to assess her (belly & perineal check with a chaperone - my instructor) and the baby. She was G2P2, so my teaching was review for her and her husband. Lovely outcome all around.
The next time, the whispering started immediately between two nurses outside the room (different patient), but the reason was that the mom had been sexually abused. I told the nurses that I would have appreciated being included in the initial discussion, and they agreed.
There are patients that would object to my presence due to reasons of modesty or religious belief, and no matter what the reason, that is their right. However, I don't want someone else to make that determination.
Many years ago, when I was a relatively "new" nurse in a small ICU, a sub-acute female patient took a turn for the worse. I just started my shift, saw what was goin on and started interventions to turn things around for her, including the insertion of a Foley catheter. She ended up doing OK, but when her daughter arrived and found out that her mother's Foley was inserted by a "male nurse", she became the Spawn of Satan and began yelling loudly about how her mother was "mortified" because of having a male nurse insert the catheter.
The daughter's episode calmed down a bit after two things happened:
1.) her mother told her that this was not a problem, and explained that it had to be done fairly quickly
2.) I explained in somewhat greater detail why the interventions were necessary, and that the only other nurses available at that moment were John, Dave, and Ed, all of whom assisted in some way throughout much f the process.
The daughter finally calmed down and all was well again.
Another thing I still do not understand are the women who have a male OB doc, but do not want a male nurse getting "turned on" while providing peri care, inserting a catheter, or otherwise working "down there" (I mean, what is that thing made of, gold or something?) Trust me, I have had to insert a lot of Foley catheters on female patients, and there is nothing of a "turn-on" about it; often the opposite is true. I can just about picture a scenario in which I insert a bunch of Foleys at work for several female patients, and then have to either take a cold shower, or go running home to my wife, screaming, "I'm ready honey! Let's git 'r done!"
Maybe as those who think it is a "turn-on" become older (i.e., an old faht like me), they will realize that 'parts is parts' and sometimes we just need to get the job done..... and there is no feasible way to hand it off to a female. besides, we all know that there would be absolutely no females who are "turned on" while inserting a Foley for a male patient, right?
Great Post Jerry! I love your perspective and agree that is shouldn't be an issue unfortunately with some patients it always will be. It's all a matter of how it is handled.
........Another thing I still do not understand are the women who have a male OB doc, but do not want a male nurse getting "turned on" while providing peri care, inserting a catheter, or otherwise working "down there" (I mean, what is that thing made of, gold or something?) Trust me, I have had to insert a lot of Foley catheters on female patients, and there is nothing of a "turn-on" about it; often the opposite is true. I can just about picture a scenario in which I insert a bunch of Foleys at work for several female patients, and then have to either take a cold shower, or go running home to my wife, screaming, "I'm ready honey! Let's git 'r done!"
Maybe as those who think it is a "turn-on" become older (i.e., an old faht like me), they will realize that 'parts is parts' and sometimes we just need to get the job done..... and there is no feasible way to hand it off to a female. besides, we all know that there would be absolutely no females who are "turned on" while inserting a Foley for a male patient, right?
Well said Jerry !
Maybe I'm the lucky one but I didn't have any problems when I was in OB rotation. I think the staff nurses were worrying if I'll pass out watching a vag delivery (surely not ! I'm the proud dad of two vag born sons). Actually, for all my clinical rotations, there was only once that my instructor changed my assignment but it was obvious that it was more of her hypersensitivity rather than the pt's c/o of a male student.
Foley? When I was a CNA, I worked in ER. One day, I was in the nursing stn and heard the order to put a foley to a pt. Being new at that time, I asked if I could go with anyother CNA and learn the skill. It was an objection from the nurse mgr. Then another day in the same ER, my fellow CNA was asked to put a foley and she needed my help. I was hesitate. She yelled at me: "Get your @#$ off, go get the foley kit and go right into bed 10 !!!"
Sometimes I wonder why my male classmates were refused. One time I was in a nursing home rotation in my CNA school. My buddy was refused and he stood outside a female resident's room. But my experience have been very different. I have had residents waved at me and when I went over to check, she just hugged and kissed me. I think it all depends.
I think it all gets down to how you present yourself. If you are confident for yourself and able to develope trust with your pt (in a very short time), you should be allright.
I have given birth twice lady partslly, but after seeing it for the first time this week, the first thing I asked my husband when I got home was, "Uh, honey, how much of ME could you see during my deliveries?" Thankfully his answer was, none of you, only the child. Giving birth IS miraculous and wonderful, but attractive it ain't!
I have four children , all over the age of 16. In those four births, I have had three nurses that happened to be male. They were WONDERFUL!!! They were SO considerate of my feelings, my husband's feelings.... On the other hand, I have had some female nurses that I thought were the rudest, most b&^&&y women!!! In my clinicals, the female nurses are the WORST!!! I really don't care WHY they are being that way, dealing with patients is NO place for it. My OB, whom I LOVE dearly, is a male, there has NEVER been a nurse, male OR female in with him doing an exam. When my husband was in the military, I had a female Dr once, didn't care for her personally but not because of her gender. By the way, none of our kids were born while he was in the Marines Corp, lest anyone think that the male nurses were the military ones. I just think it is hypocritical for women to want to be 'equal' with so much but turn the tables and they don't like it. They should be allowed to be doctors, but men shouldn't be nurses??!! Even in L&D?? With some of the morbidly obese OB pts we've had, I'm glad there are some nice big men around to help move them, saves my back.:chuckle Also, if a woman is having a baby and is so concerned about who is viewing, maybe she should consider a home birth.
In the ward, (med/surg) that I did my first placement a few weeks ago, I had different experiences due to different preceptors and different patients. Every day I had a different preceptor and worked a different section of the ward.
One preceptor sent me off to do obs in the far room and told me to start writing up notes when I had finished that. On returning to write notes I was asked by a senior nurse why I wasn't in the room with my preceptor learning how the procedure was done. I knew nothing about the procedure until I was informed that the pt had "packing in her place" and she probably wouldn't want me there anyway.
Another pt who had a pile on gynae problems was more than happy when I came in, introduced myself and tok her obs. She and her partner commented about how good it was that a man can become a nurse and were more than happy to have me help with her care. I didn't assist or watch any procedures because none were scheduled for that shift.
Different preceptors, different pt's, different outcomes.
What I find worse is the "so youre going to be a male nurse". No I am learning to be a nurse! Male nurse seems to be a nurses helper or orderly in the eyes of some.
hi everyone, i think that a female patient has the right to choose who ever she likes to take care of her. i do not feel frustated, meaning i do not want nobody sue me for anything i have not done. and also you as a male nurse can work in other areas. i feel confortable working with male only or mixed.
it is better work in this way than only female patient. On the other hand you can be a nice professional and do not have to deal with female patients alone
Yes, I agree totally. I am a young studdy male and hate the flow of female nurses that come into the room to check me out then talk about me at the central station - NOT.
So in other words it is OK for the male nurses to take care of ugly women? You must think very highly of yourself - cute CNA. Do you think women nurses are free from getting turned on? Tone down your imagination and support those that are taking care of you. I have worked just about every department in the hospital, including OB. We males are not all perverts but just might be working in this profession because we care about people.
Don't go into nursing if you can't get past yourself.
This has been a problem from time immemorial. I remember when I was a senior student Nurse I helped a older lady who had an involuntary BM get cleaned up before breakfast. I introduced myself as her Nurse for the day. After breakfast when I went in to help her with her cares she declared that she was not going to be cared for by a man! (I guess we're good enough for the crappy jobs but not otherwise!) I laughed it off and still find it humorous. One of my classmates traded patients with me for the rest of the day. I didn't have any problems with OB except one woman who didn't want any student for the delivery because it was her first child. She allowed me to stay for the exam though. And I have had male patients ask for me because I'm male.
Believe it or not cuteCNA, it's possible for us males to control ourselves, even around someone as lovely as you must be. If your choice is a female caregiver, that's fine, but don't try to qualify your decision with such a stereotypical view on males.
My A&P classes located the male brain in the skull, not the member.
If a person (male or female) cannot get past a patient's gender and their looks, they're in the wrong profession anyway.
With the nusing industry being represented by only 6% male, it will take some time to overcome the gender bias. On the women's side: We can surely understand some of what they've had to put up with over the years so I think a little "patience" is in order.
Trust me, I have had to insert a lot of Foley catheters on female patients, and there is nothing of a "turn-on" about it; often the opposite is true. I can just about picture a scenario in which I insert a bunch of Foleys at work for several female patients, and then have to either take a cold shower, or go running home to my wife, screaming, "I'm ready honey! Let's git 'r done!" 
stevesf
38 Posts
I had that second situation happen to me several weeks ago. The nurse (a crusty old manager) told me "she had to check with the pt and see if she minded if I took care of her. She's a nurse here and doesn't want a male student". My instructor had already talked to the pt (and the nurse), so I told the nurse that I would ask the client how she felt. The nurse turned right around, and rushed back into the room. As I listened outside the door, the whispering began, followed by the client saying, "Oh he'll be OK". The nurse had a "look" on her face as she came out of the room - no eye contact. The client and I got along well; it turns out she was not a nurse, but did work at the hospital. BTW, this was a post-partum clinical, so I had to assess her (belly & perineal check with a chaperone - my instructor) and the baby. She was G2P2, so my teaching was review for her and her husband. Lovely outcome all around.
The next time, the whispering started immediately between two nurses outside the room (different patient), but the reason was that the mom had been sexually abused. I told the nurses that I would have appreciated being included in the initial discussion, and they agreed.
There are patients that would object to my presence due to reasons of modesty or religious belief, and no matter what the reason, that is their right. However, I don't want someone else to make that determination.
Steve