Kellogg Comm College/Kalamazoo Valley

DLS_PMHNP, MSN, RN, NP · Oct 7, 2008

just check their websites. seems simple enough.

brillohead, ADN, RN · Oct 15, 2008

Just going from memory, so you'll want to verify the details with each college, but as I remember it:

KVCC has 7 pre-requisite classes that can be VERY hard to get into (for some of them you only have roughly 20 minutes to register online when they open registration -- the class is full after that). After you've completed your pre-reqs, you're looking at 1-3 years to get accepted into the nursing program. (You can't get on the list for nursing school until after you've completed all your pre-reqs.)

KCC only has 2 pre-req classes, provided your high school Chem / Bio / Math / Reading are up to par. I just found the info from KCC, so I'll paste it below. In my case, I had A's in high school biology, chemistry, and algebra, so I didn't need to take any of those for pre-reqs, and my ACT score was high enough that I didn't have to do the Compass reading test.

I'm currently taking Anatomy, and will take Physiology next semester, and then I will be able to apply. From what I can tell so far, there are quite a few people in Anatomy right now who won't be able to pull a B- out of the class... bad for them (they'll have to take it again before they can apply to nursing school) but good for me, because I'll be one step ahead of them in the application process.

From what I can tell, if all goes according to plan and I pull at least a B- in both A&P this year, I'll either be starting nursing school in Sept 2009 or Sept 2010 -- it just depends on how many people are still on the waiting list when the time comes.

As far as tuition, they're pretty comparable. I live in the KVCC district, so I'm paying higher out-of-district tuition to go to KCC, but between all the pre-req classes I won't have to take at all as well as how much faster I'll be able to graduate and start earning money (up to five years sooner than if I'd gone to KVCC -- I also work days, so I can only take the pre-reqs at night, which would take me even longer than normal at KVCC), it's worth it to me to pay the higher tuition and make the half-hour drive.

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KCC - New Nursing Requirements for Fall 2008

The Nursing Program is a selective admissions process. We recommend the following steps towards a completed file and admission. Steps towards admission Completion of steps 1 thru 5 will give you a "completed file".

1. Submit an application; applications should be submitted annually until your file is complete.

2. Submit high school transcript*: The program no longer requires your HS transcripts for the admittance; however, we can still use your HS chemistry and algebra as long as you completed 1 year for a total of 1 credit and received a "B-" or better. 1 yr of HS Biology with a grade of "C" or better can be used as the prerequisite to BIOL 201 at KCC. *Submitting your high school transcript can be beneficial.

3. Take ACT and/or Compass: The ACT is recommended but not required. Students have the option of taking the ACT (a composite score of 19 or higher) or Compass Reading (a reading score of a 78 or higher).

4. Submit all college transcripts: Minimum GPA of 2.5 is required from each college attended.

5. Successfully complete the following prerequisite courses:

Prerequisite courses with "B-" or higher:

MATH 101 - can use 1 cr. of HS Algebra: a "B-" or better in EACH semester or Compass Algebra score of 40 or higher.
CHEM 100 - can use 1 cr. of HS Chemistry: a "B-" or better in EACH semester. Prerequisite college courses completed* with "B-" or higher:
BIOL 201 - Human Anatomy: KCC pre-req is 1 cr. of HS Biology with a "C" or better in 2 semesters, or college level biology, and a Compass reading score of 73 or higher.
BIOL 202 - Human Physiology: KCC pre-req is BIOL 201.

*As per the 2007-08 KCC catalog, BIOL 201 & 202 need to be completed within 6 years prior to admission to the Nursing Program.

Note: Students may apply to the nursing programs beginning April 1 of each year. Acceptance into the nursing program is based on "date of completion of file." Students completing steps 1 thru 5 as outlined above will have a "completed file."

6. Complete General Education courses required for the Nursing Program.

General Education Classes These need to be completed with a grade of a "C" or better .

ENGL 151 - Freshman Composition3 cr.
COMM 101 or 111 3 cr.
PSYC 201 - Introduction to Psychology3 cr.
PSYC 220 - Developmental Psychology3 cr.
Creativity Elective 2-3 cr.
Global Awareness Elective 3 cr.

jm123 · Oct 28, 2008

Just so you guys know, right now there is about a 1.5-2 year wait to get into KCC. I just finished BIO202 this summer, and my spot will be in the winter/spring of 2010 part time. I may get an alternate position in the fall of 2009, but I am not counting on it, as I am over 50 spots back from that cut off.

It may be better for you guys, as I am still dealing with people that grandfathered in, under the old admissions rules.

brillohead, ADN, RN · Oct 29, 2008

Just so you guys know, right now there is about a 1.5-2 year wait to get into KCC. I just finished BIO202 this summer, and my spot will be in the winter/spring of 2010 part time. I may get an alternate position in the fall of 2009, but I am not counting on it, as I am over 50 spots back from that cut off.
It may be better for you guys, as I am still dealing with people that grandfathered in, under the old admissions rules.

Do you have any idea what the wait list was like for Full-Time instead of Part-Time? I'm really hoping that the new admissions program will speed things up considerably!!!

jm123 · Nov 7, 2008

Well I finished my last requirements this summer and I was number 238 on the wait-list for fall 2008. So if you subtract the 65 for this winter (a lot of people switch lists), and the 120 for next fall. I would be about 58 people back from entering, in the fall of 2009. I may get in then, but that is a lot of people to drop off the list.

To answer your question I would expect about 50-75 people per semester to get on the wait list, so that would put you at about 158-208 on the list after you finish in the spring. So at the very earliest 2010 would be when you could get in full-time, and more realistically 2011 for full-time. This again depends on your start date of prerequisites as that is how they tie-break your waiting list position.

brillohead, ADN, RN · Dec 1, 2008

I recently got more info from KCC. With me "completing my file" next spring (taking Physiology starting in January 2009), their best guesstimate would put me right on the border of 2010/2011, depending on how many they have drop out and how many apply.

Per the nursing department:

When two or more people have the same date of completion of file, they then look at application dates -- the earliest date wins the "tie." If the date of application is also the same, they then look at ACT/COMPASS scores or documentation of a degree; having a degree trumps ACT/COMPASS scores. In the rare occasion that two or more students share the same completion and application dates, and also the same degree/scores, they then look at grades in Anatomy and Physiology.

While I don't have a degree in something else, I don't think most of my competition does, either. I have a fairly high ACT score (I think my composite was 31?), and I'm currently riding on a 102% grade in Anatomy. I fully intend to put in my application on April 1st each year, so in the event of a tie, hopefully my grades put me at the head of the pack! :up:

jm123 · Dec 1, 2008

Actually they have a rolling application. So you do not have to reapply. What I mean is once you complete the prereq's, you will have a spot in line for admissions. Then they will mail you a letter if you do not get in right away. In that letter they will ask you to respond as to what you want to do. You will either be able to switch to the part-time line, or just move to the next full-time admission line. Or do not reply, and lose your spot in line and then have to reapply. This is where most people drop out as they do not mail back the letter or drop it off at the admissions department by the deadline.

Just do not get you hopes up to high once you get your number, as people switch back and forth, and drop out all the time. So while I was 239 back in the fall it could get worse or better for next fall depending on the part-time option, and how many people drop out.

Lastly they have finally updated the handbook to the new program. They have switched to a LPN/RN progression. I am not sure on how this will effect admissions, but I have a feeling that it should speed it up, due to the fact that all the spots are in one program now, and anatomy and physiology must be completed to get in line.

brillohead, ADN, RN · Dec 1, 2008

I was told that I need to keep applying every year until I get in, even after my pre-reqs are completed. Even though they take the date of file completion as the "cutoff" for admission, you still have to actually apply each year for the program (this is what I was told by the school -- this may be one of the new changes they made in the admissions process?).

I also think that the B- requirement in both A&P will speed up the admission process for some and slow it down for others. I don't know about the other Anatomy classes, but I know that in my class, there will be a lot of people who need to take the course over again in order to get a B- in the class.

jm123 · Dec 2, 2008

Yes, you do need to keep applying before your prereq's are done. I will have to check on applying afterwards, because as of just a few months ago it was not like that.

Also they have risen other requirements this year. You use to only need a C in your other prereq's, but now you need a B- in those also. In addition you must at minimum receive C's in all classes, and maintain a GPA of 2.5 throughout the program. In addition it looks like they have risen the ACT waiver score on the reading test to 78. However, they most likely will grandfather in people under the old rules. As they did that when they just changed the programs setup last year. They use to not require A&P prior to getting on the wait-list, but they changed that in 2007. I do not agree with it, but they have the power.

It least they are making it a lot more competitive. I think they made most of these changes to try and limit dropouts.

brillohead, ADN, RN · Dec 2, 2008

It least they are making it a lot more competitive. I think they made most of these changes to try and limit dropouts.

I agree. A friend who went to KVCC was frustrated that they went simply by date of application / completion of pre-reqs with no real regard for grades/ability (if I recall correctly, KVCC just requires a 2.0 GPA). She saw a lot of people drop out or flunk out each year because they simply weren't up to it academically, and then their spot in the program went unfilled for the rest of the program while someone else had to wait another year or two just to get started in the program.

At least with the B- requirement now at KCC, while it may slow some people down in getting in because of needing to repeat a class or two, it will hopefully weed out the people who just wouldn't be successful in the nursing program at all. I know that there are always going to be dropouts for various reasons, not just academic performance, but at least this might reduce the total number of dropouts from the program.

jm123 · Apr 5, 2009

Ok just got my letter I did not get in for the fall of 2009. I did move up about 30 spots so I should start on the part-time program in Jan 2010. So that will be about a 1.5 year wait from my completion date.

Side note KCC plans on expanding the Nursing program in the fall of 2010. If they do all new spots will be competitive. This is in the student handbook, so it is the official plan.