Its official! I am leaving nursing.........

[Kashia]

I found the great Allnurses forum when I was a student, before I graduated. It helped me so much! And has helped me throughout the years.

But here I am posting this....I am leaving nursing. I am a LVN.

Shortly after graduating, I landed a full time job, not once but twice!

First on acute care ortho/surg floor full time then I moved and received the gift of a great job on a med-surg acute care floor, float to ob/gyn, ICU and ER. The experience I was getting was awesome.

I enrolled in the RN step up program, but for various reasons, I dropped out. No, it was not that I was incapable....my GPA in school was 3.85 which is do-able. And I really like studying.

It was due to reasons (then) that have grown into being even stronger in me to the point of I am done.

Simply put............I decided I can no longer work against my conscience.

As a nurse there have been to many occasions where I have been "required for the sake of employment" to perform, participate in things that are just so wrong. Its not

relativism that should be guiding us .....for whats that? A guideline made up in your head, "whatever works", "whatever you decide is right, is right?" "whatever the popular consensus is, oh, then it must be ok?".......no, I see just so much wrong in this thinking. It is wrong.

To have a medical system that is driven by profit and greed, where we can see, for instance- in long term care, the elderly have become a commodity. Where in acute care patients are sometimes sent home way before they should be, where drug companies are handing out and FDA approving drugs that are doing more harm than good in way to many cases................and the worst is that the very systems put in place at the beginning of our US history are no longer, due to government restrictions, able to perform works of charity.

Well, maybe one more reason I am done is I am older. The new nurses have the energy and drive to work in environments that will demand all of you.

And perhaps my contribution now can be to write. So I will end with this.........for new nurses...........

1) know history. there is one, you may have to dig a bit, but it is still there. you will find so much wisdom and truth.

2) foster your compassion and find what helps you know there is a right and a wrong.

Think of a river, whose sides are high and firm and how the water rushes past, because it is contained by edges. then think of the water flowing into a lake where there is no edge, it moves wherever it will and eventually weakens into shallow nothing.

We must regain our moral edges.

[nurseaig, ASN, BSN, MSN, NP]

Do like me, get the hospital to pay for your education. When U are finish with school leave them high and dry.LOL

[swansonplace]

Have you ever thought of legal nursing? Working to create unions, laws, create a blog, educate patients on home self care?

[ricksy]

I understand the point you're making, but there is a much more respectful way to teach this new CNA how to behave in this situation. As a bonus, in the process of teaching her how to behave and doing so respectfully, you also teach her a respectful way to correct people instead of being confrontational.

If you really responded to her like this in person, you were disrespectful. If you didn't, your tone here is disrespectful, between the verbally belittingling language ("YOUNG CNA", "little CNA") and the all caps writing style.

I think most RNs/LPNs have dealt with CNAs who didn't want to do their jobs. I think most CNAs have dealt with RNs/LPNs who don't want to do their jobs. And there are certainly physicians who don't want to do anything and try to pass off their responsibilites to the RNs, LPNs and CNAs. To try to pinpoint one group of people as the "problem" is ridiculous because a hospital isn't a family or a school system--it's a group of professionals working together. If the doc refuses to write orders, you're stuck. If the RN/LPN refuses to carry out orders, you're stuck. If the CNA isn't there to help turn, bathe and walk the patient, you're really, really busy (and stuck). If at any point any piece of the system stops working, the entire thing comes to a screeching halt.

And ironically, that kind of attitude contributes to the problems the OP described in her original post.

For the record, the adjectives I used for the CNA are correct. She is 19. That makes her young. She is little. She is 5 foot 3 and about 100 pounds. Uh, disrespectful to her? No. She is beginning nursing clinicals in three weeks and I have GIVEN her all of my books and befriended her. I bet if you

were to ask her, she would tell you that I am the one nurse that stands up for her and helps her. It is NOT attitudes " like mine" that contribute to the problem described by the OP. I believe she knows right from wrong, but was busy and didn't want to have to return to put the resident to bed again. She can do things with me that others would have her written up for. But, my point, again....it DOES begin from the BOTTOM UP. There has to be health care workers that realize that every life has a story..and if my 95 year old granny, who has worked all her life want to lie down, than she will have that right. I am a patient advocate. I advocated for my patient. The story was not to belittle my small statured friend and CNA, but to push the need for advocacy at any level. I am sorry that I did not possibly articulate my post to get full impact, but I will not allow someone to say I am a nurse who eats CNAs.

[MotherRN]

I think the problem is the disconnect between all the corporate BS and what REALLY goes on with floor nursing. While the management is busy constructing customer service-oriented utopian policies, they fail to provide enough staff to bring down the patient/nursing-CNA ratios to a level where those in the trenches could even hope to meet said standards of care.

Example: new admit, w/ dementia, Below the knee amputation, no family or history, WANTS TO STAND UP EVERY TIME YOU REPOSITION HER TO SIT BACK, completely confused, no walker, no wheelchair. Now tell me, how is the nurse going to care for this patient and the other 22 assigned to her that night (some others with dementia who also stand up every few minutes, who also are a fall risk) if the CNA is refusing to take turns watching her? With patients like these, the care grinds to a halt because one person cannot be in twenty different places at the same time.

Until issues like these are addressed, health care will not improve.

I can offer one solution- have fewer managers and more floor staff to do the actual hands on care. That would discourage the cutting of corners and improve compassion from nurse to patient.

[SoldierNurse22, BSN, RN]

For the record, the adjectives I used for the CNA are correct. She is 19. That makes her young. She is little. She is 5 foot 3 and about 100 pounds. Uh, disrespectful to her? No. She is beginning nursing clinicals in three weeks and I have GIVEN her all of my books and befriended her. I bet if you

were to ask her, she would tell you that I am the one nurse that stands up for her and helps her. It is NOT attitudes " like mine" that contribute to the problem described by the OP. I believe she knows right from wrong, but was busy and didn't want to have to return to put the resident to bed again. She can do things with me that others would have her written up for. But, my point, again....it DOES begin from the BOTTOM UP. There has to be health care workers that realize that every life has a story..and if my 95 year old granny, who has worked all her life want to lie down, than she will have that right. I am a patient advocate. I advocated for my patient. The story was not to belittle my small statured friend and CNA, but to push the need for advocacy at any level. I am sorry that I did not possibly articulate my post to get full impact, but I will not allow someone to say I am a nurse who eats CNAs.

Your emphasis on her age (or lack thereof) and stature was absolutely disrespectful. Who enjoys being referred to on such terms? I'm sure "Old, fat CNA" would be perceived as just as rude. Why not the opposite?

Perhaps she likes you, perhaps she doesn't. Since none of us can speak for her, it's pointless to speculate about anything other than what you espoused in your post, which (as I previously said) came across as rude and disrespectful.

It certainly doesn't start from the bottom up--not in any context as far as nursing/medicine goes. As I previously stated, any part of the team--to include the patient as the central member of the healthcare team--that doesn't feel like playing ball dooms the rest of the team.

To expand on your example, nurses and CNAs who understand the life story of a patient may be able to give great care, but if the physician doesn't take the time to understand that patient as a human and won't order the treatments needed, then the house of cards crumbles from the top on down. Or, perhaps the docs, nurses and techs all want to give her great care, but the management of the hospital is out of touch, unsupportive or ineffective (gee, never seen that before!). Those providers at bedside are going to have very serious difficulty giving good care without the support of the administrative managers fostering good morale, without even touching on finances, education, resources, etc...

I didn't in fact say that you were the nurse that eats CNAs. If you think I did, please cite in my PP where it says that. I said you were disrespectful and rude to that CNA in particular. I stand by that opinion.

However, to that point, you did post an entire chunk of text on how the change has to start from the BOTTOM UP. The rest of your post described how a CNA (who is at the bottom of authority in the healthcare team) didn't want to help a LOL back to bed. What are the readers supposed to think?

[ricksy]

I think the problem is the disconnect between all the corporate BS and what REALLY goes on with floor nursing. While the management is busy constructing customer service-oriented utopian policies, they fail to provide enough staff to bring down the patient/nursing-CNA ratios to a level where those in the trenches could even hope to meet said standards of care.

Example: new admit, w/ dementia, Below the knee amputation, no family or history, WANTS TO STAND UP EVERY TIME YOU REPOSITION HER TO SIT BACK, completely confused, no walker, no wheelchair. Now tell me, how is the nurse going to care for this patient and the other 22 assigned to her that night (some others with dementia who also stand up every few minutes, who also are a fall risk) if the CNA is refusing to take turns watching her? With patients like these, the care grinds to a halt because one person cannot be in twenty different places at the same time.

Until issues like these are addressed, health care will not improve.

I can offer one solution- have fewer managers and more floor staff to do the actual hands on care. That would discourage the cutting of corners and improve compassion from nurse to patient.

Nice post.

[ricksy]

You a say "I said you were disrespectful and rude to that CNA in particular. I stand by that opinion."

My response:

No where in my post is what I actually said to that CNA. You were not there so you don't know if I was disrespectful or not. Finally, to stop arguing with you, I will simply say, that if the people that physically touch and look my patients in the eye every day, see them cry, and hear them groan, lack empathy and compassion, then how would we all expect a large corporation to care. Whistle blowers? Yes, needed. But remember in the United States, a whistleblower like Ed Snowden is called a traitor by most of the population.

[jsawyer]

What area of nursing do you work in? I'm taking nursing classes this fall and like to know all my options...Thank you

[SoldierNurse22, BSN, RN]

No where in my post is what I actually said to that CNA. You were not there so you don't know if I was disrespectful or not. Finally, to stop arguing with you, I will simply say, that if the people that physically touch and look my patients in the eye every day, see them cry, and hear them groan, lack empathy and compassion, then how would we all expect a large corporation to care. Whistle blowers? Yes, needed. But remember in the United States, a whistleblower like Ed Snowden is called a traitor by most of the population.

I'm glad to hear that's not how you responded to her. Really. I am. And I hope that you showed her more courtesy in person than you did on this board.

I don't expect a corporation to care. I expect individuals at all levels to care. I know, I know, I'm an optimist. I've come to realize that in recent months especially. Because as I said, if any level fails, everyone goes down.

I agree with you--there are people on the personal, physical level who don't care, and while the upper level management not giving a darn won't likely be as devastating as fast, it's a slow, grinding trip to not just the demise of a single patient, of a single nurse, of a single doctor--but of an entire hospital.

We've all seen them; we've all worked with them--those "care"givers who really don't care. How does one stop that bevahior when the person refuses to acknowledge their attitude, even when confronted about it? As colleagues, you really can't change them. That's what the management is (supposed to be) there for.

The way it should be? Management should notice a problem like the one above. They should see it (because they're on the floor enough to see it) or people who work for them should report the bevahior, especially if it's abusive.

Not sure where whistleblowers came in, but I agree--they are needed, though that isn't to say I agree with the method employed in the above example.

[jsawyer]

That last questions was for NJnewRN which is What area of nursing are you in?

[cee cee g]

you should become a md or get your ph.d or something not a r.n. you're smart enough to debate a change and even write a book. all it takes is one voice as you can see. go luck to you and move forward.

[SoldierNurse22, BSN, RN]

you should become a md or get your ph.d or something not a r.n. you're smart enough to debate a change and even write a book. all it takes is one voice as you can see. go luck to you and move forward.

RNs need to be smart--very smart. It's a very outdated, damaging idea that docs and folks with advanced degrees are necessarily smarter than everyone else. Perhaps that CNA or LPN is smarter than all of them, but they never had the opportunity to further their education?

I find it incredibly sad that you'd suggest something like this on a nursing board. And where better to start in gaining valuable bedside experience than as an entry-level LPN/RN?