I was wondering....

Brittani.RN · May 4, 2015

I'm not a new grad, have 4yrs experience already.

Murse901, MSN, RN · May 4, 2015

Not to mention, most FNP programs require 1 year experience as an RN before you can even apply. At that rate, doing 1 year at WGU and getting your MSN will be cheaper, quicker and easier to do a post-master's certificate (while they're still around ). As a new graduate with no experience

Sadly, this is actually not true. Most FNP programs don't require anything beyond a BSN and an active RN license. I wish that FNP programs required at least 3-5 years of full-time RN experience before applying.

I went to Nashville a few years ago to an MSN/DNP open house at Vanderbilt, where they had speakers talking about their various graduate programs. I listened to the FNP speaker (who happened to be the dean of the FNP program). At the end, they opened up the floor to questions. One student asked: "I'm graduating with my BSN in a few months. Should I get experience as an RN before applying to the FNP program?"

The dean's reply? Word for word -- "There is no benefit to working as an RN before going into FNP school".

I was absolutely disgusted.

Calixan · May 6, 2015

I can kind of see the view of that. Just as doctors and PA's don't have to have any medical experience before going to school, and most of them never work in the medical field at all until after they have graduated. At least those who go to a FNP program (usually) gain some nursing experience during their 2-3 yrs program. I have to say I am personally grateful that not all universities require the 3-5 yrs experience. The school I am looking to attend does require 1 year experience as an RN so the post masters after WGU is going benefit me in this particular case. I've worked as an LVN for 4 1/2 years before graduating RN school. That would suck if I had to wait 8 years after becoming a nurse to FINALLY be admitted into a FNP program. Although the roles are different from LVN to RN...some would argue the same as the roles being different for RN to NP. With that all being said, I would hope a new grad nurse with no health care experience would want to gain some experience before starting an FNP program, but everyone is different and not everyone learns the same. So to each their own I guess.

Murse901, MSN, RN · May 8, 2015

I can kind of see the view of that. Just as doctors and PA's don't have to have any medical experience before going to school, and most of them never work in the medical field at all until after they have graduated.

This would be a valid argument if the FNP education were comparable to PA school. It is not. For instance, MSN-level NP programs in my area require only 720 clinical hours. The DNP program here requires 1,200 clinical hours. By contrast, the two PA schools here require almost 2,000 clinical hours.

On top of that, half of the NP didactic coursework is complete garbage -- fluff courses like Healthcare Policy (which will be outdated by the time you graduate), Advanced Nursing Theory (like undergrad nursing theory, only more buzz words), and Advanced Role Development (a class which has no other purpose than to attempt to justify to the student the existence of NP's). Again, by contrast, PA school has no such fluff courses.

Sorry, the whole "nursing is a holistic profession" nonsense doesn't defend the uselessness of these courses. If we want to be taken seriously as peers by MD's, DO's, and even PA's, we need to seriously revamp the education requirements.

And now, I'll step off my soapbox.

Calixan · May 9, 2015

This would be a valid argument if the FNP education were comparable to PA school. It is not. For instance, MSN-level NP programs in my area require only 720 clinical hours. The DNP program here requires 1,200 clinical hours. By contrast, the two PA schools here require almost 2,000 clinical hours.
On top of that, half of the NP didactic coursework is complete garbage -- fluff courses like Healthcare Policy (which will be outdated by the time you graduate), Advanced Nursing Theory (like undergrad nursing theory, only more buzz words), and Advanced Role Development (a class which has no other purpose than to attempt to justify to the student the existence of NP's). Again, by contrast, PA school has no such fluff courses.
Sorry, the whole "nursing is a holistic profession" nonsense doesn't defend the uselessness of these courses. If we want to be taken seriously as peers by MD's, DO's, and even PA's, we need to seriously revamp the education requirements.
And now, I'll step off my soapbox.

While all that may be true, I still don't think all NP schools should require 3-5 yrs experience. Maybe look at the person as a whole and their knowledge base/experience. Or require some type of entrance test to see where you stand (not the GRE because that's just not going to cut it as far as nursing knowledge) kind of like they do before nursing school but maybe cover more nursing topics. I don't know, just an idea. On the other hand, hands on experience is going to be better than a test. I see what you're saying with the clinical hours of NP/PA but that's why I think they should look at the individual and not automatically require 3 yrs experience. I would like to have a life again/kids, and hopefully sooner than 7 years down the line.

Murse901, MSN, RN · May 9, 2015

While all that may be true, I still don't think all NP schools should require 3-5 yrs experience. Maybe look at the person as a whole and their knowledge base/experience.

What knowledge base/experience would you look at for entry into advanced nursing practice other than nursing experience? I don't understand what other qualifier you would consider here.

I would like to have a life again/kids, and hopefully sooner than 7 years down the line.

While I can sympathize with your situation, I don't think that individuals' obligations in their personal lives nor what they want for themselves should really drive the requirements for entry into advanced nursing practice. I think what we should be looking at is -- what's best for the profession and what's best for the patient?

Calixan · May 18, 2015

What knowledge base/experience would you look at for entry into advanced nursing practice other than nursing experience? I don't understand what other qualifier you would consider here.

There you go, nursing experience not just RN experience. People gain experience through different avenues and to have them wait 3-5 years before entering an NP program seems crazy to me just because they weren't an RN all those years. People have experience as an LVN for example and I've known some really amazing RN's who were paramedics for years before becoming an RN. That just seems insane to me to make those people wait 3+ yrs before advancing just because they lack RN experience. I've actually known plenty LP/RN's who were in their first yr of nursing who could run circles around some RN's with over 5 yrs experience. Especially with cardiac patients. These are the nurses I don't think need to wait all those years experience especially when they are entering a field they already have plenty experience in. Just an example, Medics with 10+ yrs experience and 2 yrs as an RN I don't think should be denied entry into a 2-3 yrs NP program. A lot of the nurses I know in my dept at interested in Acute Care NP and to make them wait to become a NP in a field they have years of experience in, I don't know maybe I'm crazy but that doesn't make sense to me (we hire NP's in the ER I work in). This is what I mean when I say look at the person as a whole.

We may just have to agree to disagree on this topic. We could debate the subject forever.

Calixan · May 19, 2015

Eck, so many grammar/spelling errors in my previous post. Sorry!