I made a mistake a couple of days ago...I decided to google "doctor/nurse relationships" and stumbled upon a physician based message board where the docs were *****ing about nurses paging them for stupid things in the middle of the night, etc etc. They also questioned if nurses even had critical thinking skills/what did they actually learn in school, becase of the types of things nurses page for...an example was a nurse who paged about a pt's b/p being low, and per protocal she paged the doc for the low b/p. The doc was angered because this pt's b/p "just runs low" and was consistently low for the past week or so...so obviously he wasn't going to do anything about it, why in the world would she page him in the middle in the night for something so stupid...etc etc. BUT, I would have paged the doc too! PER PROTOCOL I need to page the doc, and document that I paged the doc for this b/p. I'm a relatively new nurse who works night shift (actually 2 years now) and I STILL struggle with this issue, I never know when it is appropriate to page. I mean, I know I shouldn't page for a Colace order at 3am, and I know to page for emergency situations, like respiratory distress, etc....however there are many things in the middle where you just aren't quite sure if you should be waking the doc up at 3am for certain issues/or bothering them when they are in the ED/OR. I feel like there are so many things we need to page on (cover our a--) and document for legal issues, but there is also this fine line where you aren't sure if its really APPROPRIATE. I guess the fact that I'm not a well seasoned nurse adds to this struggle of mine, and its probably one of the most frustrating parts of my job. I don't like to bother people, and I'd be really upset if a doc yelled at me for paging him "for something stupid". It bothers me to hear these doctors complaining about the nurses in this way, ...they just don't even consider what we are going through! What about the fresh post op patient with nausea who is refusing to take the Anzemet already order for them, and DEMANDING that you page the doc for Reglan at 2am?!?! Its just SO frustrating...I'm so sick of being the middle man...anyone else struggle with this or have any advice on how to deal with it? (Sorry for the randomness/mixed thoughts of my post)
My first point is about the doctor's web site that you looked at that was complaining about getting paged by stupid nurses with no critical thinking skiils. If that site is anything like allnurses, there is probably a fair amount of venting going on. If a Dr. took a look around allnurses, he might get the opinion that we all despise doctors, which isn't the case either. So I wouldn't get too bent out of shape by what they say there. And if it's a student doctor web site, then worry about it even less.
My second point is about whether or not to page a physician. Ask yourself this - if it is a matter of protocol to page the physician, but the doc doesn't want you to, what will happen if there is a bad patient outcome and you didn't page? Will the doc back you up, and tell the world that he had told you not to page for that, or will he sell you down the river to save his own a$$? Unless you are sure he's going to fall on his sword for you, page him unless you KNOW that it's something that can wait. (And as a general rule of thumb, unless you carried him in your womb for 9 months, he's not going to protect you - and maybe not even then.)
Most of the docs, even when they grumble, know deep down that they should have been paged. They just grumble because it's 3am, and they're being awakened from a sound sleep. I grumble when I have to run a patient down to a stat CT scan because of LOC changes 30 minutes before shift change, but that doesn't mean that I really think it's inappropriate. It just means that I'm grumbling.
Being a resident is a horrible experience - way too much work, far too little sleep, and attendings riding your butt all the time. I have a LOT of sympathy for them. But still, the last time I checked, nobody snuck up behind some unsuspecting souls on the street, clubbed them in the back of their heads, dragged them into the hospital, and made them residents. They volunteered. They didn't just volunteer- they fought like madmen to get there. So while you do what you can to help them (clustering requests, etc) in the end they're doing what they're being (pitifully) paid to do. So let them grumble, but make the call. The good docs will know that you're just doing your job right, even if they grumble. And the bad ones - well screw 'em.
Specializes in Trauma acute surgery, surgical ICU, PACU.
My first point is about the doctor's web site that you looked at that was complaining about getting paged by stupid nurses with no critical thinking skiils. If that site is anything like allnurses, there is probably a fair amount of venting going on. If a Dr. took a look around allnurses, he might get the opinion that we all despise doctors, which isn't the case either. So I wouldn't get too bent out of shape by what they say there. And if it's a student doctor web site, then worry about it even less.
My second point is about whether or not to page a physician. Ask yourself this - if it is a matter of protocol to page the physician, but the doc doesn't want you to, what will happen if there is a bad patient outcome and you didn't page? Will the doc back you up, and tell the world that he had told you not to page for that, or will he sell you down the river to save his own a$$? Unless you are sure he's going to fall on his sword for you, page him unless you KNOW that it's something that can wait. (And as a general rule of thumb, unless you carried him in your womb for 9 months, he's not going to protect you - and maybe not even then.)
Most of the docs, even when they grumble, know deep down that they should have been paged. They just grumble because it's 3am, and they're being awakened from a sound sleep. I grumble when I have to run a patient down to a stat CT scan because of LOC changes 30 minutes before shift change, but that doesn't mean that I really think it's inappropriate. It just means that I'm grumbling.
Being a resident is a horrible experience - way too much work, far too little sleep, and attendings riding your butt all the time. I have a LOT of sympathy for them. But still, the last time I checked, nobody snuck up behind some unsuspecting souls on the street, clubbed them in the back of their heads, dragged them into the hospital, and made them residents. They volunteered. They didn't just volunteer- they fought like madmen to get there. So while you do what you can to help them (clustering requests, etc) in the end they're doing what they're being (pitifully) paid to do. So let them grumble, but make the call. The good docs will know that you're just doing your job right, even if they grumble. And the bad ones - well screw 'em.
fins
161 Posts
My first point is about the doctor's web site that you looked at that was complaining about getting paged by stupid nurses with no critical thinking skiils. If that site is anything like allnurses, there is probably a fair amount of venting going on. If a Dr. took a look around allnurses, he might get the opinion that we all despise doctors, which isn't the case either. So I wouldn't get too bent out of shape by what they say there. And if it's a student doctor web site, then worry about it even less.
My second point is about whether or not to page a physician. Ask yourself this - if it is a matter of protocol to page the physician, but the doc doesn't want you to, what will happen if there is a bad patient outcome and you didn't page? Will the doc back you up, and tell the world that he had told you not to page for that, or will he sell you down the river to save his own a$$? Unless you are sure he's going to fall on his sword for you, page him unless you KNOW that it's something that can wait. (And as a general rule of thumb, unless you carried him in your womb for 9 months, he's not going to protect you - and maybe not even then.)
Most of the docs, even when they grumble, know deep down that they should have been paged. They just grumble because it's 3am, and they're being awakened from a sound sleep. I grumble when I have to run a patient down to a stat CT scan because of LOC changes 30 minutes before shift change, but that doesn't mean that I really think it's inappropriate. It just means that I'm grumbling.
Being a resident is a horrible experience - way too much work, far too little sleep, and attendings riding your butt all the time. I have a LOT of sympathy for them. But still, the last time I checked, nobody snuck up behind some unsuspecting souls on the street, clubbed them in the back of their heads, dragged them into the hospital, and made them residents. They volunteered. They didn't just volunteer- they fought like madmen to get there. So while you do what you can to help them (clustering requests, etc) in the end they're doing what they're being (pitifully) paid to do. So let them grumble, but make the call. The good docs will know that you're just doing your job right, even if they grumble. And the bad ones - well screw 'em.