Frontier or PhillyU

Oh, how I want an answer to this question as well!

With everything field of study, there are good programs and there are not-so-good programs, but I really think the bulk of one's learning comes from what you put into it. I know many CNMs who've gone to some very fancy, reputable programs and not had the best experiences, so I don't know that the cost of tuition always translates to excellence.

Both programs have doubled the ACNM (ACME??) minimal requirements for clinical experiences, and both score high in my book for that alone. My understanding is that the PhilaU program was created by Frontier instructors who wanted to create a different route to midwifery (the CM) as well as a Master's program in Midwifery, not Nursing.

PhilaU is more expensive than Frontier, though both are considerably cheaper than many CNM programs out there.

I've only heard excellent things about Frontier, and know quite a few Frontier grads who are fantastic midwives.

I personally love the idea of having a degree in Midwifery instead of Nursing... the $20,000 question is, is it worth it?

I think PhilaU had some online orientations--- I thought they were recorded, but I can't seem to find them right now on their website. Those were rather useful in providing an overview of the program.

Your questions are my questions. I hope others can chime in with some more responses.

Glad somebody else is having the same issue! I, too like the idea of having a degree in midwifery itself- after all, after passing the NCLEX I will already be a registered nurse.

I wonder if the differences in degrees has any bearing on job prospects?

Also, I should add that I am in an ADN program now ( I will begin these classes in 2014, but I have been accepted). If I did decide on PhillyU and stayed in the program that I am in, I will have an ADN and a MS Midwifery...I wonder if it would be better if I got into a BSN program instead, that way I would have at least a 4 year degree in nursing....any thoughts would be appreciated

Do you have a Bachelor's degree? It sounds like you do, if you have a Master's degree in Spanish.

I would say skip the BSN, but make sure you're taking all your prereqs for the graduate schools you're looking at. Statistics, chemistry, nutrition, etc - if these courses weren't already required for the ADN program.

The only thing I've recently heard - and I can't remember where - is that MS CNMs are not eligible for federal loan repayment programs - but MSN grads are. I don't know if that's true.

I know lots of CNMs who do not have bachelor's degrees in nursing. Some were RNs first who got a non-BSN bachelor's degree. Some had bachelor's degrees in other careers, and found their way to midwifery as a second career.

I haven't seen any state law that specifically requires an MSN degree for CNM licensure. Just 1) being an RN, 2) having the CNM credential.

If you look at the ACNM site, you'll see that not all of the programs are MSN, there are DNP and MS programs and one MPH program.

http://midwife.org/Education-Programs-Directory

I guess the biggest difference with PhilaU is that they have a distance-based CM option (yay!) but that doesn't really apply to those want to become CNMs.

My experience with going to get my ADN (A Very Affordable Option, I may add), is that during school, everyone told me my other Bachelor's degree was 'useless.' But when I've applied to CNM programs, they very much recognize my 4 year degree. So, some will tell you the BSN is necessary.... don't believe it.

Now, there are hospitals that instantly put my resume in the circular file because I don't have a BSN when I apply for RN jobs... I'm finding that to be a disheartening reality. But graduate schools are more than willing to see the value in an applicant's prior academic experience.

Long answer. Clear as mud. Right?

Lol great answer!

Hospitals want magnet status, so I guess that is why they are looking for a BSN. Do you know if a MS in Midwifery would be considered a degree in nursing for magnet purposes? I looked on their website, but it did not mention anything about specialty degrees.

Have you heard from any of the schools that you have applied to?

I know a handful of Phila U students-- based on what I have heard, I do NOT recommend PhilaU. I've heard great things about Frontier, but don't know anyone personally. With both programs though, you have to find your own clinical sites. If the site ever falls through, you can be in a real bind that can curtail your graduation date. This can happen in any program, but you have more protection if your program takes care of this because they can advocate for you.

If you plan on working as a nurse while in grad program, consider BSN as many hospitals are requiring it for new hires. If this is not the case in your area, I would not worry about it. However, things change FAST in healthcare.

Funny how things change! Since I posted this, I have been accepted to a BSN program, which I am pursuing. With respect to Phila U, I have been in contact with quite a few students via Facebook and everyone has said great things about the program, with the exception of 1. Is there anything specific you could comment on that would be an issue with their program?

Phila U seems like a strong program from what I know of the curriculum. But, I have heard of students having set backs with their progression through the program. A good question to ask faculty would be about their retention rate (after the start of clinicals). Ask a lot of questions about their grading requirements and what happens if a student is not successful either in clinical or theory. Find out "why" students may not complete the program in a timely manner. Overall, I get a sense that there are a lot of politics there and that the faculty are not actively involved with helping students who are not meeting certain expectations.

This just was not the case in my program. So I found it really disheartening to hear (from a few people). My comments come from meeting students at the last 2 ACNM conferences, having 1 good friend in the program, and a few acquaintances that I have met at the ACNM conferences. Clearly, these are isolated cases, but I believe in having all the info when making timely and costly decisions. If anything, you learn what not to do. Good luck with your journey. It's hard but it will be so worth it no matter where you go.

Mmm, I hadn't heard anything like that...but TY for the heads up. I am leaning toward them as I could be done a year earlier, and given that I am already 35, I really want to get done as soon as possible. It is always good to hear all sides before making a decision :)