Assertiveness training project for school...please help

lucianne · Nov 10, 2005

Jon, I will tell you what I just told someone else looking for help with a school assignment:

I'm not trying to be harsh, but think about what you are asking. The point of these assignments is not simply getting information about topics you've been assigned, but learning how to do lit searches and how to find the information you need so that you know how to find reliable information in the future.
...............
Again, I'm not trying to be harsh, but you are the umpteenth student who has come here asking for help on an assignment. If it were something difficult to find and you had tried, I'd be happy to help you refine your search or offer other terms you might try, but for something as simple as side effects of meds you should be able to do this yourself.

In your case, all you need to do is Google "assertiveness training" and you should find plenty of information for your project.

tjusnjon · Nov 10, 2005

and you are an example of why some people are afraid to ask for help. such a pity that some people like you choose to act that way.

rn/writer, RN · Nov 10, 2005

and you are an example of why some people are afraid to ask for help. such a pity that some people like you choose to act that way.

Wow. Feel free to disagree, but without the snarky tone, please.

You're relatively new to this site so you may not know that this kind of request has been a recurring problem. For some students, the information here seems like a lifeline when they are feeling overwhelmed. For others, it would see that we appear to offer an easy way out. It can be difficult to distinguish between the two.

The requests I take most seriously are the ones that say, "I Googled these words and checked out these sites and I'm still a bit confused." They ask for an opinion about a specific book or article or website. Or they need help with an ethical or practical matter and want the benefit of hearing someone else's experience. You can't Google that.

Most of us are happy to share the things we've learned and the resources we've discovered. But we don't want to be doing someone else's homework. After all, those of us who are nurses have already had our crack at this assignment or something similar.

You're welcome to try again. I hope you do. But, keep in mind the things I mentioned above.

For the record, your response was aggressive, not assertive.

stnursebee · Nov 10, 2005

I am the other student that lucianne is refering to. And as I stated there, I am new to this site and did not look through the site when I joined, I just joined straight away. I was not looking for the answers, just any keywords or pathways that I had not thought of. And also friendship with other student nurses and nurses as we have something in common.

rn/writer - yes you are right newbies more than likely do not know about your recurring problem. I feel that you are being harsh when you say that people are looking for an easy way out. You have no idea what situation the other student or myself is in. I accept that there are students out there looking for that easy ride, but please dont pressume that this is the case we me, or the other student initially as you dont know our situations.

You say that you take seriously only the threads that start with 'I googled this etc'. Well I had already done a search on my topic and as stated I was looking for other keywords that I had not thought of, or that would help with my work. I did not ask my question specifically and started off generally and would have become more specific if I received any responses.

And for the record I do not believe that the response by tjusnjon was aggressive - I totally understand where he is coming from, from a nurse I recently encountered. I have noticed that some students have more confidence that others, and find it hard to ask for help. This does not mean that they are not a good student, it may just be there personality. And do not have the potential to become a good nurse.

I feel for learner drivers when other drivers become frustrated by them. They were not magically born with driving skills were they so why get frustrated. People tend to lose touch with what it was like to learn to drive. It is the same for nursing and every other profession.

I joined this site in the hope of friendship, guidance and support at this stressful time. I cannot believe that we as students have received responses like these. This is so not what I wanted from joining this site.

rn/writer, RN · Nov 11, 2005

first things first. i'd like to clarify that my comments were directed at tjusnjon, not at you. (i never even read your post--only lucianne's response that tjusnjon quoted.)

secondly, i mentioned two types of posters specific to this kind of inquiry and stated that it can be difficult to distinguish between them. the ones who are overwhelmed and hoping for some direction are the ones i am happy to help. but the sad reality is that there are others who are looking for an easy way out and i don't think i'm doing them--or their classmates or their future patients--any favors by doing the work for them.

i feel that you are being harsh when you say that people are looking for an easy way out. you have no idea what situation the other student or myself is in. i accept that there are students out there looking for that easy ride, but please dont pressume that this is the case we me, or the other student initially as you dont know our situations.

it would appear that you have leapt to a conclusion or two that a re-reading of my response doesn't support. the idea that some folks are looking for an easy way out is a statement of fact, not an accusation. did i say that i knew what situation you or tjusnjon were in? did i presume anything? or was my entire point that it's hard to make a determination about the kind and level of help that's being asked for from a generic inquiry that contains very little information.

you say that you take seriously only the threads that start with 'i googled this etc'. well i had already done a search on my topic and as stated i was looking for other keywords that i had not thought of, or that would help with my work. i did not ask my question specifically and started off generally and would have become more specific if i received any responses.

that's not what my post says. i referred to posts i take most seriously as the ones who demonstrate some familiarity with the topic and who can share some of the research they have done. i can't speak to your post because it was on another thread and it was never my intention to address what you had or hadn't done. i won't try to speak for anyone else on this forum, but what draws me in, especially with newbies, is someone who shows initiative. that might mean mentioning some basic research or asking specific questions that would occur after reading or doing some other investigating. this would give me the feeling that i am assisting someone with their work, not doing it for them. besides, sometimes the benefit of these assignments extends beyond the information itself to the actual process of gathering it (lucianne's point). you learn how to find what you need and then ask for help digesting or clarifying what you've rounded up.

this is not to say that you have to have your paper written in order to get help, only to let you know that i (and others on this board) like to see enough of a good faith effort (the preliminary steps at least) to let us feel like we're assisting and not enabling.

and for the record i do not believe that the response by tjusnjon was aggressive - i totally understand where he is coming from, from a nurse i recently encountered. i have noticed that some students have more confidence that others, and find it hard to ask for help. this does not mean that they are not a good student, it may just be there personality. and do not have the potential to become a good nurse.

it wasn't his being frustrated that classified his response as aggressive but the method he used to express that frustration.

and you are an example of why some people are afraid to ask for help. such a pity that some people like you choose to act that way.

lucianne's response stated that she did not intend to be harsh and then offered an explanation about why tjusnjon's inquiry raised some flags. they are the same concerns i mentioned. tjusnjon came back with a condescending and judgmental statement that didn't at all address the concerns lucianne expressed. it was not a rebuttal or a further inquiry but a shaming statement. that is not assertive but aggressive.

asking for help on this board need not be intimidating. if your personality is naturally shy, you might want to include a note that you find it challenging to ask for help. we don't eat our young--gosh almighty, i hate that phrase--but we may make some inquiries of our own for the reasons stated above.

i feel for learner drivers when other drivers become frustrated by them. they were not magically born with driving skills were they so why get frustrated. people tend to lose touch with what it was like to learn to drive. it is the same for nursing and every other profession.

please don't assume that the miscommunications that took place regarding this matter can all be put down to the fact that lucianne and i have forgotten what it was like to be students. i can't speak for her, but i am very sympathetic to the plight of student nurses and have put much time and effort into helping and encouraging those farther back on the path. remember, my first response had nothing to do with your post. even with tjusnjon, the negativity expressed was not directed at him personally but rather toward his retort to lucianne. she tried to give him information and his response was to insult her.

i joined this site in the hope of friendship, guidance and support at this stressful time. i cannot believe that we as students have received responses like these. this is so not what i wanted from joining this site.

we're actually a pretty decent bunch here. what lucianne and i tried to do was inform you guys about an area that has been troublesome, not say anything bad about you personally. this can be an amazing place. posters come from all over the world. they range in age from still in high school to 70+. some have had previous careers while others are just beginning. misunderstandings occur on occasion, but we go to great lengths to work things out. once in a great while, when there is a rare outright attack, the moderators take the offender to task and they may even shut down a thread because they do take courtesy and respect quite seriously.

i hope you will be able to put this rough start aside and feel free to explore this wonderful site.

take care,

Thunderwolf, MSN, RN · Nov 11, 2005

Thread review:

The board is an excellent place to obtain feedback. It is also, as demonstrated, easily to miscommunicate with feelings potentially hurt if our ideas are not worded clearly. For new members who are students who need feedback on assignments, we have a forum for that called Nursing Student Assistance forum. I recommend using that forum instead of the other forums for school projects. Again, we have a wonderful board if used correctly. Older members, please point new users who are students who are making these inquiries about school projects to that forum. Lastly, all members, new and old, need to abide by the standards of the board...respectful posting, even during disagreements.

Thank you.

GalRN · Nov 11, 2005

Taking into account both sides of this issue... and I re-read each several times, I have my own opinion. Although the student nurse assistance board is the most appropriate place to ask help (and one should try that thread first) I know that I don't always check that part of the forum. While I don't know of any specific assertiveness sites, there are other places on the internet that I know of that could help w/ other psych related questions. I feel that if I were a student I would probably post a question both on the student thread and in the thread for that specialty to get a maximum response.

As nurses I think that we should take extra special care of our students... they are the future! I will continue to try to help w/ any student questions regardless of where they are posted.

Thunderwolf, you have a valid point too. I will try to check the student assistance thread more often.