Any new grads having major employment problems?

Sezza83, BSN, RN · Oct 14, 2012

I'm Australian born & educated and I have to agree with the job situation. I graduated 7 years ago and I had multiple job offers for a graduate (4 different offers I think). But boy has it changed! I will finish my post grad dip in midwifery this year and was lucky to find a hospital to let me do my placements. The unit I'm on is very short staffed but they can't take on any of us post grads (there's 5 of us) even though we all have more than 5 years experience as registered nurses.

Speaking to students (both student nurses and midwives) the situation is very grim. In Victoria they estimate that only 70% of new graduates will find work and that's local students, international students have to wait for the left over computer match positions, but I don't think there will be any left.

I'm not sure what international nursing agencies are telling overseas nurses wanting to immigrate but from the ground it looks like there are no jobs unless you are very experienced.

ceridwyn · Oct 14, 2012

I have been telling overseas nurses, especially on the Phillipine International forum and before and its former forum, for the past 1-2 years, there are no jobs, for new graduate nurses here, but unfortunately, the nature of the beast will not hear of such things and the dreams continue.

Its about time the unions, government and AHPRA started addressing this issue, that Australia is not short of nurses with little experience and therefore should be taken off the shortage skills list. Though some do find work, through networking, ties with culture etc.

I did hear the authorities were considering a nurse applicant to have 2 years paid experience as one of the criteria for Registration, but I doubt with all the interested shareholders involved in this decision are very keen to be seen to embrace multiculturism and not offend any residents here or our neighbours and the UK, this will go by the wayside.

..and you are correct the english communication is something to be desired most of the time, to me the IELTS 7 has been a waste of time, its accent which is the problem.

ceridwyn · Oct 14, 2012

I'm Australian born & educated and I have to agree with the job situation. I graduated 7 years ago and I had multiple job offers for a graduate (4 different offers I think). But boy has it changed! I will finish my post grad dip in midwifery this year and was lucky to find a hospital to let me do my placements. The unit I'm on is very short staffed but they can't take on any of us post grads (there's 5 of us) even though we all have more than 5 years experience as registered nurses.
Speaking to students (both student nurses and midwives) the situation is very grim. In Victoria they estimate that only 70% of new graduates will find work and that's local students, international students have to wait for the left over computer match positions, but I don't think there will be any left.
I'm not sure what international nursing agencies are telling overseas nurses wanting to immigrate but from the ground it looks like there are no jobs unless you are very experienced.

What! even RN midwives are having trouble getting graduate year or first year job......this is bad.

Sezza83, BSN, RN · Oct 14, 2012

Yep, I'm a RN with 7 years experience plus I was a div 2 for 3 years (so 10yrs all up). I have another post grad in theatre/anesthetics/pacu and just gone back to do a post grad in midwifery. In my class at Uni only 50% of us have jobs for next year. Some of us have 20+ yrs experience in icu or ed. Where I'm doing placement now my manager is trying to hire us but not as grads because higher management won't let her run a graduate program. They won't be taking on any new students either next year. This hospital isn't small either, 400 beds, 3800 births a year.

imaginations · Oct 16, 2012

I work in a local health district that employs more nurses from the UK and Ireland combined (per campus statistics). Add to that the number of New Zealand trained nurses and often it's "spot the Aussie" on the floor or in the tea room.

Why is the state health department employing (and sponsoring visas of [uK/Irish] - and giving new graduate positions [New Zealand]) nurses instead of a) Australian new grads in Australian new grad programs and b) giving experienced Australian nurses jobs in Australia? There are two New Zealand trained grads in my group of ten graduates, and many more New Zealand trained nurses who were previously new grads in the hospital/network and now have full time jobs.

ceridwyn · Oct 16, 2012

I work in a local health district that employs more nurses from the UK and Ireland combined (per campus statistics). Add to that the number of New Zealand trained nurses and often it's "spot the Aussie" on the floor or in the tea room. Why is the state health department employing (and sponsoring visas of [uK/Irish] - and giving new graduate positions [New Zealand]) nurses instead of a) Australian new grads in Australian new grad programs and b) giving experienced Australian nurses jobs in Australia? There are two New Zealand trained grads in my group of ten graduates, and many more New Zealand trained nurses who were previously new grads in the hospital/network and now have full time jobs.

Because there is a nursing shortage, according to our union and all the do goody groups - more immigrants the better and therefore this goes with the our government policy to look good to the world that Australia has ridden out the recession, please come trade with us.I was told by a person the other day Australia is the easiest country for immigration get a sponsorship visa and then within 3 months you can be permanent resident.- same rights as a citizen but cannot vote.It stinks that nurses educated overseas get into Australian graduate spaces when there are so many Australian graduates without a place. But if you say anything that we should look after those in the country, you are called a racist, fair dinkum We are politically far too correct as well.I've got children who want jobs in the future after graduating! I want to think my government cares about them! .IMHO

joeldew · Oct 16, 2012

We have to view this situation with alot more maturity and better insight.

There appears to be a misalignment between the knowledge/skills of a university-educated nurse and the demands of the health-care system, particularly the hospitals. This is because for many years, nursing education in Australia has not prepared nursing students for "nursing" but rather for "research" and "leadership". A simple read through some of the nursing programs in Australia will underline this point, hence, the deficiencies many Australian-educated nurses confront when they try for overseas registration. As such, the universities are not producing employees - nurses - with valuable resources with which to contribute to the health-care systems. For instance, many new nurses are quite competent in showcasing their knowledge in the "lived experience of an illness" yet are unable to properly dress a wound or attend to an emergency. This leaves our hospitals, and indeed the patients, in a very critical position (no pun intended).

Hence, the hospitals are forced to look elsewhere to "fill-the-gaps".

It is not too surprising to find that many hospitals, particularly the private sector, are very willing to employ foreign-educated nurses (FENs). FENs are better trained, more competent and possess skills which meet the immediate demands of our hospitals. For instance, all nursing students in India are required to attend a fourth year in which they study midwifery. As such, they also qualify as midwives. Their skills/knowledge are immediately transferable/applicable to our healthcare system because it is resource which we can easily capture and utilize without too much expense.

The nursing profession in Australia is "over-professionalize" and this stems from the "over-conceptualisation" of many nursing programs. In other words, I learnt far more in my first month of nursing at the hospital than three years of a Masters' program.

ceridwyn · Oct 16, 2012

Thank you on your views of nursing education in Australia and the assessment of Australian new graduates and experienced nurses in Australia.When one asks why people here already in Australia are not given first preference in jobs - these assessments are often made by people of different cultures.At no time in my post, have I made any assessments of poorer education of nurses from any of our many immigrant countries.Importantly nurses educated in this country are given many skills, critical thinking is one of them. You will find nurses in the US are also educated in the university system, with same amount do prac but with midwifery and pads included.Private hospitals have many, many, nurses from overseas, because they pay less and do not have to adhere to patient ratios, and therefore more job openings, this is acceptable to new nurses from overseas in the past that are after any employment for sponsorship.Nurses from India are not accepted as midwivess in Australia, along with those from the US and the Phillipines, even though it is included or part of or tacked on to the end of their degree.Another is nurses educated from overseas and here in Australia has made the Australian nursing profession what it is today- a well respected, good pay and we'll resourced, best practise workforce. Our patient outcomes are the best in the world, maybe you have highlited the inadequacies of the entry master program in nursing in under 3 years that should be taken up with AHPRA.

Sezza83, BSN, RN · Oct 17, 2012

I've worked in both public & private hospitals and give me public any day! More FEN work in private because there is a higher turn over of staff. I am one who worked in private just until I landed a job in the public system. The pay is better, the ratios are better, it's more mentally stimulating because I'm expected to do more complex things. Where do you think you go when you're really really really sick? A major public hospital!

Sezza83, BSN, RN · Oct 17, 2012

Oh. Computer match came out yesterday in Vic for graduate years.... Out of the 7 undergraduate students currently on my ward, 1 got a position for next year....

joeldew · Oct 17, 2012

Thank you on your views of nursing education in Australia and the assessment of Australian new graduates and experienced nurses in Australia.When one asks why people here already in Australia are not given first preference in jobs - these assessments are often made by people of different cultures.At no time in my post, have I made any assessments of poorer education of nurses from any of our many immigrant countries.Importantly nurses educated in this country are given many skills, critical thinking is one of them. You will find nurses in the US are also educated in the university system, with same amount do prac but with midwifery and pads included.Private hospitals have many, many, nurses from overseas, because they pay less and do not have to adhere to patient ratios, and therefore more job openings, this is acceptable to new nurses from overseas in the past that are after any employment for sponsorship.Nurses from India are not accepted as midwivess in Australia, along with those from the US and the Phillipines, even though it is included or part of or tacked on to the end of their degree.Another is nurses educated from overseas and here in Australia has made the Australian nursing profession what it is today- a well respected, good pay and we'll resourced, best practise workforce. Our patient outcomes are the best in the world, maybe you have highlited the inadequacies of the entry master program in nursing in under 3 years that should be taken up with AHPRA.

Perhaps, you could tell me wherein my original post did I mentioned that my thoughts were aimed at you. Nonetheless, thank-you for feeling some attachment to it.

My original post argues that the lack of new grad positions has much to do with the lack of "capital" new nurses bring to an organisation - hospitals. This has much to do with the level and type of education being delivered and the demands of the hospital systems. An acquisition of a Masters' degree may provide you with better insight and clarity.

Wherein my original post did I state that Indian-educated nurses can be registered as midwives in Australia? I stated that their knowledge/skills are transferable/applicable to our health-care system. This means that the knowledge/skills they possess can be harnessed and utilized for the good of the system with little expense to us.

To assist your understanding, perhaps, I should have made it more clearer. Hence, "As such, they also qualify as midwives in India".

AHPRA has nothing to do with this forum (or the original post)...This is a depository wherein nurses can share their thoughts.