Any ACTUAL Second Degree BSN/RN's?

kcalohagirl · Mar 29, 2007

My BSN is my second degree. My first was a BA.

When I went back to school, I was told that science classes wouldn't be transferrable if they were more than a certain number of years old.

As for the statement that "anything you would truly LEARN would come in actual clinical practice" well I have a few things to add to that.

I don't know what your first degree was, but I can tell you that nursing school was different than absolutely anything I had ever done before. There is a huge amount of "book learning" that needs to be done before students are let loose on real patients. You need to have a basic idea of the skills you need, yes. And those skills do get better when you use them in a clinical setting. However, you also learn about pharmacology, about physiology, about pathophysiology so that you can recognize what is happening with certain disease processes. You learn what lab values are pertinent to the patient, what is affecting those values, and the relationships between all the body's processes.These things also get better the more you are in a clinical setting, but you need to have the theoretical foundation to build on.

As for how I paid the bills while going to school? I did anything I could. I waitressed, I bartended, I worked as an aide in a hospital. Working as an aide helped prepare me for life on the floor as a nurse.

The school I went to was affiliated with a local hospital which would then pay for your Senior year of nursing school if you signed a 2 year commitment to work nights after you graduated. With all the opportunities at all the hospitals in the city I live in, I chose not to make that commitment. I paid for the year of prereqs I needed at the community college out of pocket and took out loans for my last two years. The hospital I did work for gave me a hiring bonus when I signed on in return for a 1 year commitment. I could live with a one year commitment. *grin*

You may be able to challenge certain of your pre-reqs, but I wouldn't stake my life on it. I doubt you would be able to challenge any of the nursing core classes.

You might want to rethink your statement: "Because frankly to me, someone asking somebody who already possesses a degree in whatever field it might be to pay once again for a college education seems a bit absurd to me..." Whatever degree you already hold is *not* a nursing degree. Nursing is a profession. Classes for nursing are distinct. The fact that I already had a BA meant exactly nothing when it came to nursing school except that I had already taken the majority of the core requirements.

Good luck to you.

luvmy3kids · Mar 29, 2007

I am working on my ADN and I have a BS in Corrections and Law Enforcement. I have to agree with the previous poster. What you learn in Nursing school is completely different than anything you would learn in another field of study.

If your basic science courses are over 2+ yrs old, most likely you would have to repeat them in order to satisfy the pre-req for more advanced courses that you have to take for the program.

Therefore there is A LOT of classroom time devoted to the nursing degree. The clinical setting is a big part of it (of course)... but you need to have a very good understanding of the skills you will be doing prior to being allowed to perform them on a patient in a clinical setting. Not to mention the other things the PP mentioned as well.....

I guess I'm not sure if you are interested in becomming a nurse or a lab tech??? If you are looking into becomming a lab tech, you may not need quite as much schooling (I'm not sure of the requirements). If you are interested in nursing school.... check and see if they offer evenings and weekends.... otherwise you may need to find a job that you can do during the evenings (makes it hard to study I know....)....

As far as working goes for me... I'm fortunate that I get to stay home with my kids while my husband works to support me through school. I'm very lucky because the school I attend has a day program only.... so my options would be limited if I had to work out of the house during the day....

Again if you are looking at the BSN/ADN program.... working in any type of healthcare setting will not only get your "foot in the door" but will give you great experience as well. Good luck to you.

buddhak0n · Mar 29, 2007

I'm currently finishing up just a local Community college course program that's affilliated with the county hospital in Phlebotomy.. This would "qualify" me to work as a CPT or Lab tech and don't get me wrong ....

It's not like I believe that I would be able to walk out within a few months and be qualified to be a responsible, experienced caregiver.....

But in the same breath, I would venture to guess that with a bit of study and the opportunity to take a few exams, I'd be able to test out of quite a bit of what a local community college considers to be CORE requirements for any associates nursing program...

Would that mean that I would be "qualified" to be a working , experienced ER or other nurse capable of leading and treating in a hospital setting?

Absolutely NOT ... but at that point, I would believe that a majority of your actually skill building would begin.

Repeating basic Chemistry and Biology courses that I qualified for AP Credit at the age of 15 in prep school is certainly not going to make a better qualifed "nurse" in a crisis situation in any ER... Completing my base level education requirements that would get me "in the front door" coupled with years of experience working alongside qualified personnel would be just about the ONLY way you would gain that type of experience......

And I would venture to guess as in any field, some people go that route, other people go a completely different route... Some people have talents in one field, other people have talents in another...

A tremendous physician who excels at pediatric treatment may be a completely lost case when it comes to ER medicine and vice versa..

An Accelerated BSN program would be what I would be looking for, however due to my geographic location, I'm a bit limited in my options should I wish to stay in this area.....

Don't get me wrong... I think that the educational portion of any school would be significantly challenging, but at the same time... some of the material regardless of what you may be led to believe is NOT exactly advanced theoretical physics .

Anyone ever heard of this program for people looking to just get certified at the most basic level? www.college-net.com

Sounds a bit fishy to me...... But seriously I've known plenty of nurses who went to all different nursing schools and a good percentage of the shortage has to do with they thought they were getting into ONE thing and the Reality was completely different so they leave..

So what you have is a Thriving NETWORK of organizations looking to SELL you Education but few producing Problem solving WORKERS .......

Hey just my two cents being just a plain ole Business person . :idea:

buddhak0n · Mar 29, 2007

Whatever degree you already hold is *not* a nursing degree. Nursing is a profession. Classes for nursing are distinct. The fact that I already had a BA meant exactly nothing when it came to nursing school except that I had already taken the majority of the core requirements.
Good luck to you.

I agree it's not a "nursing" degree but it's also when you get out of "nursing" school IT'S NOT a medical Degree........

Hey I just happen to be in a great state when it comes to the HealthCare Profession as a whole. So some of this just cracks me up.

See www.umdnj.edu if you need further information. Rolling on the floor laughing at this point.

Seriously, I went to graduate school as well and there's a ton of "nurses" out there that wouldn't have passed some of the "core" classes in my junior year of High School. And I'm sure that in my field they would struggle with certain coursework just as anyone would not be able to digest and interpret usefully a Physicians Desk Reference within 48 hours.

Come on folks .. Who are we kidding with some of this stuff?

And I'm not being belittling OR disrespectful but at SOME point somebody has to call a HORSE a horse.

kcalohagirl · Mar 29, 2007

I may be totally off-base here, but I really do feel like you are being belittling and disrespectful.

As you say, it is *not* a medical degree, however, it is the bedside nurses who spend the most time with the patients, who inform doctors of lab and test results (and in the University Medical Center I work at, if the doctors you are reporting to happen to be young residents, you often inform them of the significance of such results) and who are the first ones to notice when something is not quite right with a patient. On my floor at least, the doctors and nurses work together as a team and there is a great deal of respect on both sides. The docs spend 5 minutes with the patient, we spend a great deal more.

I'm sorry you feel that there are nurses who couldn't have passed your high school class. Although I admit there are some nurses I went to school with that I would prefer not take care of me, I would not insult them to that degree.

Some of the best nurses I know were not straight A students, yet some of the worst ones I've encountered were.

You seem to have a very biased an possibly not completely accurate idea of what nursing entails. You may be well served to look into the profession further before committing yourself to a profession you may later decide you are not well suited to.

buddhak0n · Mar 29, 2007

Some of the best nurses I know were not straight A students, yet some of the worst ones I've encountered were.
You seem to have a very biased an possibly not completely accurate idea of what nursing entails. You may be well served to look into the profession further before committing yourself to a profession you may later decide you are not well suited to.

I actually completely AGREE with you although you may not think so.

What I'm saying is that the educational REQUIREMENTS are simply a bare minimum to entry into the profession. The true test of whether a nurse or any practitioner for that matter is any good comes from actual practice...

I would be the last person to say that a "nurse" who has 25 years of actual bedside experience who lacks a Bachelor's degree does not know just a LITTLE bit more than a college kid with a shiny piece of paper.

I don't think new "nurses" can be truly educated in the classroom at ALL.. And for that reason I find some of the circuitous "waiting" list programs with some of their supposed necessary "training" silly... I would think the best training anyone could receive would be facility based with real patients and real doctors in real medicine... Sure unfortunately practical matters don't allow that EVERY single person who wants to pursue a degree of some sort ACTUALLY train with a live case... But without hands on training, working in a health care facility solely on the basis of what I read in my book, would be akin to somebody trying to fix leer jets with the product owner's manual.

I guess what I'm saying is the doctors and experienced nurses are there for a reason and if there were a true Nursing Shortage as opposed to a burgeoning Nurse education business.... why would hospitals routinely have a long list of Per diem on call nurses .. Oh and as far as "nurse's aides" go don't even waste your time with some of these agencies if you actually need somebody to show up regularly... I've been bouncing around with one of these agencies for about 3 months now trying to get somebody to show up for something as simple as checking on an elderly woman who recently broke her hip.

But if I went by my local county hospital, it would be overflowing with station after station of people who feel disrespected and are tremendously conscious of legal matters... --- And it's not their fault.. It's a horrible state of affairs in some ways.

Some of the nursing shortage storyline is just a bit "exaggerated" in my not so humble opinion.

If the basic educational components were so important, how come state boards of nursing routinely allow foreign students to simply test into certification? Just my two cents... Everyone has opinions.. we know how that goes.

zena231 · Mar 29, 2007

I have a BA and am now going through a local community college for my ADN in nursing. My entire class is made up of 2nd, 3rd career type people. It is really pretty interesting to see the variety there. Our program requires at least a bachelor's degree, and we also have a few with master's who decided they wanted to be RNs.

I work fulltime for a hospital doing scheduling for surgeries and outpatient radiology procedures. My hospital has a program that pays for your classes at this specific college with required 2 yr committment afterwards.

I only had a few classes to take outside of nursing ones and had all of those done before starting the actual nursing classes. With that said, it has been very time consuming, tiring, and I'm glad to say almost over.

I have to agree with the others. I discovered (and am still discovering)just how much more there was to learn in nursing world. I was not a bad student the first time around, just didn't know what I really wanted to do when I "grew up". I am in class with many educated and intelligent people and many of them have struggled with nursing course work.

I would advise thinking about what you really want to do carefully and if you decide that this is right for you , commit and do it. Also, a job in a medical field is a good idea while you're working your way through nursing school.My classmates who are UAPs have an advantage I think over those of us in different fields. And even my job has taught me a lot about various medical conditions and I think that has been beneficial to me.

mstigerlily · Mar 29, 2007

I have a BA in Psychology from a U.C. school, comparatively I felt that degree was a piece of cake. I have an ADN from a community college, that I found considerably more challenging mainly because I am not a "science person" I am a good writer, reader, debater, researcher. I had to take all the prereqs because I didn't need much science for the Psych degree and what I did take weren't the classes I needed for nursing. However, you say your major was sciences so if you are a very methodical, organized, math oriented person, you will probably find nursing school easy. However, you seem to find nursing a bit beneath you - why did you link to a medical/dental school site? Why not go to medical school instead or consider an advanced nursing degree or PA program? Maybe that would make you feel better about repeating all that school.

What I did during the interim: worked as a CNA, also husband worked, also had two babies. Now I am chipping away on my BSN, need three more classes to finish. I am using a combination of tuition reimbursement, loan forgiveness and scholarships at work to pay back my BSN fees which are very reasonable (online classes). So far this is my score: BA - my mom paid for so cost to me = $0, ADN - I was low income so fees were waived + some scholarships for books, cost = $0, BSN = about $5k that is reimbursable, cost to me = $0 It took a lot of work and a lot of copying documents, filling out and filing forms, writing essays and waiting to get all this paid for, but 'm good at that sort of thing.

I realize that a majority of people out there probably entered the profession the normal way... ..
But I'd like some suggestions from anyone who has been through the nursing as a second career path........
First off, what did you "do" for a living while you reattended the classes you needed to have an income again?
Secondly, is the day when Facilities actually either instruct and or sponsor people in exchange for service to the facility a thing of the past? Because frankly to me, someone asking somebody who already possesses a degree in whatever field it might be to pay once again for a college education seems a bit absurd to me...
What are the situations and under what circumstances can certain requirements towards obtaining R.N. licensure be "challenged" by examination?
Why on earth would someone at a Community college try to tell someone that basic chem or other courses would be Nontransferrable? ( That part gave me a chuckle.. I'd still do better on any generalized Advanced Chem course than a large majority of people )...
Frankly what I've done is just get myself in the door and hope to be working at an ACTUAL health care facility as a lab tech but the idea of having to go back to being a full time student seems absolutely odd to me and many of the hurdles thrown up seem a bit absurd....
Sorry but I'm a bit frustrated but only from an intellectual perspective... I would think that anything you would truly LEARN would come in actual clinical practice but perhaps I discount the value of certain "class" work.
:o

abbylee1211 · Mar 29, 2007

i agree it's not a "nursing" degree but it's also when you get out of "nursing" school it's not a medical degree........
hey i just happen to be in a great state when it comes to the healthcare profession as a whole. so some of this just cracks me up.
see www.umdnj.edu if you need further information. rolling on the floor laughing at this point.
seriously, i went to graduate school as well and there's a ton of "nurses" out there that wouldn't have passed some of the "core" classes in my junior year of high school. and i'm sure that in my field they would struggle with certain coursework just as anyone would not be able to digest and interpret usefully a physicians desk reference within 48 hours.
come on folks .. who are we kidding with some of this stuff?
and i'm not being belittling or disrespectful but at some point somebody has to call a horse a horse.

i'm just not sure what your point is here. so you've been to a good high school. you've been to college. you've been to grad school. in all of your posts, i don't see one good reason why you want to be a nurse. it only seems like you look down on nursing, and anyone associated with it, including current nurses, community college programs for nursing, even the rn licensure process... you seem like you're on such a high horse hear, like you are so much smarter than anyone else in the field.

1) grow up

2) stop thinking you are inherently smarter than everyone else

3) stop assuming you are above all the traditional education, training and procedures associated with starting a program

4) think for just one minute about the fact that you are insulting the very people you are asking help from

to answer your questions:

1: i was a captain in the us army

2: i bartended through school & worked graveyard fedex shifts

3: it is not absurd for you to have to pay for a 2nd degree - you are benefiting by gaining more education and diversifying your resume - no different from a 1st degree

4: i believe most schools will bristle at the idea of students "challenging" nursing exams simply because they feel they're "above" them

5: your course work may be "non-transferrable" if for example you took anatomy i but haven't taken physiology, and they offer it as anatomy & physiology i & ii, or if your statistics class didn't include a lab, or if your microbiology wasn't medical micro. there are multitude of reasons - don't assume community college = podunk

6: if you took basic chemistry & biology at 15, do you really believe you remember enough of it (in enough detail) to say you don't need to take it... and have you thought about the idea that there may be advancements in the meantime?

7: how is a nursing degree not a medical degree? of course a nurse is not a doctor... but it's sounding like you wouldn't have any respect for health care workers except doctors -- or are you smarter than all of them too?

8: you are being belittling & disrespectful

9: there are ns waitlists because there are so many qualified students out there who have a hell of a better attitude & more defined desire to be a nurse than you!

luvmy3kids · Mar 29, 2007

I'm just not sure what your point is here. So you've been to a good high school. You've been to college. You've been to grad school. In ALL of your posts, I don't see ONE good reason why you want to be a NURSE. It only seems like you look down on Nursing, and anyone associated with it, including CURRENT nurses, Community College programs for nursing, even the RN licensure process... You seem like you're on SUCH a high horse hear, like you are SO much smarter than anyone else in the field.
1) grow up
2) stop thinking you are inherently smarter than everyone else
3) stop assuming you are above all the traditional education, training and procedures associated with starting a program
4) think for just ONE minute about the fact that you are insulting the very people you are asking help from
To answer your questions:
1: I was a Captain in the US Army
2: I bartended through school & worked graveyard FedEx shifts
3: It is not absurd for you to have to pay for a 2nd degree - you are benefiting by gaining more education and diversifying your resume - no different from a 1st degree
4: I believe most schools will bristle at the idea of students "challenging" nursing exams simply because they feel they're "above" them
5: your course work may be "non-transferrable" if for example you took Anatomy I but haven't taken Physiology, and they offer it as Anatomy & Physiology I & II, or if your statistics class didn't include a lab, or if your microbiology wasn't medical micro. There are multitude of reasons - don't assume community college = podunk
6: if you took basic chemistry & biology at 15, do you really believe you remember enough of it (in enough detail) to say you don't need to take it... and have you thought about the idea that there may be advancements in the meantime?
7: how is a nursing degree not a medical degree? of course a nurse is not a doctor... but it's sounding like you wouldn't have any respect for health care workers except doctors -- or are you smarter than all of them too?
8: you ARE being belittling & disrespectful
9: there are NS waitlists because there are SO many qualified students out there who have a HELL of a better attitude & more defined desire to be a nurse than you!

:yeahthat: You know.... when I first read this post... I thought the OP was questioning why he/she would have to actually "attend" a school to receive a nursing degree even though he/she was already educated/qualifiede to do so without the degree.... But I thought I'd be the friendly helper and post some info and my personal experiences....

Now I think he/she was just being rude and disrespectful and I don't understand the point of this thread to begin with.

I (personally) feel you might be better suited for doing something other than nursing. Nursing takes compassion for people regardless of their education and compassion for co-workers as well. If you can't see past someone for what type of degree they have maybe you are looking down the wrong path.

Nursing may not be a "medical degree" but it is nothing to roll your eyes at. The nursing shortage is due to the fact that there are not enough qualified instructors out there to teach the amount of material and skills required to become a nurse. (add to the fact that our population is booming and more and more people are out there that require care) Therefore the schools are flooded with highly qualified (sometimes over qualified) applicants who are stuck waiting for 2+ years until there is an opening for them.

I hope whatever you decide, if you do go into nursing, you will have a more compassionate outlook on things... Good luck to you.

Altra, BSN, RN · Mar 30, 2007

because frankly to me, someone asking somebody who already possesses a degree in whatever field it might be to pay once again for a college education seems a bit absurd to me...
what are the situations and under what circumstances can certain requirements towards obtaining r.n. licensure be "challenged" by examination?
by this logic, anyone with a degree in any area of study should be able to just "wing it" and get some practical on-the-job experience in any other field, right? with just some extra self-study and supervised experience, that architecht will do just fine as an attorney, the accountant will function as a chemical engineer, and the former md will be brilliant teaching reading to 1st graders, right?
why on earth would someone at a community college try to tell someone that basic chem or other courses would be nontransferrable? ( that part gave me a chuckle.. i'd still do better on any generalized advanced chem course than a large majority of people )...
after reading your posts, i suspect that this is the root of your indignation. reality check: this is not an unusual situation. school a does not accept xyz course from school b for whatever reason. it is their right as a degree-granting institution to decide what their requirements will be. courses taken over 10 years ago are frequently not considered for transfer credit, particularly in the sciences where there may have been considerable advancement in the field of study in that length of time. you can either continue to be indignant and allow it to totally derail your planned career change, or you can figure out the best way to deal with it.
frankly what i've done is just get myself in the door and hope to be working at an actual health care facility as a lab tech but the idea of having to go back to being a full time student seems absolutely odd to me and many of the hurdles thrown up seem a bit absurd....
then perhaps you need to think about changes in your career path which would not require you to return to school.
sorry but i'm a bit frustrated but only from an intellectual perspective... i would think that anything you would truly learn would come in actual clinical practice but perhaps i discount the value of certain "class" work.
:o

don't know what your first degree was in, but if you feel you learned nothing in the classroom in 4 or more years then i feel badly for you. what a waste.

but in the same breath, i would venture to guess that with a bit of study and the opportunity to take a few exams, i'd be able to test out of quite a bit of what a local community college considers to be core requirements for any associates nursing program...
if a school you're considering applying to will not outright grant credit for previous courses that you have completed in your first degree, perhaps you can take clep exams for some of the core, non-nursing courses.
don't get me wrong... i think that the educational portion of any school would be significantly challenging, but at the same time... some of the material regardless of what you may be led to believe is not exactly advanced theoretical physics .

there's that old phrase ... "don't quit your day job." 'nuff said.