Are online ANP degrees destroying our credibility? - page 15

I was talking to a private practice doctor about an opening in his practice. Currently, I am employed by the hospital. He told me that they will only consider PA's due to having more of a hard... Read More

  1. Visit  elkpark profile page
    1
    Quote from nursegirl2001
    Those who choose to be critical are lacking the skills necessary to practice efficiently, clinically and thus feel threatened. I hope that we focus on the patients whom we have sworn to serve and protect and ignore the ignorant educated fools who unfortunately occupy throughout the healing profession.
    Talk about "rationalizing" -- are you really suggesting that the only reason anyone might have any reservations about or criticisms of online advanced practice nursing programs is because s/he is "ignorant" and an inadequate clinician????
    nursegirl2001 likes this.
  2. Visit  nursegirl2001 profile page
    0
    Elkpark ... Shift+R improves the quality of this image. Shift+A improves the quality of all images on this page.:

    You have completely missed the mark and the point so the rest is up to you....
  3. Visit  elkpark profile page
    0
    Quote from nursegirl2001
    Elkpark ... Shift+R improves the quality of this image. Shift+A improves the quality of all images on this page.:

    You have completely missed the mark and the point so the rest is up to you....

    (Huh???)
  4. Visit  BlueDevil,DNP profile page
    2
    Odd anecdote that tangentially applies to this thread.

    I have a patient whom happens to be an anesthesiologist. She is a somewhat difficult personality, and she did try to bully me at the beginning but I didn't allow it and she came to respect me as a person and provider. We have managed to develop a report. Now, she did ask me once where I went to school, but didn't ask me if it was online or B&M and I don't think she has ever asked me how long I have been a NP. I do not volunteer that info unless asked directly, and I am middle aged so people might assume I have been in practice much longer than I have been. In any event, she was duly impressed by my alma mater and it did earn me some credibility with her. For the record, I went to Duke, mostly online, and have in practice 3 years.

    I was on vacation a few weeks ago, and in my absence she saw the other NP in the practice. Now, let me point out that my NP colleague has over 30 years experience. However, Dr. Patient came back this week and remarked something to the tune of: "Is she new, or did she go to one of those online schools? She obviously doesn't know what she is talking about." This is ludicrous because the subject of their disagreement is in an area in which that NP has over 20 years of specialty experience, lol. My Dr. Patient was just wrong, and my NP colleague was just abrupt and told her so, and Dr. Patient didn't appreciate it. They simply didn't like one another. NP colleague attributed it to the fact that Dr. Patient is a witch with a B, and Dr. Patient attributed it to the fact that my colleague must a) be a new NP or b) have gone to an online school.

    Dr. Patient was totally off the mark because neither of her assumptions is anywhere near fact, but it is interesting to point out that she did use the online school jibe as a snide way to try to insult my colleague. I let her know immediately (with a huge grin) that my program was, in fact, predominantly online; that I graduated in 2009; that I agree with the diagnosis and have been telling her the same thing for 6 months. She said, "oh, well you're terrific. But I still don't think I have _____________." Which she most certainly does. But whatever.
    Julia77 and tyloo like this.
  5. Visit  BlueDevil,DNP profile page
    0
  6. Visit  Bumashes profile page
    1
    Quote from jilljw
    No, I did not. I graduated from an in residency program. We actually took some of our classes with the PA students. He is not someone I would want to work for anyways.

    I am with you. Who proctors their tests? Their husbands or friends? I am okay with some online classes, but all tests should be taken in resident. You can just look up answers online or in a book. It really makes me angry that our credentialing leadership is allowing this to occur. In the end we all have to take the same test, but I feel maybe we should make these national certifying exams harder. In the end I do not feel that patients would be comfortable knowing their provider has an online degree and has never stepped a foot in labs getting their degree (no undergraduate doesn't count). Seems like a good Saturday Night Live episode. Sorry, enough said.
    I can see your point, though I may not agree, because I suppose online education does seem shady due to its very nature, but I must point out that they pass the same cert exam so they must learn something. Anyway, here is an answer to your proctoring question, at least for USA. We have to have this creepy little device called a Secure Proctor installed on our computer. It is a specialized camera that can see 360 degrees in your room. There's all kinds of rules that go with it. No clutter on your desk, no noises in the background, no people or animals in the room with you, etc. It depends on your instructor as to whether you can have notes, open book, or anything else to assist you on your tests. Actual people monitor your test remotely, and your instructor can view the video as well if they choose (either live or they can pull it up at a later date). They can see/hear everything in your room and on your screen. The device also locks down your computer so that you cannot leave the testing screen. So good luck "looking up answers online." They do report EVERYTHING out of the ordinary, even if it seems you are coughing too much (I had bronchitis and they alerted my instructor to my "suspicious coughing." LOL).

    As for the rest of your concerns, I guess I am not far enough into the program to inform you about attending labs and such, other than the required orientation that we attend for a few days at the beginning of the clinical portion of the program. We do suturing, imaging interpretation basics (we do hours with a radiologist later in clinicals to further this), pelvic exams, etc. From what I can see, though, a LOT of the burden for actual procedures is placed on the preceptor's shoulders, so preceptor selection is a very important piece to this puzzle. Here is where the ball can be easily dropped I suppose, if maybe they are able to choose a friend or some other such poor precepting choice. Just trying to look at it both ways here. I would never choose someone I am friends with because I want to learn, and I know that I would spend too much time not learning if my friend precepted me. So knowing your precepting needs, knowing yourself, and choosing wisely are big components here.

    At any rate, I'm sorry that you don't like the online program idea, especially since it seems that's going to be the way anything gets done in the future. Hopefully you will find a peaceful medium. And I'm glad you chose not to work with that doctor because he sounded like a lot to handle. I mean, if he doesn't like online degree NP's that's fine because everyone has their own likes/dislikes, but don't then disqualify all NP's from your practice just because you don't like what a fraction does. Sheesh.
    BrandybunsRN likes this.
  7. Visit  PatMac10,RN profile page
    0
    Quote from Bumashes

    I can see your point, though I may not agree, because I suppose online education does seem shady due to its very nature, but I must point out that they pass the same cert exam so they must learn something. Anyway, here is an answer to your proctoring question, at least for USA. We have to have this creepy little device called a Secure Proctor installed on our computer. It is a specialized camera that can see 360 degrees in your room. There's all kinds of rules that go with it. No clutter on your desk, no noises in the background, no people or animals in the room with you, etc. It depends on your instructor as to whether you can have notes, open book, or anything else to assist you on your tests. Actual people monitor your test remotely, and your instructor can view the video as well if they choose (either live or they can pull it up at a later date). They can see/hear everything in your room and on your screen. The device also locks down your computer so that you cannot leave the testing screen. So good luck "looking up answers online." They do report EVERYTHING out of the ordinary, even if it seems you are coughing too much (I had bronchitis and they alerted my instructor to my "suspicious coughing." LOL).

    As for the rest of your concerns, I guess I am not far enough into the program to inform you about attending labs and such, other than the required orientation that we attend for a few days at the beginning of the clinical portion of the program. We do suturing, imaging interpretation basics (we do hours with a radiologist later in clinicals to further this), pelvic exams, etc. From what I can see, though, a LOT of the burden for actual procedures is placed on the preceptor's shoulders, so preceptor selection is a very important piece to this puzzle. Here is where the ball can be easily dropped I suppose, if maybe they are able to choose a friend or some other such poor precepting choice. Just trying to look at it both ways here. I would never choose someone I am friends with because I want to learn, and I know that I would spend too much time not learning if my friend precepted me. So knowing your precepting needs, knowing yourself, and choosing wisely are big components here.

    At any rate, I'm sorry that you don't like the online program idea, especially since it seems that's going to be the way anything gets done in the future. Hopefully you will find a peaceful medium. And I'm glad you chose not to work with that doctor because he sounded like a lot to handle. I mean, if he doesn't like online degree NP's that's fine because everyone has their own likes/dislikes, but don't then disqualify all NP's from your practice just because you don't like what a fraction does. Sheesh.
    Sounds like you had an awesome online experience! If you don't mind, may I ask what program did you attend? Sounds amazing, except for the creepy camera part! Lolz!
  8. Visit  asue profile page
    0
    Bumashes, I would love to hear more about your experience with USA. I'm starting their WHNP program in the Fall. I have a co-worker who is our CNS in L&D who went through their program and was happy with it. She also said it was a lot of work and studying! Hearing bad things about online programs makes me wonder if I'm making the right decision!
  9. Visit  Bumashes profile page
    4
    PatMac, I am attending USA and am enrolled in their Adult/Geron Primary Care NP track. And yes, the Secureproctor camera is super creepy...we get notes/emails from the instructor if they don't like our "performance" during the exam. Apparently, I talk to myself a bit while test-taking...

    Asue, I have quite a few friends who have either graduated already from this program or who are in the thick of it currently. I have yet to hear any of them say something like, "Whew! That was easy!" Many have been happy with the degree/experience they received from the program, but they usually feel that they did 90% self-teaching. But then, that's pretty much the gist of online programs. Some others do have lecture components online or live online chat sessions. Not so with USA, or at least not in my program. People who aren't very focused fall behind quickly, especially if they lack much self-discipline. Procrastinators CAN make it through, but it's awfully hard on them because of the amount of material presented at one time. Makes it easy to fall behind quickly. They only allow one C to be made for any of your courses. After the first C is made, if you make a C in another course, then you must repeat that course. The best way to go about this program to maximize your chances for success and learning is to take all of the extraneous courses (Pharm, Patho, Assessment, Research, Policy, Theory, etc) prior to beginning the clinical portion. This allows you maximum time to devote to the classes that really matter, which in turn allows you to be more successful in clinicals. The clinical portion only begins once a year, and it is in the fall. So spend a year prior finishing up the other courses rather than taking them at the same time. This will save oodles of heartache. And I don't know about you, but I would much rather be thinking of skills to be performed in clinicals than what to write about in my Theory class paper.

    To all, I am not saying that online learning is perfect, or that this program has no issues to be worked out. But, it is what it is. It isn't easy, that's for sure. However, I have taken online courses in the past for a different degree and thought, "Wow. Was that really all there was to that?" So I understand where the bad feelings are coming from and why people think online courses are easy to pass.
  10. Visit  IrishIzRN profile page
    3
    My mom is a CNM and her schooling was online. I can't even tell you how many years she has been a CNM but it's been quite a while. She has never had an issue getting a job. She has never had an employer who wasn't thrilled with her. She has patients that track her down if she changes employment because they LOVE her. She has a large patient base of...doctors! She is frequently sent patients from doctors so that she can take care of things for them. The fact that she did an online program has never been an issue for her because she's very good at what she does. She runs circles around the other CNMs she's worked with.

    I will be starting a PNP program this September and it is online. I am attending a competitive school that has a very large campus in a major city. This program is only offered online actually. If I wanted to go on campus it wouldn't be an option at this or many schools. I think UofP is the only school in the area that offers this on campus and that would be...impossible for me to do.

    The online program will allow me to obtain an excellent education but still work and take care of my family. I can't go to school at a set time each week. My work would NEVER allow my schedule to be changed because of school. I think online programs are essential in many of us furthering our education. Are there bad schools? Sure, but there are plenty of excellent schools.
    Julia77, PatMac10,RN, and nursegirl2001 like this.
  11. Visit  nursegirl2001 profile page
    0
    IrishIzRN


    First of all congrats on starting your PNP program online in September However, if your job won't allow any flexibility relative to your school schedule, how are you going to go about doing your clinicals next year and work too??? There is no way around that, we have to have the clinical time......?????

    Also I am so glad that the online experience has worked for your mom as it has for many others of us who love truly love what we do !!!!
  12. Visit  IrishIzRN profile page
    1
    Thank you! I have no doubt that I will be well educated even though it's online!!!

    My work won't give me set days off on a regular basis...that is a fact. The clinicals and and such I'm going to try my best to work them around my work schedule. I cut back my hours at work to 2 12s to allow more time for clinicals. I also have on campus time that I have to do and will use PTO time for that or just call out.

    There is the chance that at some point working and this program won't work out and work will go! If the program wasn't online I would have to quit work...no chance it would be doable. So online gives me a hope of working and going to school...knowing that works hours may need to be cut more. I've considered going back to per diem when it gets rough.


    Quote from nursegirl2001
    IrishIzRN


    First of all congrats on starting your PNP program online in September However, if your job won't allow any flexibility relative to your school schedule, how are you going to go about doing your clinicals next year and work too??? There is no way around that, we have to have the clinical time......?????

    Also I am so glad that the online experience has worked for your mom as it has for many others of us who love truly love what we do !!!!
    nursegirl2001 likes this.
  13. Visit  nursegirl2001 profile page
    0
    Good girl !!!!!!!!!! The job will most likely have to go. Right now I am a DON of a homehealth agency and it can be really demanding......however, it soon will be a thing of the past as well. NOTHING is going to mess this up with God's divine help. Let me tell you, some supervisors hate to see other nurses advance and will sabotage progress. This is our career(s). I do not have time to worry about what others feel about what I am doing. It is not up for discussion...this is my dream and mine alone. So we will proceed prayerfully and seriously moving towards our completed degree. It is really disgusting though for jobs to refuse to accomodate a school schedule but oh well. That just means something better is in the making !!!!

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