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No. 30
from ERKev
Old Dec 16, 2003, 11:13 AM

<bow> Thanks, Magik Girl!


Originally posted by MAGIK GIRL


erkev, i wish there was a smily for a standing ovation. but there is not so...... clap clap clap.


life is what you make it.
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No. 31
from athomas91
Old Dec 16, 2003, 03:02 PM

ERKEV - an er nurse w/ some insight..... thank you....
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No. 32
from ERKev
Old Dec 16, 2003, 04:51 PM

Thanks, athomas
Nurses need to pull together....
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No. 33
from harry Krishna
Old Dec 19, 2003, 03:14 PM

[.
.

Dave, who will gladly order medication based on what the PATIENT says their pain is. [/b][/quote]



Perhaps it is this attitude by Private Medical Practioners that create the multitudes of drug addicts who frequent their local E.R's. Once the patient becomes annoying or unable to pay for service they are dumped and then have no PMD to take care of them, so they become "slaves to the system" and their only solice is to go to their local ERs for medical attention and "drug fix"

Also from an altruistic point, our primary job as an RN (in my opinion) is to be a patient advocate. Confronting (in a tactful way of course) a patient on inapropriate narcotic use and ER abuse is
not out of the scope of being an advocate.

HK

Also, may I prempt the Moral Majority who may negativly respond to this: first off, I am not accusing Dave (1st or 3rd person) of being a bad practioner, I'm sure he is very good at what he does), secondly, if I (or others) post something negative about medicating patients or meds seekers, it doesn't mean that we are terrible nurses who should look for other lines of work. Open your minds a bit and see we may be coming from a different angle.
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No. 34
from Erin RN
Old Dec 19, 2003, 03:26 PM

On the flip side of that..I worked ER for a long time and Yes. I have seen the seekers over and over again but if we were TRUE advocates we would help them get help instead we either medicate them or refuse them and send them out them out the door to the hospital down the street...then we complain about them?? Addiction is a disease..In my opinion the problem is us and our misconceptions as well as the fact that we tend to think this is the person's own fault. I would agree at one point they had a choice but as addiction progresses there is no longer a choice at least not in the patient's mind. So if we were TRUE pt advocates we would do more than complain about them (maybe we complain about them becasue WE feel helpless to help them??) ..however I have no idea what a feasable solution would be..anybody have any ideas?? Erin
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No. 35
from ktwlpn
Old Dec 19, 2003, 03:36 PM

Originally posted by Erin RN
On the flip side of that..I worked ER for a long time and Yes. I have seen the seekers over and over again but if we were TRUE advocates we would help them get help instead we either medicate them or refuse them and send them out them out the door to the hospital down the street...then we complain about them?? Addiction is a disease..In my opinion the problem is us and our misconceptions as well as the fact that we tend to think this is the person's own fault. I would agree at one point they had a choice but as addiction progresses there is no longer a choice at least not in the patient's mind. So if we were TRUE pt advocates we would do more than complain about them (maybe we complain about them becasue WE feel helpless to help them??) ..however I have no idea what a feasable solution would be..anybody have any ideas?? Erin
It is difficult to try to change a lifetime of behavior during a visit to the ED on a full moon Saturday night...Or during a 3 dayy vacation on your med-surg unit whit a sky high census and acuity and no help.....We are HUMANS-venting is how we cope and isn't this an appropriate forum for that? We should be kvetching and supporting each other-not tearing each other down by being judgemental...Chronic pain is terrible for the patient and pain management is a wonderful field-we can all learn a lot right here from some of the members of this board....But dealing with druggy frequent flyers is also a challenging part of nursing-we can help each other out with that here also......
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No. 36
from Erin RN
Old Dec 19, 2003, 04:09 PM

I am not denying anyone the right to vent here and I agree this forum is great in that it gives us an avenue in which to "blow off steam" what I am saying is that the drug seeking problem has two components..supply and demand..in order to stop the problem one or the other needs to be addressed..either the ER MDs quit giving narcs or the "druggy frequent flyers" get sober. Believe me I know the frustration, I have been there as an RN with a full assignment of ER pts that were truly sick / dying. The last thing I wanted or needed was someone who merely wanted to get high!! However 2 of my friends that used to be nurses and will never be nurses again are now the "druggy frequent flyers" so I now know that it is a disease. Both of these individuals are about at rock bottom..husband gone, career gone and kids taken away..both of these gals used to be great RNs..I see now that is is a disease just like any other so we obviously need to treat it just like we would treat any other disease. Would we give an overdose pt more drugs?? Would we lay a melanoma pt in the sun or give a diabetic with a sugar of 900 glucose?? Doubt it...so why do we give addicts more drugs??? I guess it is easier? I am not saying don't vent here..I am just wondering whether there is something we can do since we are supposed to be pt advocates... Erin
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No. 37
from ERKev
Old Dec 19, 2003, 04:10 PM

Originally posted by ktwlpn
It is difficult to try to change a lifetime of behavior during a visit to the ED on a full moon Saturday night...

We should be kvetching and supporting each other-not tearing each other down by being judgemental...Chronic pain is terrible for the patient and pain management is a wonderful field-we can all learn a lot right here from some of the members of this board....But dealing with druggy frequent flyers is also a challenging part of nursing-we can help each other out with that here also......
I could not agree more. I always love to read opinions of others here. Only recently have I decided to post and respond. Please, no one assume that I am "against" anyone due to my posts. I feel it's important to understand that all of us have a valid perspective and certain views developed by our experiences - none are more valid or important than others.

...of course, sometimes we ALL need to come down a notch or two...

Just a thought from ERKev............
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No. 38
from athomas91
Old Dec 20, 2003, 03:13 PM

here i go again.....jumping in head first......
i don't agree that drug addiction is a disease - a disease is something that someone gets w/o asking for it - without doing anything purposeful to bring it on....
ex : ca,cad......
that is like saying that smoking is a disease......don't think so - bad habit - yes - deadly - yes - stupid - yes - but not a disease

drug addicts do have a choice - there is help out there - is it easy-nope..... but doesn't make it a disease.
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No. 39
from athomas91
Old Dec 20, 2003, 03:13 PM

oh, by the way harry - most excellent post........that third person stuff freaks me out...
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