Nursing in the UK

Karen30 · Sep 6, 2003

Whisper,

Where are you training? When I did my training we got a taste of each type of nursing in the first 18 months of training. All the students that have come onto the ward where I work also say they get various different placements and some students have found that they enjoy a particular placement so much, that they want to swap branches.

It seems that it depends where you train influences where your placements are and the training you receive. It seems so widely varied from university to university.

Karen30 · Sep 6, 2003

"People expect more and better services, but aren't willing to pay for it. You can't have something for nothing."

I sort of agree, but I am sure the NHS waste thousands of pounds each year on dearer products and services. because they deal with one specific company. Rather than "shopping around" for products, they seem to buy the dearest one.

Good_Queen_Bess · Sep 7, 2003

Yes! I agree! They want to save money where I work, yet on the ward next door (same unit, but different ward), the other sunday (and this happens often), there was a G on the early, an F on a long day and another F on the late. On the HDU, there were TWO F-gardes on the early and 1 on the late. Over the bank hol, TWO G-grades where on on the same shift! I realise that on the HDU, someone senior has to be in charge, but TWO G's? They also expect me (a "humble" D-grade :nurse: ) to take charge on my own on my ward, but keep saying there is no money to promote me. Hmmm.

Whisper · Sep 7, 2003

Sorry, for not replying sooner... I could lie and say I was studying, but I am actually enjoying a few rare days off!

I am a MAD student the new Making a Difference Programme, next week nursing times is doing a special on all the changes this new learning system will have.... the only things is I have been doing it for two years now!

The main change, is a greater emphasis on getting my CAP signed off and having to ahivee set clincial skills, also I am not on a block placement on a ward for say 4-6 weeks. My shortest placement is 10 weeks and the longest 16. However I can NOT go onto internal roation, or match all my shifts to a mentor, as I spen two days a one week at placement, three at university, and three days placement the next, and two at university.

The staff get annoyed because we aren't there consistantly, and often have very little chance to follow a patient through, also many areas still expect us to do blocks of nights, which is impossible if we have to be at uni the next morning at eight.

Which means we are effctively supernumorous, which does have benefits, but I hate doing nothing, and there are only so many times you can watch two other people give someone a bed bath....

Most of the wards have cottoned on though, and are gettng better at alocating mentors, or actually allowing us to learn, the new paper work for mentos to fill inis hilarious, my last mentor awarded my a 7 on all my outcomes, which I had to go and explain to my personal supervisor, and will probabaly go down in my record, becasue the highest mark we can achieve is a level 4 for diplomma students, or a 5 for degree.

I don't really want to say were I am studying, yes I am paranoid, although not many universities have adopted the new system, some are phasing it in. But I live in Yorkshire, so that narrows it down a bit.

Sorry for babling, I shouldn't type when I am tired.

Whisper

Whisper · Sep 7, 2003

By the way in case the winge doesn't show it, I REALLY am enjoying my course, and although the thought of finishing (hopefully) in one year scares the living daylight out of me, It is still something I really want to do

I must have been droppped on my head at some point :rolleyes:

mae72 · Sep 12, 2003

hey nurses, just stop comparing nurses in USA and nurses triained in UK. What is most impt. " a nurse must be theoritically equipped so she has all the confidence in every nursing procedures and must have common sense too. Other nurses as what i have observe don't have that common sense. They just follow all the doctor's order without evaluating the patient's health status. Some nurses carry out the doctor's order even it is not neccessary like the very basic of giving HS meds (sedative).Two of my co-staff did that, they saw the patient asleep but still they ask the pt to get up and take the medicine . What kind of a nurse gush!!! Absolutely without common sense.Sorry to share what I have observed.

bulletproofbarb · Sep 19, 2003

An outsider point of view:

We have both UK and USA trained nurses working in Australia. I prefer working with the UK trained nurses. They are more willing to work, they don't mind getting stuck in and don't tend to advertise their knowledge. They are quiet achievers. They don't have to stand on top of the building and say how great they are.

Most USA nurses act like "doctor wannabies" and don't seem to be around when a patient needs washing because they have been incontinent.

Just how I percieve the whole situation. No malice inteneded.

indie · Sep 20, 2003

One important difference, when looking at health care and nursing in different countries is to understand the philosophy of the service provided.

Britain has a National Health Service - repeat a service to keep peoply healthy. There are actually incentives in the NHS for keeping people healthy and a specialized health qualification known as Health Visitor (post RN qualification). The major function of the HV is to visit people in their homes and to "assess health needs." What a concept!

The NHS was set up to provide "bread for everyone, before cake and circuses for anyone." Translate that into immunizations and preventive care for all before heart transplants for 90 year olds.

Many other countries have a service when people receive care when they are sick. And providers receive pay when people are sick, thus necessitating a huge medical billing and QA, QI, and case management staff.

I have taught in both the USA and UK. I believe the UK still tries to give nurses an education and that the nursing care still allows an RN quite a lot of discretion in 'ordering' certain things him/herself. Because the pay is known to be low, there is still a certain amount of 'vocation' in UK nursing (not necessarily of a religious nature). Many UK RNs know they could earn more in a different field, but have chosen nursing.

The USA does a very good job of training people to follow set pathways; e.g. if the assessment is such and such, then the interventions are . . . Because this can lead a less educated person to believe s/he has learned all the answers, then there is a certain culture in a few USA RNs of 'doctor wannabees.' I don't believe this is very common, but I have met this, especially in USA RNs outside the USA.

I do know of RNs who entered USA nursing because it is a better paying job, for the amount of college involved, with more job openings, than many other minimum college options. And that is why some USA RNs stay in the work.

However, I do believe we should continue to look at our best practice RNs on both sides of the pond and share our good stories and look at areas where practice and regulation could be better shared.

In that vein, I have a pet peeve concerning qualifications:

I have a fifteen year nursing career in the UK (also Health Visitor and Reg. Nurse Tutor) and a fifteen year career here in the USA, also credentialed nursing teacher.

I am unable to practice, in the UK, my major specialty in the USA which is pediatrics because I am not a Reg. Sick Children's Nurse (RSCN) in the UK. Also, I cannot practice, in the USA, my major specialty in the UK (Public Health) because I cannot qualify for PHN (Public Health Nurse) in the USA. Crazy and a waste of resources.

I do hope this post generates some responses!

Geeg · Sep 20, 2003

I have trained in and worked in the USA for 15 years. I am interested in working in the UK, and I see that some of the UK nurses are interested in working in the USA. We are hoping that the grass is greener or at least different on the other side!!!

CCURN · Sep 21, 2003

Seeing it from both perspectives, and deciding to stay in the USA and not to move back to the UK, despite having all my family there. I am not sure if the grass is greener

Betty_SPN_KS, LPN · Dec 16, 2003

This is an interesting thread. I would like to learn more about nursing in both the US and UK. I am a student practical nurse in the states (now halfway through the program). One of the first things I had to begin learning is assessments. I also have worked as nursing assistant (I think they're called care assistants in the UK), and I don't think I'm above cleaning a patient or nursing home resident after an incontinent episode.

I have such a long way to go. There is still so much I don't know. I suppose learning for nurses is a lifelong process. But there is so much I need to learn before I graduate in May and take the NCLEX-PN exam. Then to decide when and how to move on to the RN level (I'm getting a late start. I'll be 40 in 4 days).

I enjoy this BB and enjoy communicating with other nurses and student nurses.

Sinead375 · Dec 31, 2003

I trained as a nurse in Ireland where I worked for 2yrs, I then moved to the UK and worked as a nurse in the National Health Service for 4 yrs

I am now living in California and looking forward to working here. I have to say my experience as a nurse in the UK was an eye opener too. US trained nurses are the best in the world they take nursing to its limits and beyond :) I hope to learn lots from my US colleagues!!

In the UK I worked for a measly £17000 per year...who can afford to live on that paltry sum.... in appalling conditions.... eg 32 bedded ward with 6 bedded high dependency unit equipped with 1 RN and 1 care assistant (who usually are not certified).

Happy in California :)