Should Healthcare Be Funded As A Basic Human Right?

This article looks at funding healthcare as a basic human right. It examines what is a basic human right. It looks at the need for re-examinaton of the health care system in the United States. Is health care a right or a privilege? By looking at the number of uninsured and who they are, we ask if everyone has the same access to health care. We examine traditional methods of funding and use the Medicare model as a framework. Nurses Activism Article

You are reading page 17 of Should Healthcare Be Funded As A Basic Human Right?

Ntheboat2

366 Posts

And here we go again...

Since when is taking on the job of raising a kid that's not yours choosing the path of least resistance? Anyone who has actually raised a child (biological at that) knows it's not an easy one.

You sound like one of those right wing loons who preach "pro life" propaganda and then don't consider anything that happens once the fetus is no longer a fetus. There are very few people who would take on the job of raising a child and even fewer who would do it or could afford to do it with no financial help.

She may have "chose" not to work, but it sounds like she "chose" not to have a child either, but is still criticized for taking "handouts" to care for the child. Apparently, not only should people who have children they can't afford not be able to get assistance, but the people who step up and take care of unwanted children shouldn't either.

That would explain why so many of the pro-life advocates have homes full of children they fight to keep alive! :sarcastic:

Since when is taking on the job of raising a kid that's not yours choosing the path of least resistance? Anyone who has actually raised a child (biological at that) knows it's not an easy one.

Look, it's not like I want to vilify my mother, but when looked at objectively she really didn't raise me so much as let me stick around. I mean I pretty much did what was expected of me, so very little teaching was necessary on her part. I never needed help with homework. I never got any real encouragement other than the cop out statement "You can be anything you want to be, Jaime." Really, she didn't put much effort into me, not to say she wouldn't have, but it was never necessary. And by me saying "She chose the path of least resistance," I was referring to her not actually fulfilling her responsibility to raise the child she took in because she relied on the state to do it. So if anything having me benefitted her as she may not have qualified for the handouts for as long as she did if I wasn't there to begin with.

You sound like one of those right wing loons who preach "pro life" propaganda and then don't consider anything that happens once the fetus is no longer a fetus. There are very few people who would take on the job of raising a child and even fewer who would do it or could afford to do it with no financial help.

I'm not right wing. But I will never be ok with killing a child. Ever. Especially for no reason other than because the child will too much of an inconvenience to its parents. Because THAT (the inconvenience) is what it's really about. And I make no apologies for thinking that way.

She may have "chose" not to work, but it sounds like she "chose" not to have a child either, but is still criticized for taking "handouts" to care for the child. Apparently, not only should people who have children they can't afford not be able to get assistance, but the people who step up and take care of unwanted children shouldn't either.

How many times are you going to overlook the fact that I've said (I don't know how many times at this point) that I am not against helping anyone who is also trying to help themselves? In my mother's case, she was not trying to help herself so "NO," I do not believe she deserved the assistance she was receiving. Unfortunately there are millions of others who are abusing the system just like she did.

That would explain why so many of the pro-life advocates have homes full of children they fight to keep alive! :sarcastic:

So to qualify as being "Pro-life" in your eyes, I have to have a house full of children? It's not enough to raise the ones I chose (Never planned on but still had) to have?

Soooo.....

I addressed every point in your last post and you come back with this crap... I expect better, Ntheboat2. I expect more from you ;)

(Damn, I really wish I knew how to use other emoticons than the smiley and winking smiley. Would've been a nice cherry on top of this response...)

Ntheboat2

366 Posts

Soooo.....

I addressed every point in your last post and you come back with this crap... I expect better, Ntheboat2. I expect more from you ;)

(Damn, I really wish I knew how to use other emoticons than the smiley and winking smiley. Would've been a nice cherry on top of this response...)

Is there some point in particular or question I didn't address? :confused:

trufflelilyRN

39 Posts

Ever citizen should have basic health care. Taxes are paying for it now, when people without health care go to the emergency room for minor illness. The U.S. spends more on health care than any other industrialized country with poorer outcomes. Please check out these webpage:

https://www.facebook.com/doctorsforsinglepayer

PNHP Research: The Case for a National Health Program | Physicians for a National Health Program

Private insurer bureaucracy consumes almost a third (31%) of the nation's health care dollar per PNHP.

Is there some point in particular or question I didn't address? :confused:

I just meant that after I answered your previous post in detail, what you came back with was basically "Well you were on it, why shouldn't everyone else get to be on it too?" It's like you're saying that since once upon a time (through the choice of my parents btw, not my own choice) I received assistance I do not get to have an opinion on the issue, unless of course my opinion is that everyone should get it without restrictions.

Ever citizen should have basic health care. Taxes are paying for it now, when people without health care go to the emergency room for minor illness. The U.S. spends more on health care than any other industrialized country with poorer outcomes. Please check out these webpage:

https://www.facebook.com/doctorsforsinglepayer

PNHP Research: The Case for a National Health Program | Physicians for a National Health Program

Private insurer bureaucracy consumes almost a third (31%) of the nation's health care dollar per PNHP.

This is why the government should force those who visit the emergency room to pay their own bill. Over a payment plan that is stretched out however long it takes. HOWEVER. LONG. IT. TAKES!

If they should become unable to make their payments through ONLY death or disability then and only then the government should pick up the tab, and only because the government mandated that the ER cannot turn people away (Though I am NOT saying that the ER should turn them away. Please do not make that misinterpretation).

VBRNJD99

17 Posts

Just one comment. If we aren't willing to pay for even basic public education for helpless children, how do we expect them to be able to get jobs that pay well enough for them to be self sustaining when they are adults? Does anyone really think that an illiterate adult without even an 5th grade education will be able to get a job with healthcare benefits? They won't even qualify for a job mopping floors at McDonalds.

Really people. It's so easy to tell people to pull themselves up by their boot straps. A lot of people were born without boots!!! Some of the ones who have boots have people standing on them.

Not everyone is born with the intellectual skill or social grace to be a "success" in the US, ie making more than 15,000 a year. Not everyone has the emotional maturity to know about responsible birth control practices because they were never taught it!!

I'm really disgusted by this whole thread. I find some nurses becoming the most entitled, selfish, judgmental group of so called professionals. It really makes me lose my faith in this profession and in humanity. Don't forget for one minute that we are making our living by easy people's suffering!!! Some people may not be tasteful by your upper middle class college educated standards, but they are still human beings worthy of compassion and respect.

But sure, go ahead and let them suffer because they are uneducated, freeloading losers who can't afford healthcare. Judge them because poverty is all many of them have ever known and many have no good role models and see no hope of escape. I'd love to see the view from your bright shiny ivory towers.

trufflelilyRN

39 Posts

How are you going to MAKE someone pay their emergency room bill when they can't afford an office visit (even if someone would see them), they have no education, and they are unemployed or unemployable? We are failing at public education and our young people come out of school--or drop out of school--unable to get a job that will support them. The blue collar jobs that were once the back bone of the country have to a large part been lost as manufacturing was outsourced to other countries.

People who are employed pay taxes, and that is what makes the country strong. When people have to make the choice between food/shelter and health care, they will go without healthcare.

A nation is only as strong as it's weakest segment of the population. In the current scenario, those of us who are lucky enough to have good paying jobs will never be able to provide for the widening segment of the population who is falling into poverty. In the U.S., we are increasingly being polarized into a small segment of rich and and a growing segment of poor.

I have no answers, only concerns. I sincerely believe the HMOs and private insurers should be taken out of the equation. They are draining off almost a third of our health care dollars for administration and profits. Medicare should be expanded to provide basic health care for all. People can then purchase supplemental insurance--just as Medicare recipients do now--if they want more complete coverage.

Specializes in Trauma.

Here's an idea. Free healthcare for all. Need a Dr.? No problem the American taxpayer will cover the cost. Need a Viagra scrip. filled? Let us pay for it. How about birth control? Yep we'll get that too. Get drunk New Years Eve and by mid-Feb you realize you are pregnant and not ready for a kid? You got it. We'll pay to solve that too. The best part is you don't even have to be a citizen of the US to get these benefits.

How will we pay for all of this you may ask. We will raise the taxes everyone that makes over $250,000 a year. Didn't they say that would raise an additional $80B a year? That will raise close to $219M a day. That's a lot of money. But wait, our gov't is currently spending almost 2.8 Billion dollars a day.

If countries with a population equivalent to that of one of our States can do it why can't we with a population of over 300 Million? Also let's not factor in that a smaller percentage of their population is totally dependent their government.

uRNmyway, ASN, RN

1,080 Posts

Specializes in Med-Surg.

Wow, I am reading back on this and the thread has gone so far off-track of what it was meant to be. The original question was whether or not healthcare was a basic human right. And if it is, should it be funded as one.

I am Canadian and I am now working in the US. I have lived in and worked in both systems. Both are flawed. Both include much abuse. The town I grew up in made me nauseous in its abuse. Many received their welfare cheques, and worked under the table to pay for all the extras that my tax paying parents could not afford. The second of every month, go into the grocery/convenience store and what do you see? Carts with little ones sucking on fruit punch boxes, with KD and all the other high sodium low nutrient crap, and a couple cases of beer. Very little fresh produce. Next month, cycle starts again.

Now on the other hand, my mother, as a very hard working single-mother waitress, required surgery on her knee. She was out of work for approximately 6 months to recover, and received welfare to support us. She only used it because she COULD NOT work, and when she was able to, back to work she went. So I am fully aware that not everyone abuses the system, but I am also aware that many do. I think welfare should be like unemployment. There should be a time limit that you can receive it, and if you are unable to work because of physical or mental limitations, then you fall under disability. I think welfare should come with yearly physicals or doctor evaluations to see if you are actually ABLE to work. And if you are, then maybe more can be done to help guide you to a job.

As far as finances go, I have less than no clue how much it would cost to do all this. But I would much rather my taxes go towards all of the above so that those who can't support themselves get the help they need, and those who CAN work, get assistance to find it. But I am not ok with working my butt off to pay for those who won't lift a finger to help themselves. I am missing out on some of the best years of my child's life trying to support us and keep a roof over our heads and food in our bellies. I don't think its fair for some to do that while others don't (for all those who keep talking about 'fair shares').

But again, when it comes to basic human rights, it gets to a point where its hard to draw a line. As others have mentioned, you might say being able to eat is a basic right. Having shelter. Or just look at the rest of Maslow's hierarchy I suppose.

450px-Maslow

Do we draw the line at the physiological needs? Air, food, water, sleep, etc? Should we be provided with a bed, food, toilets? Or what if someone is challenged when it comes to excretion Ie requires IC's or colostomies or whatever. Should that be provided for them at no cost because being able to excrete is a basic human right?

Or draw it at safety. Depending on the neighborhood you live in, maybe we should all get bodyguards, or everyone should have a gun to defend themselves, paid for by the government of course. Resources, like power, gas. Paid for? Family! I think there should be government sponsored matchmaking services to find everyone their soulmate! Its only fair, right?

Love and belonging- Should I be provided with some sex toys, paid for by the government? Should I also be provided with friends?

I'm sure you get where I am going with this. No matter what you give, someone is always going to want more. And when others think their requests are crazy, they will be called uncaring, unempathetic, selfish, etc, for not wanting to provide people with their basic needs.

Slippery slope.

VBRNJD99

17 Posts

There is truly a lack of education in this country regarding universal healthcare. There is not going to be one federal system, just like there isn't one system now. Each state runs their own Medicaid and CHIP programs with many different eligibility requirements, copayments, premiums, etc. some states will have federal programs, some states will have government programs, etc. the difference will be ACCESS.

In Canada, everyone has health insurance, some people pay higher copays than others. Some medications are covered, some are not. The tax rate in Canada is lower than it is in the US, wages are higher, vacation pay, sick pay, maternity leave, etc are better than the US. They have the same fundamental freedoms we do as well. Just one example. There is also the UK, Germany, Sweden, Switzerland, France, Japan, and so on.

My employer sponsored plan does not cover Viagra, or levitra or Celebrex, or Pristiq for my husband, should I go on??

The community hospital where I live is owned by a gagillion dollar corporation 8 states away. The CEO of that company has a net worth of $10 million dollars. Assets, not just annual income, assets, free and clear. 4 hours in the ER the other day, 1 bag of NSS, 1 finger stick, 3 minutes w the doc, 5 minutes w the nurse, $3000. I have insurance, before I left, they asked for my $300 copay without even knowing the usual and customary fee my insurance will approve. They asked 3 times and would not unlock the door for me to leave, even after I explained why. Greed, that's the problem. If I make $1000 a month, no insurance and have $10 a month extra to pay the bill, it would take a long time.

I also know that this particular hospital gets bonuses in tax relief for treating Medicaid and uninsured patients in the community. And they get tax write offs if the patients don't pay the bills. But the money doesn't go to the patients, it goes to the corporation. That's the problem.

We're already paying for people's healthcare, it's just crappy, short term, emergency, care which is overpriced. The US pays more of its GDP on healthcare than any 1st world country and is ranked almost last. That's sad.

knightlycomic

11 Posts

Specializes in Everything.

Yes - basic care for all, and free health care for all children under the age of 10.

Now tell me how this is a bad thing or not cost effective, primary and preventative care is the smart money.

You don't wait for the car to run out of oil then blow up before you do something............ a regular service and timely checks save potential $1000's in costs