New AHPRA registration criteria?? Evidence to cover criterion 8?

  1. Hi all
    I am a UK qualified and registered mental health nurse (Bsc hons) and have applied to AHPRA back in later February, expecting to receive my registration any day. Today I received an email asking to provide more evidence. This is due to the registration criteria being strengthened in early February this year.

    I have been asked for a few extra things, but the main concern is criterion 8 which asked me to provide
    "evidence of satisfactory completion and/or assessment of study of medication management , including drug calculation, pharmacokinetics and pharmacodynamics. Evidence of successful completion of a pharmacology subject as part of your studies is insufficient"

    Has anyone had to provide evidence of this? I was assessed at university on drug calculation, interactions and contraindications, but I don't think that this is sufficient. I have seen the fact sheet AHPRA have provided, but this is still unclear on what evidence they require. Any help on this would be greatly appreciated.
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    About kyledouglas

    Joined: Jun '14; Posts: 1


  3. by   ceridwyn
    Most likely what you have covered is sufficient, just get your university to state what you have covered in a letter. I am under the impression from info coming out of Ahpra having a degree only in memtal health and not generalist as an Australian nurse may be your biggest hurdle.
  4. by   normge
    AHPRA have made a complete mess of their new Regs. Their own staff don't know what they are supposed to be doing; Candidate Case officers are leaving in droves. Aussie hospitals don't know what the new regs mean. It was supposed to be all about the Dip HE not reaching the required qualification level for Australian registration. Now degree qualified UK Nurses are being queried. It's a complete joke to suggest that the UK Dip HE is not comparable to the Australian Nursing Degree because the former covers MORE. I spoke with a GP who moved to Oz from the UK last year, and he said that he has to do MORE stuff in Oz because their nurses don't do a lot of tasks that UK Nurses do. I'm amazed that NMC and UK Universities haven't got involved, because the suggestion is that the UK training ust doesn't cut the grade and thats ridiculous. Maybe UK austhorities think if they keep quiet, it will prevent nurses leaving and going to Oz.

    Some UK nurses have been waiting TEN months for their registration that used to take about 8 weeks. I contacted AHPRA about this and they basically said that a lot of nurses are in this position and there's not a lot they can do about it! No explanation, No apology and No idea!

    One thing to bear in mind is that some nurses who have gone down the Permanent Residency route have had their qualifications assessed by ANMAC (at a cost of about 600), and have been provided with positive assessments, leading to the visa on the strength of their potential to practice in Oz. On arriving downunder, they have been REFUSED registration by AHPRA, thus finding themselves unable to work. In other words, the Australian Government, is responsible for migrants arriving in Australia and going straight onto benefits.

    My advice is not to make ANY plans to move to Oz, until you have the Letter of Eligibility. There are still plenty of sponsored Nursing roles available, once you have registered. This includes MHN's.
    Last edit by normge on Jul 11, '14 : Reason: Typos
  5. by   ceridwyn
    Are you even a nurse Genorm? Lookmine! I see what you are doing......could loose money over this as an " resource consultant" lets, crap on Australian nurses and their education! that will surely get what I want!! dumb is that!!! .shame. shame get the GP who has trouble with his Australian nurse in the country he/she has chosen to immigrated to, to make a public statement of his/her despair with his nursing help!! as nurses here do not serve doctors. Perhaps it was to get him/her lunch etc. Such a great resource to show the difference between Australian Nursing Bachelor degree and the UK Diploma degree.!!!

    Your cannot get benefits for 2 years after immigrating unless you have children and you will get the family assistance.

    Stop degrading Australian nurses and our profession over here it is not our fault that AHPRA have changed their criteria and ANMAC keep handing out the positive assessments. Apparently the ANMAC letter states that their positive assessment does not guarantee AHPRA registration anyway, so why come when no registration is what we could counteract.

    Perhaps it is time to reflect, that it is not a right to be given a working visa and nursing registration in another country, but perhaps a priviledge and that Australia is an independent country from the UK and AHPRA can actually do what they like, just like the BONS of the US and Canada and the Phillipines and India towards UK and Australian nurses and their education.

    I personally have no trouble whatsoever working and living beside UK nurses and enjoy the work and banter, they have great knowledge and apply it well. There are slight differences, that I will not mention here and depends on when and were they lived and were educated and lived experiences, same as in Australia. The end result is Australia has a very high health outcomes for most of the Australian community when in contact with a nurse and thats the bottom line and thats how we keep the pt ratios.

    ps there are not vast amounts of sponsorships around for overseas nurses. One look at any of adverts saying you must have work rights shows that.
    Last edit by ceridwyn on Jul 12, '14
  6. by   normge
    Didn't realise it was all my fault @ceridwyn. BTW were you not removed from another forum because of you hysterical, anti UK rants?

    For those UK Nurses with a genuine concern over this issue, I have been advised that there is to be an article in the "Western Australian" newspaper, together with an interview of a UK nurse who has found himself in Australia, with a Permanent Residency visa, but withought Registration.

    If allowed by Moderators, I will post a link once the article is published.
  7. by   Silverdragon102
    Posting a small part of the article plus link is allowed.

    I understand the rant because I have seen it happen time and time again not just bashing Australia but others bashing another country. ie seen the UK being bashed, Seen Canada being bashed. For some reason everyone thinks their nurse training is better than the country they are applying to.

    At the end of the day each country has their own Nurse training and will be different to the one you did. If you want to live and work as a nurse in another country you have to meet their requirements regardless on how you feel. Some things are done differently, is that wrong... No just means that is the way that that country has taken nursing
  8. by   ceridwyn
    At no time in my post did I blame you for this situation, I only asked that you stop berating Australian nursing and our education.
    I did post on the forum in question, as it was brought to my attention by a UK colleague actually, that UK nurses were posting nasty remarks and degrading Australian nursing and our Nursing registration Board.

    I brought it to their attention that same thing happened to Australian nurses with NMC last year and not one of those Australian nurses did put down/berate the UK nursing diploma, refusal took 8 months, no notice, had jobs offered, but no one there could see the similarities of Australian nurses being caught in the UK and broke to UK nurses without Registration in Australia and broke and wanted to continue to be left alone to continue to discuss their perceived ideas that Australian nursing education left alot to be desired compared to their superior UK diploma and they strongly intimated that... how dare those colonalists assess our degree as lower than ours and how dare they put down the UK diploma, and us from the UK have every right to live and work there as desired!!! I chose to leave the forum.

    Quite frankly, and here is a rant, if NMC do not find the Australian Bachelor of Nursing degree suitable for the UK, then AHPRA have every right to refuse UK education. I hope the article in the Western Australian does report this also and how centrelink benefits are being paid out to those concerned by the thousands, hope this does not end in a backlash though. Really, there is no argument if Australian nursing education is not excepted by NMC. The only department that needs changing is IMMI not to give out visas if an applicant cannot show AHPRA registration.
    I hope that all this gets cleared up soon and UK nurses diploma and experience are given some consideration, for registration as most great nurses, great colleagues and great to have around, but stop giving Australian nursing profession the UK is superior crap, 200 years and it is time it was over. Stop the whingeing.

    Anyone would agree that it is senseless having ANMAC give out positive assessments (gives false hope) they do advise in their letters that it does not guarantee AHPRA registration, yet AHPRA give negative assessments, especially for those who sold up, moving their families and moved over here even without AHPRA registration, what heartache, but how is telling the world how you feel about Australian nursing education and therefore Australian nursing standards and care, is not going to fix the situation, it definately will not win any votes using that tactic over here.
    Last edit by ceridwyn on Jul 12, '14
  9. by   normge
    "but stop giving Australian nursing profession the UK is superior crap, 200 years and it is time it was over. Stop the whingeing."

    You see, you just can't help but continue the pommie bashing.

    As an Australian (Yes, I AM an Aussie too), I find your continued anti UK comments distateful, unprofessional, un-Australian, and embarrassing.

    Nobody is arguing with the criteria, just the way it was introduced and the educational criteria on which it is based.

    There are a lot of UK Dip qualified registered nurses in Australia - what will happen to them? Will they be forced to upgrade their qualification? How many O/S nurses complete the IRON programme (at a cost of $10k), obtain AHPRA registration, but still find it impossible to gain employment as an RN in Australia?

    You should also understand that under new laws, ANY nursing position (indeed, any position at all), cannot be advertised solely to Overseas candidates. Australian nurses have to be given priority over similarly qualified/experienced RGNs from overseas. Nobody has a problem with that. The sad fact is that very few Aussie nurses want to go to non-capital city locations, and therefore, those positions need to be filled from other resources.

    With regards to sponsorship, the reason there re so few (if any) employer sponsored jobs within the state health sector is because the states (rightly so in my opinion), are offering RSMS to nurses (and others), and therefore, there is no need for individual Health services to sponsor. The majority of employer sponsored positions are in the Private sector, but they still MUST try and fill those vacancies from local (Australian) nurses first.

    My personal opinion is that registration should be about that; ie being Registered - not if you can prove you did something which is just part of your daily routine (ie cannulation).

    Finally, nobody is being derogatory about Australian Nurses. Only last week I was speaking to a DON in the UK who had that day, employed an Australian degree qualified, Registered Nurse, and her comment was "I wish we could find half a dozen like him".
  10. by   ceridwyn
    Seems a bit of a contradiction about Australian degree educated nurses in all previous posts, the DON in the UK can have quite a few Australian degree nurses working in her ward if she likes, the nurses will just need to have their refusal from recent sudden changes of overseas nurses by the NMC that gave them refusals, changed to Registration as nurses.
    Last edit by ceridwyn on Jul 14, '14
  11. by   normge
    Well, obviously you know best. I'd better ring her up and tell her to send her Aussie RN home because NMC have wrongly allowed her registration ( according to another Aussie).
  12. by   normge
    What do YOU have to say about the situation regarding the IRON programme?

    BTW, I just spoke to a member of MARA who states that they have NOT been informed of any changes therefore, they cannot refuse to process visa applications!

    This is what I'm also hearing from Australian Hospitals - nobody has told them of the changes!

    Never mind, I'm onto Deputy Head of Immigration
  13. by   ceridwyn
    All except one or two that do mid as well, are all for general nurses, bridging programs that have their curriculums approved by ANMAC are for general educated nurse applicants and must do clinical placements in acute wards for at least 4-6 weeks.

    Warned twice AHPRA registration is not guaranteed. first by ANMAC next by AHPRA in October. as changes were occurring.

    IMMI needs to have the new criteria with all professions if you need to be licensed to practising certificate, no visa, even if their assessment body states they are okay. How many other people know this loophole and living here, even though being warned licensing certificate is not guaranteed.

    ANMAC needs to make assessments against their accredited curriculum for Australian universities. Instead of fuzzy assessments. AHPRA and ANMAC need to be working on same page.

    It is scare mongering amongst nurses that are UK educated here to tell them they will no longer be registered with AHPRA, of course they will for as long as they wish to practice and pay the astromical AHPRA fee. Same as Diploma Australian educated nurses.

    You have been busy, Good luck, networking with more important people the better!!
    Last edit by ceridwyn on Jul 15, '14
  14. by   normge
    One thing that could be challenged is the requirement for Australian Nurses to pas IELTS to become registered in the UK. What is the basis for that condition? If it because English is only the "defacto" and not the "official" language of Australia, then this should be challenged on the basis that English is not constitutionally the official language of the UK either.

    On the subject of UK Diploma's, refusal of registration, AHPRA, ANMAC, Visas, etc, I am continuing to "enlighten" the Australian Federal Goverment, both at Ministerial and Advisory levels. From the response of the latter, I can only assume that NOBODY appears to be aware of the problem's that this issue is causing.

    They are NOW!!