Wanting to be an Emergency Nurse Someday-Going Green Soon

[SummerGarden]

hi, i am in the process of joining the army nurse corps reserve. i have a question regarding career flexibility.

here is my situation:

due to the economy my passion to work in emergency nursing any time soon is being thwarted at every turn. i applied out of school and was rejected because my hospital was not hiring new grads. i applied recently (6 months later) with good references and an outstanding interview and i was rejected because i was being compared to more experienced nurses (the er has hired the set number of new grads for now and does not wish to hire any more, which is why without my knowledge i went up against the experienced nurses). i figure given this economy and the lack of opportunities locally, i will not be able to transfer into any ed for possibly 5 years or more. there is no way this economy will change in two years and even if it does, there is no way nurses who wish to retire will feel secure enough to retire at that time. therefore, i cannot imagine not going up against more experienced nurses every time i apply for a transfer over the next decade!! so, i am moving on.... i plan to take the option and join the army reserves (i have been thinking about this for three years... my last rejection sealed the deal)!

here is what i know (so i do not need to be told a million times):

active duty army will take new grads into a specialty area, however, as an adn prepared rn i will not be able to go on active duty until i complete my bsn. in addition, i will also not be able to have my reserve contract place me directly into emergency nursing at this time because the reserves requires 2 years of work experience if choosing a specialty area.

here are my questions...:

1.) after 2 years of medical surgical nursing with some exposure to the ed skills, will i be able to transfer into ed within the army reserves? what does it take to be able to transfer into a specialty after working medical surgical nursing inside or outside of the army? do you know of anyone who has transferred out of medical surgical nursing within the army reserves without 2 years of civilian work experience within a specialty area?

2.) if i join the reserves and get my bsn a year later (i am set to graduate next spring), is it possible to transfer into active duty army to serve out the rest of my contract and have a transfer into the ed placed into my active duty contract without 2 years of ed experience (especially since i will no longer be considered a new grad)? again, has anyone done this???

btw, i plan to join even if i am working medical surgical nursing in the army for some time because the army is not the same as the civilian world. i will have enough leadership responsibilities to make me happy with my career choice while waiting to transfer into emergency nursing. plus, my family is supportive and i also have some prior experience. thus, although i know that the military is not perfect, there are things i like about it in many ways and i cannot wait to return.

please feel free to answer my questions and share your experiences. thanks.

[SummerGarden, BSN, MSN, RN]

how much rn experence do you have?

i have less then a year. however, by the time i go onto ad i will have 2 years. everything i am doing right now is in plans to move into ad. the only reason i am signing up for the reserves is because i want to be in the military again. i do not want to wait until i am finished with my bsn.

[SummerGarden, BSN, MSN, RN]

i can tell you what usarc hsd just told me about asi's (i am trying to keep my army reserve 8a indicator, now that i am active......they are saying it is not valid)

regardingy clinical experienc for an asi:

per usarc hsd, "our guidance states that you must have 750 hours over the past year and 1500 hours over the last two years in the adult icu in order to obtain

the identifier.".........this is for an 8a, but i would bet it is similar for a m5.

good luck,

c.

this makes sense... i was told that nurses with at least 2 years experience in a particular specialty as civilians are the ones who start in that specialty right away. on the other hand, i was told that new grads with at least 1 year medical surgical nursing experience can have it put into his/her contract to move into a specialty as well so long as he/she has gotten particular skills signed off and it is approved by command. i am working on those skills now. plus, i work full-time as a m/s nurse and will have 2 years and god knows how many hours under my belt and may have my cen by that time too by the time i go on ad (i found out i do not have to work in the ed to take and pass the exam... i just have to study my bottom off). of course if i go this route then i probably will not get any more money (i will take money for the reserves). this is fine since i am paying cash for my bsn and paid cash for my adn and am not interested in a msn any time soon. i just need to pay off my former student loans or what i can while in the reserves. i also need to be an m5 working towards trauma nursing because that is my career goal.

[SummerGarden, BSN, MSN, RN]

if you have experience as an rn you can ask for a course to get a skill identifier in area you are interested in, even if you have not worked in that area before. i am leaving for ad shortly and going to school shortly after reporting to my duty station to obtain an si in an area i have been wanting to work in for years but unable to get into at the civilian hospitals i have worked at. make sure you get it in writing.

will need the hours worked in the ed along with the skill check sheet to obtain your m5.

if this is true, how did you get the identifier for icu if you could not land an icu as a civilian... or could you? there is no way i will get ed hours as a civilian. i am not related to anyone in the ed, i don't have any friends high enough up the food chain to get me into this ed, and i am not liked by one of the administrators who seems to have pull in the ed. if i cannot get m5 in my contract then i will not be able to be an er trauma nurse ever... (the higher up the rank the farther away from bedside)... i am seeing my recruiter this week so i am going to sit down with him and pattern out my best option by playing with different contract scenarios.

good luck, going reserves first is a good way to go, you start getting your time in rate, time in service. just remember thou there is the possiblity that you could be deployed while you are going to school.

with the exception of my last semester in nursing school, i can continue to take courses online while being deployed. in fact a deployment will be welcomed! i am seriously tired of working in this hospital and i hate living in this town. unfortuntaley, there are no other options within a 300 mile radius and i am a new grad. so, if i deploy i will be fine with me because i will be on ad serving my country gaining the experience i want to gain even if it is medical surgical nursing rather then wasting my time in this hospital.

for example, i just got back from a class tonight where i was being prepared to take the acls course. anyway, i was the only new grad in the course because apparently the directors on the other floors prevented their new grads from taking this class. keep in mind that the ed and icu new grads are not prevented form taking this course. the only reason i was not prevented is because i am floating and no one seems to pay enough attention to me to have stopped me.

by the way, there is no reason rns who work the floors should not be prepared to take courses to help during codes. it makes no sense given the fact that we have codes!!! also, the course was not full so it is not a matter of the new grads on the floors taking up too many spots. there were 25 spots and only 4 people showed up!! thus, it is clear to me, that this hospital is not for every nurse. not every nurse will have career mobility or flexibility.

the directors on the m/s floors prevent nurses from moving into specialties and they do everything to limit our skill set... starting with limiting specialized training... it is disgusting to me. it reminds me of the books i read about slavery, where the slave masters prevented slaves from reading because knowledge would give them power! similarly, gaining acls and pals threatens the directors on the floors (i do not know why)…. in fact one director was very rude to me during the class because she knew i was a new grad and stated that i needed to focus my attention on other things... umm.. like what? the disease processes on the floor i float to regularly are not difficult to master... cardiac complications, on the other hand, is something i need to actually study. in any case after my experience tonight i definitely do not plan to tell anyone i am trying to join the army or study for my cen not even my mentor. this is too bad since she is former military, passed her exam recently, and i really wanted to borrow her books.

[jeckrn, BSN, RN]

if this is true, how did you get the identifier for icu if you could not land an icu as a civilian... or could you? there is no way i will get ed hours as a civilian. i am not related to anyone in the ed, i don't have any friends high enough up the food chain to get me into this ed, and i am not liked by one of the administrators who seems to have pull in the ed. if i cannot get m5 in my contract then i will not be able to be an er trauma nurse ever... (the higher up the rank the farther away from bedside)... i am seeing my recruiter this week so i am going to sit down with him and pattern out my best option by playing with different contract scenarios.

right now i have the m5 si in the reserves & will be changing to another once i go on active. the change was my choice, had to decline my m5 for active to do it thou. you would need to get it in your contract to go to the m5 course once you are on active, so do not give up your dream.

with the exception of my last semester in nursing school, i can continue to take courses online while being deployed. in fact a deployment will be welcomed! i am seriously tired of working in this hospital and i hate living in this town. unfortuntaley, there are no other options within a 300 mile radius and i am a new grad. so, if i deploy i will be fine with me because i will be on ad serving my country gaining the experience i want to gain even if it is medical surgical nursing rather then wasting my time in this hospital.

is there any reason that you can not move and get into an er since your taking your courses online? most be frustrating working some where you do not like and very little options.

for example, i just got back from a class tonight where i was being prepared to take the acls course. anyway, i was the only new grad in the course because apparently the directors on the other floors prevented their new grads from taking this class. keep in mind that the ed and icu new grads are not prevented form taking this course. the only reason i was not prevented is because i am floating and no one seems to pay enough attention to me to have stopped me.

that shows that someone in the hospital does have confidence in you. acls is needed in most places to work in er/icu.

by the way, there is no reason rns who work the floors should not be prepared to take courses to help during codes. it makes no sense given the fact that we have codes!!! also, the course was not full so it is not a matter of the new grads on the floors taking up too many spots. there were 25 spots and only 4 people showed up!! thus, it is clear to me, that this hospital is not for every nurse. not every nurse will have career mobility or flexibility.

either the unit managers do not want to send nurses or are unable to due to staffing/budget. or if other nurses feel the same way about the hospital as you & do not have any options have just given up. could not agree with you more that the rn's on the floor should take acls to help out on the floor with codes. they are the first ones there.

the directors on the m/s floors prevent nurses from moving into specialties and they do everything to limit our skill set... starting with limiting specialized training... it is disgusting to me. it reminds me of the books i read about slavery, where the slave masters prevented slaves from reading because knowledge would give them power! similarly, gaining acls and pals threatens the directors on the floors (i do not know why).... in fact one director was very rude to me during the class because she knew i was a new grad and stated that i needed to focus my attention on other things... umm.. like what? the disease processes on the floor i float to regularly are not difficult to master... cardiac complications, on the other hand, is something i need to actually study. in any case after my experience tonight i definitely do not plan to tell anyone i am trying to join the army or study for my cen not even my mentor. this is too bad since she is former military, passed her exam recently, and i really wanted to borrow her books.

if this is truely the case you need to leave the facility before you become entraped in the system. as far as limited specialized training the directors only have so much money in the budget and have to use it wisely. i do not know if that is the case where you work, but that is what i have seen at hospitals i have worked in the past. you need to ask why your director does not want you to increase your skills, find out their motives. maybe they would love to send you but do not have the money. training cost money, ie wages for you, overtime to cover your shift, cost of the training itself.

good luck in you last semester. have you started to work with a health care recruiter yet? when will you graduate? if you will graduate within the next year start working on your active duty packet and do not worry about the reserves. it can take 6-8 months to get your commission. if you are in the reserves you will need to reapply for active duty and go thru the whole process again.

[SummerGarden, BSN, MSN, RN]

if this is truely the case you need to leave the facility before you become entraped in the system. as far as limited specialized training the directors only have so much money in the budget and have to use it wisely. i do not know if that is the case where you work, but that is what i have seen at hospitals i have worked in the past. you need to ask why your director does not want you to increase your skills, find out their motives. maybe they would love to send you but do not have the money. training cost money, ie wages for you, overtime to cover your shift, cost of the training itself.

i agree that training costs money and if money is the issue i understand the motive. however, that is not the reason i was given. i was told that new grads have "enough to worry about without worrying about becoming acls certified". oddly, new grads in the icu and ed must have the brain power to worry about more despite having little to no experience like the rest of us.

also i know of nurses who have worked on some of these floors for years... they started thinking they would put in 1-2 years m/s and they are going on 4 and 5 years now. on two floors in particular transferring to a specialty does not happen for most and this was the case even when the economy was good and the jobs in this hospital were plentiful.

good luck in you last semester. have you started to work with a health care recruiter yet? when will you graduate?

sorry about the confusion. i am a rn. i am taking courses online to complete my bsn part-time because i am the primary wage earner for my household. if that was not the case i would knock a bsn out in two semesters. due to my situation i graduate with my bsn in fall 2010.

if you will graduate within the next year start working on your active duty packet and do not worry about the reserves. it can take 6-8 months to get your commission. if you are in the reserves you will need to reapply for active duty and go thru the whole process again.

i am working with a recruiter, i started this process 6 months ago. i was told by athena (i think that is her user name) the same in another post. however, i really want to get started. i am not finished with my entire application but the background check portion has already begun and so has meps. i understand that the process is long and it may seem like a waste of time, so i was thinking that once i receive my commission in the reserves i will start working on my ad packet and submit it (if possible) next summer. that packet will include my m5 check off list. if this is not possible and i have to wait for my diploma then in the meantime i am still in the army.

besides, i want to be the best candidate to be able to move onto ad and get m5 in my contract. would it not be better to be a current commissioned officer/solider with 2 years work experience m/s then a civilian with 2 years m/s to land a contract with m5 for ad? please tell me what you think.

by the way, how did you get icu in the reserves if you never worked the icu? how are you going to move onto ad with icu if you are not working icu as a civilian? thanks.

[jeckrn, BSN, RN]

i agree that training costs money and if money is the issue i understand the motive. however, that is not the reason i was given. i was told that new grads have "enough to worry about without worrying about becoming acls certified". oddly, new grads in the icu and ed must have the brain power to worry about more despite having little to no experience like the rest of us.

also i know of nurses who have worked on some of these floors for years... they started thinking they would put in 1-2 years m/s and they are going on 4 and 5 years now. on two floors in particular transferring to a specialty does not happen for most and this was the case even when the economy was good and the jobs in this hospital were plentiful.

sorry about the confusion. i am a rn. i am taking courses online to complete my bsn part-time because i am the primary wage earner for my household. if that was not the case i would knock a bsn out in two semesters. due to my situation i graduate with my bsn in fall 2010.

i am working with a recruiter, i started this process 6 months ago. i was told by athena (i think that is her user name) the same in another post. however, i really want to get started. i am not finished with my entire application but the background check portion has already begun and so has meps. i understand that the process is long and it may seem like a waste of time, so i was thinking that once i receive my commission in the reserves i will start working on my ad packet and submit it (if possible) next summer. that packet will include my m5 check off list. if this is not possible and i have to wait for my diploma then in the meantime i am still in the army.

besides, i want to be the best candidate to be able to move onto ad and get m5 in my contract. would it not be better to be a current commissioned officer/solider with 2 years work experience m/s then a civilian with 2 years m/s to land a contract with m5 for ad? please tell me what you think.

by the way, how did you get icu in the reserves if you never worked the icu? how are you going to move onto ad with icu if you are not working icu as a civilian? thanks.

since you are already working the process i would continue and get your reserve commission. then about 6-8 months out from your graduation date put in your ad packet. since most of it will not change it shouldn't be to bad. also by getting in now you will have more time in rate, which means getting promoted quicker. if you waited constructive credit counts about 1/2 of your rn experience. this way you would get the constructive credit for what you have already as an rn, lets say you have 1 year, that you give you 6 months as a 2lt leaving 12 months before you are eligible for 1lt. if you wait until next year with the above time as an rn you would have around 12 months as an 2lt. this would get you promoted around 6 months earlier. getting promoted to 1lt is a paperwork drill, as long as you are qualified you will be promoted to 1lt once you have the time in grade.

from what you say, you need to get away from where you work, understand about being the primary wage earner. that is what i was while going to lpn, rn, & rn-bsn so i feel your pain. good luck again, hope to see you somewhere in green.