Nurses Helping Nurses
allnurses Network: Central | Jobs | Books | Newsletter
allnurses: A Nursing Community for Nurses
Home General News Blogs Articles Students Region Specialty Degrees F.A.Q.
Certified Registered Nurse Anesthetist (CRNA) /

Why don't CRNA's like AA's



Did You Know?
allnurses is the largest community for nurses on the web. We now have over 388,759 members! Join today to network with other nurses, laugh, share, and much more.
Page 1 of 6 1 23456 >

May 18, 2004 06:21 PM

Why don't CRNA's like AA's

by ep71
Updated May 18, 2004 at 11:29 PM by ep71

I've noticed a sense of hostility on this forum towards AA's by Nurse Anesthetist or student nurses of Anesthesia. Why so hasty? I always read on this forum about the shortage of Anesthesia providers, yet some people want to block AA's from being able to do just that. I don't understand. If AA's have proven to be successful at administering safe anesthesia, why is it such an issue that they be allowed the same privileges as a CRNA (other than supervision). I recently read an article in another thread on this forum that seemed to be rallying for support so that they can ban the use of AA's in Louisiana. I don't understand the hell-bent attitude. If there's a shortage, and there's a solution, what's the problem? If CRNA's are so concerned with the health of their patients, why won't they allow the shortage problem to be solved. It definitely doesn't seem to be helping the patient by having a shortage of anesthesia providers.


Share

Search Tags
None
Top

 
Advertisement
Sponsored Links
 
Page 1 of 6 1 23456 >
Reply
52 Comments
No. 1
from Busy20yo
Old May 18, 2004, 06:36 PM

I think some people are afraid to lose their jobs to AA's.


BTW. What is the average salary of an AA?
Top
 
No. 2
from mato_tom
Old May 18, 2004, 06:38 PM

all about the benjamins and there is nothing wrong with various healthcare providers protecting or expanding their turf thru legal channels....its the nature of the bizness and its all about money and if you hear the association heads and lawyers that throw crap out like pt safety and access and this and that just remember to read b/w the lines and look for the dollar signs.....
Top
 
No. 3
from nilepoc
Old May 18, 2004, 08:22 PM

Let me equate this to something you should be able to relate to if you are an RN.

there is currently a shortage of RN's. To fix this shortage, I am going to allow anyone who is interested to become an RN. I am going to require them to have no experience and i am going to only give them positions in the ICU upon completion of their program. At the same time, i am going to cut the pay of current ICU RNs and additionally I am going to place restrictions on the practice of ICU RNs, so that I do not have to administrate more than one kind of provider.

This is what is happening to CRNAs in some markets. AAs move in, the MDAs don't want to supervise two types of providers, so they limit the practice of CRNAs to equal the practice of AAs in that facility. Later taht year, administration asks the question why are we paying CRNAs more if they are doing the same limitted job of the AA? CRNA salaries fall, and CRNA practice deteriorates. Over time, this has the potential to become the norm in big hospital practice. It would not take many AAs in a hospital to bring about a change like this.

IMHO this is one of the reasons CRNAs are less than friendly in supporting the practice of AAs.
Top
 
No. 4
from K38s
Old May 18, 2004, 10:34 PM

ep71,
Keep in mind that CRNA's have fought long and hard to maintain their level of practice. They have been attacked on just about every conceivable angle to have their practice restricted. So when AA's enter the picture under the guise of "anesthesia shortage relief" it is no wonder that this is met with some sceptisism by the CRNA community.

Ask yourself this question. How do AA's help the anesthesia shortage in rural America (where the shortage really exsists) if no MDA is going to go there to supervise them?

If they don't help the shortage what purpose do they serve?
Top
 
No. 5
from mato_tom
Old May 18, 2004, 11:15 PM

Originally Posted by K38s
ep71,
Keep in mind that CRNA's have fought long and hard to maintain their level of practice. They have been attacked on just about every conceivable angle to have their practice restricted. So when AA's enter the picture under the guise of "anesthesia shortage relief" it is no wonder that this is met with some sceptisism by the CRNA community.

Ask yourself this question. How do AA's help the anesthesia shortage in rural America (where the shortage really exsists) if no MDA is going to go there to supervise them?

If they don't help the shortage what purpose do they serve?
AAs will take a MDA supervised job in the big city to replace a CRNA.... then the CRNA can go the the rural area to work unsupervised.

the key question is...what % of jobs are MDA supervised....we all know CRNA do not require supervision, but how many work under supervision. let me rephrase that..........what % of crna jobs could be replaced by AAs.
Top
 
No. 6
from Trauma Tom
Old May 18, 2004, 11:31 PM

Default AA's vs CRNA's
Nilepoc

Excellent post. I have never really looked at it the way you presented the argument in your post. It makes me want to re-examine my own feelings toward the practice of AA's. If their primary motives are indeed to decrease the shortage of anesthesia providers I am less inclined to be against their practice. However, if they are part of a organized plan by anesthesiologists to limit the practice of CRNA's then I too, as a soon to be SRNA will be less than supportive of the practice of AA's. I do not want to see anything that is going to erode the practice of CRNA's. This profession has provided a vital service to patient's everywhere and to limit the scope of practice of CRNA's would be a tremendous step backwards in thr delivery of safe and competent care to patients in need of anesthesia care.
Top
 
No. 7
from gaspassah
Old May 18, 2004, 11:39 PM

they are part of a organized plan by anesthesiologists to limit the practice of CRNA's
this is the deal. no 2 ways about it. control of the money. bill the same dollar to patient, pay less money to aa who does the case = more money in mda pocket. mda has no fear of aa they MUST be supervised by law. less work for mda, more money for mda. hmm......plus cut competition of alternate provider (crna) = whole or most of the market.
Top
 
No. 8
from user69
Old May 19, 2004, 08:27 AM

Originally Posted by K38s
ep71,
Keep in mind that CRNA's have fought long and hard to maintain their level of practice. They have been attacked on just about every conceivable angle to have their practice restricted.
I thought that the push was for expanded practice, not to stay at the status quo. That is why so much lobby power has been thrown behind the opt out options for states.
Top
 
No. 9
from Sheri257
Old May 19, 2004, 08:44 AM
Updated May 19, 2004 at 08:48 AM by Sheri257

Originally Posted by nilepoc
Let me equate this to something you should be able to relate to if you are an RN.

there is currently a shortage of RN's. To fix this shortage, I am going to allow anyone who is interested to become an RN. I am going to require them to have no experience and i am going to only give them positions in the ICU upon completion of their program. At the same time, i am going to cut the pay of current ICU RNs and additionally I am going to place restrictions on the practice of ICU RNs, so that I do not have to administrate more than one kind of provider.

This is what is happening to CRNAs in some markets. AAs move in, the MDAs don't want to supervise two types of providers, so they limit the practice of CRNAs to equal the practice of AAs in that facility. Later taht year, administration asks the question why are we paying CRNAs more if they are doing the same limitted job of the AA? CRNA salaries fall, and CRNA practice deteriorates. Over time, this has the potential to become the norm in big hospital practice. It would not take many AAs in a hospital to bring about a change like this.

IMHO this is one of the reasons CRNAs are less than friendly in supporting the practice of AAs.
What if the states required more AA training and experience, more along the lines of what CRNA programs require? Would the same thing happen in that scenario?

Top
 
Page 1 of 6 1 23456 >
Reply




Thread Tools


Who's Online
271 members
2,076 guests
2,347

3

Four Lehigh Valley Health Network nurses accused of...

48

lawsuit - But don't most RN's work through breaks/lunch...

0

Patient Evaluation of Retail Clinic Care

7

The hard to reach on-call doctor, and its effects on...

11

Woman charged with passing off prescription drug as...

26

Man in "Vegetative State" was conscious for 23...

2

Interesting article on ThedaCare's Collaborative Care Model

14

Possible breakthrough regarding MS

63

16th Philly area hospital to stop delivering babies: Mercy...

14

Really interesting article on Indian open hearts



45

Dear preceptor

1

Society Needs Care Too

13

Why am I doing this, anyway?

2

Nurse Heal Thyself

10

My Papa, why I am the nurse I am today.

17

I made it through

11

An angel's gaze

16

A Sister Never Forgets

16

Ruby's Marbles

42

What Do Operating Room Nurses Do?

14

My Little Old Jedi

21

I love this job......

23

"I hear voices"

20

Preventing FRUTI (Foley Related Urinary Tract Infection) in...

24

Error and Attitude





Sponsored Links

Currently Reading This Page: 1 (0 members & 1 guests)

Interested in the hottest topics of the week? Subscribe to the Nurse-zine Newsletter.
Enter email address: