Nurses and bullies...

AllenTheNurse · Oct 25, 2017

I feel very strongly about this issue. A bad situation at the local hospital made me almost run from the profession as a whole. The manager was young and cronyism ran rampant. And yes -bullying- was prevalent as well. The manager was caught lying about other employees to other employees, and when found out, would turn tail and threaten termination. Her merry band and herself would make claims that other employees stole, would randomly change clock in times, offer extra pay then rescind it after the shift was worked, it was horrible. I mostly flew under the radar until I took extra shifts with the incentive of extra pay and came in to see a big pink "NO" written in highlighter in the time book. After I even asked her about it, I started being on the receiving end. I wasn't about to go crying to the office or make a scene like the other employees, I just resigned. Unfortunately, the hospital has a reputation in the area as being poorly managed and like a soap opera. Oh well.

audreysmagic, RN · Oct 26, 2017

As for those problem children on units...I have managed out 'high-performers' whose toxic attitude did more damage than anything. I don't care how good of a clinical nurse you are if you cause disaster in my unit. Goodbye and good riddance! I can train those who have a great fit and good attitude to be clinically excellent, I don't need you hurting morale and driving away good employees because of your negativity.

I know a nurse manager who's been doing this and it's amazing. Are you consistently the problem on your unit? We'll move you to another unit to see if it's a better fit. Has this been continuing to be a problem there? Now we know it's you. You request a transfer to another department? APPROVED. If they never do anything that they can be directly disciplined for, it's the best solution.

audreysmagic, RN · Oct 26, 2017

When we define bullying as "she didn't say hi back to me," we are diluting the impact of the word down to meaningless chatter. JMO.

So, so true. So much of "NETY" cries come down to this. We have a nurse in my department who's one of the above. She's very rude to anyone not management (thinking management, who's actually closely involved with the floors in this place, doesn't notice) and doesn't like to listen to anyone, then complains no one helps her...and says she's bullied. (As Ruby Vee so well put it, if everyone around you is a donkey, then you might also be a donkey.) A co-worker was my hero the other day, when she said, "People here aren't very nice" with a pout...and he told her that, yeah, she's not that nice either.

AutumnApple · Oct 27, 2017

So, this might seem controversial, but it's something I noticed while working at a hospital for almost 3 years.
I was lucky enough to work with Physical and Occupational Therapists (so we did therapy in every department of the hospital -- sans NICU).
In saying that, I think part of the reason an NP is more appealing to me than a BSN / RN program is because I saw A LOT of bullying in the nursing field on the BSN / RN or CNA level. As an NP, I'm sure it could happen, but I feel like it would happen less at that level.
I mean some of them were just downright B-words. And, I don't chalk it up to a bad day (because this behavior was tied to them on a frequent basis when I saw them).
And while it was pretty prevalent in all levels, it seemed that the ones in charge were the worst.
It's almost like Dante's levels of H*ll in terms of moving up the ranks of mean (not including NP, CRNA, Midwife or other higher level nursing positions).
Crappy attitude, didn't want to be bothered by patients (or other healthcare workers), nasty disposition, thought highly of themselves and looked down on others etc.
I have friends and family who are nurses in hospitals, nursing homes, home health, school systems and it doesn't seem like it stops there (in terms of environment and bullying).
I've worked in a few fields and while bullying can happen anywhere, it seems like nursing has a high ratio of this type of catty, mean behavior.
It's one of the reasons I'm not sure I could handle this field.
It's not because I can't handle myself around bullies, but I know that I'd put one of these bullies in their place and probably get fired over it (because they either tend to be in charge or "in" with the people who are in charge or just lie or are manipulative).
My tolerance for that sort of behavior is really low and I'd definitely knock them off of their bully peg which wouldn't bode well for anyone involved.
So, what has your experience been with bullying in the nursing field? And, how did you handle it?
Is it as prevalent as it seems?
And, do you feel like it contributes to the issues with burn out in the nursing field?
What advice would you give to a new grad who encountered this type of behavior?

"So, what has your experience been with bullying in the nursing field? And, how did you handle it?"

My experience has been that I used to be the bully. Most of how you described the bullies didn't apply to me, especially the not wanting to be bothered by patients part. But thinking highly of myself and looking down on others. Yeah, although I don't think it's possible time line wise.......almost sounds like we worked together.

Long story but, I'm no longer like that. But yes, if you met me during my first three years of nursing, you'd likely have avoided me.

"Is it as prevalent as it seems?"

Tricky question since I never thought it was "prevalent" to begin with.

Bullies do exist. I've written at length about how I deal with them. I had to play moderator with a few too many of them when I was a manager.

Perception comes into play though when considering how "prevalent" they are. Truth is, if you have to deal with one bully, you're going to feel as though they are too common. We tend to remember the times we're facing one more than we recognize the times when we're not.

Also, it seems to me that these days an awful lot of people have bullying mixed up with: Not being as popular as they'd like, not being well liked and all sorts of other things. A coworker not liking you is not bullying.

"And, do you feel like it contributes to the issues with burn out in the nursing field?"

In more ways than most actually.

Having to deal with a bully is a problem we can't expect "the system" to solve for us. It just won't resolve that way. Self preservation is a personal responsibility and no one will do it for us.

When faced with a bully, many of us have to not only consider how to deal with it professionally, but we must also face things that are more personal. To properly handle the situation, we often have to evaluate who we are, not just how we act at work. Some simply aren't in a place to be so introspective. So they burn out.

Another side of the story that many don't consider is: The bullies burn out too.

See, bullies act the way they do for a reason. These "reasons" often are what drive said bully into burn out. The crash and burn they go through is often fast, harsh and very difficult to redirect.

In summary, being a bully burns us out as much as being bullied does.

"What advice would you give to a new grad who encountered this type of behavior?"

Don't let all of your self worth be tied up in your profession. It's perfectly fine to take pride in your career. It's another thing entirely to be egotistical and believe your career choice (or performance, as it was for me) gives you more right to pride than anyone else or makes you better than others.

The second group of people are the ones more easily targeted by bullies. Just my observation.

Keeping balance in your life, having good social support and being able hold onto your perspective of things are what allows us to manage a bully. As I already mentioned, there is more to it than just assessing your behavior at work. You'll be looking at yourself as a whole person and may find things that require growth and change. You'll need all these things to do it.

StarrActress · Oct 30, 2017

It happens. There are nurses and Doctors who are bullies.Some of them are racist. I've seen it happen but there isn't much you can do about it. I watch a doctor almost kill a black man because he refused to believe him. He acted like he didn't even want to talk to him. Me and my future father in law were in the bed next to them visiting and heard the whole conversation and essentially the man came in because he had been feeling ill and had sickle cell and he said he felt off and was in extreme pain and just needed someone to please look at him.

The Doctor looked at his chart and then just told him to go home and that he was fine. When the man said could someone else take a look because something was wrong and he noted a few things that were abnormal but the doctor shrugged him off as threaten to have him removed and they wouldn't give him any drugs and accused him of being a crack head. (he never at any time asked for drugs). Once the doctor left my future father in law who had a child hood friend with sickle cell who died asked him some questions and then told him to go to a different hospital because they wouldn't give him care here and the guy said it was fine the doctor said he was fine so maybe he's just being paranoid. My father in law grabbed him and told him no to go the another hospital because he would die if he didnt get help.

The next day he came and visited my future father in law and thanked him because he almost died. I was 17 when this happened and I'll never forget it. Its kinda why I decided to become a nurse. I saw a lot of my friends who were black be discriminated against the **** was scary.