So how's the job market NOW? - page 4

Just wondering if things are loosening up yet in Oregon as far as jobs. Feel free to post about your area, but I'm most interested in the central and southern parts of the state (Willamette Valley &... Read More

  1. Visit  pnlu007 profile page
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    Quote from PMFB-RN

    *** You are right that hospitals don't expect new grads to be competent entry level bedside nurses ANYMORE. Not very long ago most any nursing school grad could function on a normal med-surg floor with just a couple weeks of orientation. Now hospitals are faced with teaching new grads to be nurses and teaching very basic nursing tasks that should be learned in nursing school.
    When creating our nurse residency we did not include classes on very basic nursing tasks like blood drawing, starting IVs, managing a heparin nomogram, blood administration, etc. We learned we had to include these classes, at first just with the BSN grads and later with all of them.
    Think about how expensive it is to staff an instructor and, say 5 or 6 GNs down on same day surgery (to learn IVs) for a couple shifts, plus half day of lab prior to, so they can learn what they should have known coming out of nursing school. Ditto for things like time managment. What they should be learning is how OUR hospital works and critical thinking skills. Hard to concentrate on the big picture when you have to learn very basic nursing tasks. We regularly get new grad nurses who have never even attempted and IV or NG or blood draw.
    I heard our administration complain about this all the time. We have even stopped hiring graduates from certain programs, in particular direct entry MSN programs. Their grads are just too expensive to train.
    Pmfb-I think taz and I are trying to address that point...I have no idea what a nursing education used to be like or is now since i havent gone theu it yet..seeing as how almost 45 percent of all nurses are associate degreed then I suppose ur right basic clinical skills may have been stronger in past...my understanding are those rudimentary skills can be learned with practice. I have two sisters who have been nurses for a while...and they say many nurses do not know much beyond give this drug for this condition and don't know how or why it works, thus not necessarily understands interactions and such...I know this is a blanket statement...I can draw an analogy to my previous career. I was a public accountant...and i audited financial statements and understood various risks associated with a company's business process for accurate reporting...yet I didn't know how to book a journal entry that an accounts payable person can do...I can be taught their job, but they could not be taught mine necessarily...and I think that's the difference; someone with more clinical experience that an assoc degree might have can hit the ground running faster... But the ceiling to there overall development is also lower...there have been studies performed that showed hospitals with more number of BS nurses had less deaths and errors in medication administration... The cost of which adds up to like $800 million a year in Costs...I'll try to find the article and post...I know Getting a big picture education is way more important than basic skills that can be learned during the first year on the job.
  2. Visit  taz5869, RNC-OB profile page
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    Quote from pnlu007
    Pmfb-I think taz and I are trying to address that point...I have no idea what a nursing education used to be like or is now since i havent gone theu it yet..seeing as how almost 45 percent of all nurses are associate degreed then I suppose ur right basic clinical skills may have been stronger in past...my understanding are those rudimentary skills can be learned with practice..
    I agree. The only reason I can imagine why all of the new grads have fewer clinical skills/experience than in the past is because there must be some supporting evidence that indicates that this current method of teaching creates safer practices and reduces overall liability. I know that new grads are expensive to train, but it's not like we were twiddling our thumbs in nursing school and weren't learning anything. It was no piece of cake - we were swamped with work. There must be some reason why nursing education has changed - goodness knows it's not to reduce school costs because my tuition was very expensive.
  3. Visit  taz5869, RNC-OB profile page
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    Here is an interesting thread re: new grads today vs. years ago.

    http://allnurses.com/first-year-afte...ay-527890.html
  4. Visit  pnlu007 profile page
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    Quote from taz5869
    Here is an interesting thread re: new grads today vs. years ago.

    http://allnurses.com/first-year-afte...ay-527890.html
    Thanks for the thread taz...hahah not sure if I feel any better. I think that is why some hospitals have those residency programs now. Sounds like we have to cross our fingers for a cool team o work with and don't be an a$$ so they will b there to help...what seems to be apparent that even tho nurses no of the learning curve they can still b difficult..
  5. Visit  Spotty44 profile page
    1
    From what I've experienced, the market is still pretty bad. I graduated in August of 2010 and it took me about 5 months to find a job. I finally found one in a SNF (not ideal, but it was a job). After 10 months of sticking it out in a SNF, I started applying elsewhere. I found it very difficult to get in with a major hospital system, even though I had close to 10 years of healthcare experience, plus a B.S. in a different field and currently working on an RN to BSN program. After some diligent searching though, I was able to find my dream job in outpatient orthopedics. I've been in my current position for almost 3 months now, and I LOVE it!
    Cassalyn likes this.
  6. Visit  Winterblue09 profile page
    0
    Hey guys-
    if you've been accepted to another program next to Linfield I would HIGHLY recommend going to any other place but linfield. Community college get more clinical hours than linfield, OHSU get's more clinical hours than Linfield. Here's an example, OHSU senior immersion (aka senior practicum) is 6 MONTHS long people vs linfields 144 hours....they are working full shift/full time for 6 mONTHS! I couldn't believe it when I heard this. I mean that's an entire orientation and then they get 6 more months of an actual orientation once hired or maybe even less. Granted you will spend up to 1 year more in OHSU's program as it is a 3year program vs linfields 2 or accelerated 18months. But even then is it not better to graduate knowing what you're doing than to not know how to insert a catheter or better yet work a suction? Plus Most hospitals want you to have a minimum of 6 months of experience, well there you have it at the time of graduation...the hours listed above for linfields' clinicals has NOT changed. I graduated from there within the last 2 years and it's still the same. Plus the comment that someone posted about linfield being a hot mess is not a lie. There is legal actions (not their first) against them for treating a student poorly, the dean of nursing was terminated for the mess this made of the school AND she plagiarize in a piece she wrote for the schools' new paper only to be caught by one of the student. You really don't get much support from the faculty and you should probably go into the program having no opinions or prior knowledge because if you go into the program with knowledge of nursing or a brain to think for yourself faculty start to give you the evil eye because you question them when they are teaching wrong information. Here's a good example we had a PHD prepared well this instructor was in the process of a pHD progam and was teaching med-surg nephrology, had NO idea what they were saying. A student pretty much had to step in to clarify and basically teach the class the nephrology section of med surg. That's my 2 cents...If I knew then what I know today I could have saved myself a lot of money! All I can say is choose wisely. If you end up in their program you should find a way to get more clinical time in....maybe work on the side as a CNA2 or a tech on the floor or better yet a HUC (these guys see it all).
  7. Visit  taz5869, RNC-OB profile page
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    Quote from Winterblue09
    vs linfields 144 hours
    Linfield has changed their curriculum and increased their clinical hours. I graduated in December 2011 and all of the students starting Fall 2011 and afterwards are using the new curriculum and increased clinical hours, though I don't know what they are.
    But even then is it not better to graduate knowing what you're doing than to not know how to insert a catheter or better yet work a suction?
    We all learned how to insert catheters in the lab, though whether we got experience on the job really depended on your clinical placements and what opportunities you had. But, I expect that's the same for all schools. I actually talked with a MedSurg manager recently and she didn't seem to think it was an issue, anyway, because foleys are a lot more rare these days since medicare won't pay for hospital acquired UTI's anymore and it's an easy skill to practice on the job.
    Plus Most hospitals want you to have a minimum of 6 months of experience, well there you have it at the time of graduation
    Unfortunately, in the current market, most hospitals are requiring a minimum of a year's work as an RN... student clinicals do not count because you are not a RN while you are a student. A few jobs at Kaiser only require 9 months experience. Jobs for all new grads are rare and are equally hard to find, because all new grads lack any experience as an RN.
    You really don't get much support from the faculty and you should probably go into the program having no opinions or prior knowledge because if you go into the program with knowledge of nursing or a brain to think for yourself faculty start to give you the evil eye because you question them when they are teaching wrong information.
    Linfield is far from perfect, but this was not my experience at all. My core instructors who taught the most important classes were excellent. Others were hit and miss. Clinical instructors are hit and miss, too, but for the most part I had really good instructors. I actually felt like we had a lot more student support through Linfield than I would have received at OHSU. Ken offers student academic support and helps all of the students get through the first couple of semesters with tips/tricks for the monster papers, APA, med calcs, etc. I thought that kind of support is pretty unique to Linfield and he was fabulous.

    Here's a good example we had a PHD prepared well this instructor was in the process of a pHD progam and was teaching med-surg nephrology, had NO idea what they were saying. A student pretty much had to step in to clarify and basically teach the class the nephrology section of med surg.
    Interesting. You obviously have had a different instructor than I had... I'm sorry that you had such a bad experience... my med surg instructor was absolutely fabulous.

    If I knew then what I know today I could have saved myself a lot of money!
    There's no doubt it is an expensive program, although all students do receive transfer scholarships (or did as of a year and a half ago)... so it's really not as expensive as it looks. I do think that they have not put the nursing students' tuition money towards the equipment and found that very frustrating. The labs definitely did not have the equipment that they should have had when you consider the amount of $$$ we paid in tuition. I think that our tuition funds primarily went to the MAC campus and don't think that we got what we paid for... but I don't know any student who pays that kind of money for their education and really feels like it was utilized the best way possible.

    All I can say is choose wisely. If you end up in their program you should find a way to get more clinical time in....maybe work on the side as a CNA2 or a tech on the floor or better yet a HUC (these guys see it all).
    I agree that it is best if you can work as a CNA2 or something while you are in school - specifically at the VA. In this market, jobs are very very difficult to find. The students who worked at the VA all got jobs. Several others got hired for the Salem residency... but the majority of us have either had to leave the state or are still looking for work.

    I have frustrations with the program, too, and was incredibly frustrated that I didn't get more clinical experience, but apparently it is still perceived as a good program within the medical community. I have been told by multiple physicians that Linfield has a good reputation. It is my hope that the new curriculum is solving some of these issues.
  8. Visit  taz5869, RNC-OB profile page
    1
    .....
    Last edit by taz5869, RNC-OB on May 5, '12 : Reason: nevermind
    WWFlorenceDo? likes this.

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