baby friendly questions

Specialties Ob/Gyn

Published

The hospital that I work at is in the process of becoming baby friendly, and I have some questions about how the baby friendly initiative is implemented in other hospitals.

I want to start by saying that I think that breastfeeding is a wonderful, healthy, mutually beneficial thing, but I wonder if the experience where I work is typical. If a patient says she intends to bottle feed, or a breastfeeding mother requests a bottle, we are supposed to try to persuade her to breastfeed. We've been given a script to follow that basically seems guilt inducing to me. We are supposed to use this script on everyone from a exclusively breastfeeding first time mother to a patient who has had her sixth baby and has supplemented every single child. I've had patient's tell me that they have asked for bottles and the previous nurse acted as though she didn't hear the question and some mothers actually crying and begging for bottles. I feel that my job is to help my patients do whatever it is that they want, not to guilt people into breastfeeding. I will go over the benefits of breastfeeding, how babies need to nurse frequently, how frequent nursing will encourage milk supply, I will tell my patients who want to supplement during the first 24 hours that it is not necessary, I will talk about baby's nutritional needs and stomach capacity . . . I will give my patients all the information I can, but I try to do it in an informative way. And this isn't good enough. If a patient is still requesting bottles, I don't feel that I should tell them no, but the next day our lactation consults are telling me (and other staff, too) that we should try harder and that we must be pushing formula. I will help my patients do whatever they want to do, but I refuse to tell them that formula is basically poison, which seems to be what the hospital wants.

I work at night and the other issue is the night time nursery. We are being asked to make our patients sign a waiver before their babies will be allowed in the nursery. The waiver lists an entire page of reasons why baby should room in and at the bottom it says something like "I would like my baby to be separated from me despite all of the benefits of rooming in. I give permission for my baby to go the nursery despite the fact that we will not receive the mutal benefits of rooming in." This form should only be given to parents once they've asked for their child to go to the nursery. I feel awful taking this waiver in to a sleep deprived woman with hormones surging through her body who has finally decided that it's okay to let us watch her baby between breastfeedings. There has to be a better way.

We have also been told that we will not be able to give out pacifiers even if parents ask for them in the near future. Pacifiers are only to be used for comfort during circumcisions and then thrown away.

For many people, they already feel guilty asking for a bottle or for the baby to go to the nursery. I don't really know what to say to parents who are literally so exhausted that they can't keep their eyes open or patients who have had the baby to breast so much that their nipples are so tender that they are crying. Since we've started going through the baby friendly process, we've had more babies dropped during the night, babies in bed with mothers--I found one baby half hanging off the bed next to it's mother's knees, and one completely covered with the blankets over its face next to its snoring mother. These situations are not typical, but we have been noticing that they are happening more and more frequently.

I don't think that formula and mandatory night nursery are the answer either, I feel that my patients are adults who should have the ability to make informed decisions. I would like to know what other nurses experiences with baby friendly are. I feel like the my hospital is taking it a bit far and that breastfeeding has become more important than anything else, it's almost become as if lactation services have more power (for lack of a better word) than anyone else, and the relationship between the LC's and the nurses has become so adversarial, to the point where they are telling our management that we are collecting the babies every night and taking them to the nursery to feed them bottles. Actually, it's easier for me if the baby is in the mother's room and she and dad are caring for the baby and feeding him or her and changing the diapers . . . the nursery isn't for my convenience, and most of my coworkers have this same opinion.

Anyway, I'm sorry this is so long, and I thank anyone who reads all my rambling and gives me some opinions and advice.

~Rhee

Specializes in L&D/Maternity nursing.
Yes, I agree completely. My coworkers and I have begged them for more staff. However, with admin pushing our management to cut costs, it doesn't look likely. I am curious. How do you supplement with donor milk when there is no milk bank in your facility or anywhere close by? I suppose private donors are an option, but it opens a hospital up to an enormous amount of liability. (That's not to say I agree that it should, just looking at it from risk management's eyes.)
We do have a milk bank. Its regional of course (greater new england milk bank) and our docs write scripts for the pts so they can access it.Of course, cost is an issue for some, so they have to determine whether thats is one they are willing to burden upon discharge.But while admitted, the cost is included in their stay, should they wish to supplement in that manner.And not for nothing, supplementation in the breastfed infant, no matter the mode, should be temporary until her supply is established, the babe gaining the appropriate weight, jaundice rectified etc.(and also equally important is keeping her breasts stimulated each time a supplemental feed is given).
Marymoomoo, I appreciate all of your information. I do know the differences between formula and breast milk. I know that breastfeeding is best, and I support all Moms who want to do it. Yes, I do keep the babies skin to skin with Mom. The main problem I have is babies who won't wake up. They will scream in their cribs, but as soon as they are put to breast, they fall asleep and refuse to wake up. I do believe a main problem is all the elective inductions and c sections.

I appreciate that you responded, and shared some of the problems you're seeing with your patients. I'm happy we're able to share information this way.

I find it helpful to think about breastfeeding as normal. After all, breastfeeding really is not best, it's just the natural food for human infants. Lactation is the culmination of the reproductive cycle; it happens whether or not we intend to breastfeed. Breastfeeding moms and babies are just mammals, doing what mammals do. ;)

You are right about birth interventions sometimes causing breastfeeding issues. Keeping mom and baby together after birth (in kangaroo care) as much as possible after birth can really help mitigate a lot of the disparities they may face. If mom is unable to kangaroo baby, dad or grandma, or someone else may be able to take her place temporarily until mom is feeling up to it.

Newborns want to be with their mothers, and the response you're describing is quite normal. When newborns are put in a crib alone, they exhibit what is known as the protest-despair response which involves crying, distress calls, release of stress hormones, and hypothermia. When placed back with mom, it's normal for a stressed newborn to go right to sleep. They know mom is their natural habitat. LMK if you'd like to see some research on this topic.

If baby isn't roused after having time to rest and bring stress hormones back down, then she can try hand expressing colostrum and spoon feeding. Sometimes babies just need a little jolt of energy, or even the reminder that there is food available to eat.

And while I agree that breastfeeding is best, I also believe there are times when a baby should also be supplemented. High weight loss, dehydration, low blood sugars, etc. These babies need a supplement. Also, I had a baby last night who wanted to nurse constantly. She would latch well, and eat for hours. Yet she was still very fussy and acting very hungry, despite all the feeding. She obviously wasn't getting enough to eat. What do you suggest in these situations? Mom cannot breastfeed her 24 hours a day. The Mom was exhausted, and ask for a supplement. After the baby took it, she went to sleep, and didn't fuss for the rest of the night. She was obviously starving.

Frequent breastfeeding alone isn't an indicator for supplementation (please see the Academy of Breastfeeding Medicine protocol I posted earlier for the details and when to/not supplement). If the baby you're describing was transferring colostrum, she wasn't starving. Was she wetting diapers? Did she have a bm? The 2nd day after birth (usually the 2nd night after birth!), newborns will often "wake up" and want to breastfeed very frequently. It's normal, so long as the baby is transferring colostrum. If the baby is nursing "all the time" and is agitated, not voiding/bming, obviously struggling...then something else is going on. In that case, the mom would ideally be shown how to hand express and supplement feeds with colostrum and both mom and baby should be evaluated by the IBCLC as soon as possible.

All I know is that they're taking away our FREE formula and pacifiers...and we're already a broke, public hospital. :/

I'm sure that is difficult for your hospital.

Unfortunately, "free" formula isn't really free. Everyone who has to buy it (including taxpayers) pays for all the freebies, coupons, swag and marketing. The difference between the cost of producing formula and the wholesale cost is incredible (that says nothing of the cost to parents who are paying for it outright).

I don't not agree with getting rid of the formula samples or coupons to new moms. The way I look at it is if a mom is determined to breastfeed she will regardless, and a coupon is not going to change that. All this does it takes away samples from those who need it.

Why does any mom need samples, especially from the hospital, their OB, their pediatrician, etc? Shouldn't physicians and hospitals market health? Why should they be the marketing vehicle for multi billion dollar companies that can more than afford to do their own marketing?

If a mother cannot afford formula, I would strongly encourage a referral to WIC (in the USA). Additionally, many food banks offer assistance in funding infant foods for families who do not qualify for WIC or SNAP (in other words, families that make too much money for government food assistance, but not enough to meet their needs). Mothers should know that they can sign up for sample programs themselves by going to the website of the formula of their choice. All of the three main manufacturers in the USA offer "clubs" for parents that include swag, samples, and regular mailings of coupons and formula checks. Preventing marketing in the hospital doesn't prevent parents from getting samples on their own. All they have to do is ask.

Specializes in L&D/Maternity nursing.

I just realized that I had a reading comprehension fail. Sorry Elvish. (I'll blame my current state and say it was placenta brain, hehe). You were saying that you did not have a milk bank close by. Ours isnt local really either...its about an hour away, so we have it shipped up. I wish that donor milk was easier accessable to all.

Its a large case to tackle, but there are many benefits, with regard to long term health of our population, to provide our patients these options & services. But all too often it comes down to the almighty dollar, which is unfortunate.

then I think that should your hospital wish to go Baby Friendly, they first need to address the staffing issues.

We are 3 (couplets):1 on nights at my facility. We have a unit secretary on, 2 LNAs and on average 8-9 RNs (one charge) with at least one RN on call ready to come in.

(if it helps, we are a 20 bed LDRP, with a special care nursery and a 3 bed triage. We average 100-110births a month).

Its a lot of work, but on nights I certainly have the time to help patients with hand expression and/or other interventions to help facilitate breastfeeding.

I am glad that you have time to help so much with breastfeeding, but it is not possible for me to spend that much time. We are 4:1 on my floor. We have techs, but they are usually helping with deliveries. They do very little for postpartum. Our patients stay in one room for labor/delivery/postpartum, everything. (Except sections of course). We are the only hospital around where they stay in one room for everything, so naturally everyone wants to have their babies at my hospital. We average about 300 births a month. We do not have lactation all night. If we are lucky, we have them till 11 pm. We are not classified as 'baby friendly' but the LCs want us to be. But I doubt it will happen because they would really have to do something about staffing. I support breastfeeding 100%, and I feel really bad when I can't help. I always suggest to moms to pump when baby won't latch. The problem is a lot of times, moms can't even pump anything, or hand express. LCs are also another problem. They don't even want Moms to pump. They are against pumping. However, our policy is baby must eat within 7 hours. So I really don't know what the LCs expect us to do when baby won't latch. But I always take Mom a pump, even though I risk getting in trouble. But I would rather do that that offer formula.

Specializes in Community, OB, Nursery.
I just realized that I had a reading comprehension fail. Sorry Elvish. (I'll blame my current state and say it was placenta brain, hehe). You were saying that you did not have a milk bank close by. Ours isnt local really either...its about an hour away, so we have it shipped up. I wish that donor milk was easier accessable to all.

Its a large case to tackle, but there are many benefits, with regard to long term health of our population, to provide our patients these options & services. But all too often it comes down to the almighty dollar, which is unfortunate.

Ah, no worries, mel. We actually do have close access to a milk bank so donor milk is not a problem for my facility, so you read well. :D I was actually asking more on behalf of others who might have the same question and have no access to a milk bank.

You are right, though. Too much is about the cash, and it is the babies who end up on the short end of the deal.

Specializes in L&D/Maternity nursing.
I am glad that you have time to help so much with breastfeeding, but it is not possible for me to spend that much time. We are 4:1 on my floor. We have techs, but they are usually helping with deliveries. They do very little for postpartum. Our patients stay in one room for labor/delivery/postpartum, everything. (Except sections of course). We are the only hospital around where they stay in one room for everything, so naturally everyone wants to have their babies at my hospital. We average about 300 births a month. We do not have lactation all night. If we are lucky, we have them till 11 pm. We are not classified as 'baby friendly' but the LCs want us to be. But I doubt it will happen because they would really have to do something about staffing. I support breastfeeding 100%, and I feel really bad when I can't help. I always suggest to moms to pump when baby won't latch. The problem is a lot of times, moms can't even pump anything, or hand express. LCs are also another problem. They don't even want Moms to pump. They are against pumping. However, our policy is baby must eat within 7 hours. So I really don't know what the LCs expect us to do when baby won't latch. But I always take Mom a pump, even though I risk getting in trouble. But I would rather do that that offer formula.

I totally understand the issue you face, which is why I said that in order to truly go baby-friendly, properly staffing the unit also needs to be addressed. My response was not to minimize yours (or other's) struggle with breastfeeding support, but rather give insight on how my unit, a BFHI one, staffs. Because when you properly do so, there will, under most circumstances, be enough time for the RN to spend the at bedside to help mom and baby with whatever nursing issues that may arise. Handing them a pump, or giving formula, is essentially just a band aid. And just by the tone of your posts, you too understand that.

We do not have access to a milk bank. I don't even know where one is located in the US, and I never even heard of them till a few months ago. It would help so much if we had LCs all night. That is when the majority of breastfeeding issues happen. That is the main thing I don't like about my job.

Specializes in L&D/Maternity nursing.

We dont staff LCs at nights either. Its the nursing staff that supports breastfeeding couplets then. But per BFHI, we all have had to be formally educated on breastfeeding and are certified counselors (not to be confused with consultants). We took an 18 CEU to be so.

I do think that all RNs who work with mom and babies should have some sort of formal education, preferably paid or subsized to them, by their facility. We are doing mom and babies a disservice when the staff caring for them are not adequately educated/able to support them themselves.

Specializes in L&D/Maternity nursing.

info on milk banks across the U.S.

https://www.hmbana.org/

We dont staff LCs at nights either. Its the nursing staff that supports breastfeeding couplets then. But per BFHI, we all have had to be formally educated on breastfeeding and are certified counselors (not to be confused with consultants). We took an 18 CEU to be so.

I do think that all RNs who work with mom and babies should have some sort of formal education, preferably paid or subsized to them, by their facility. We are doing mom and babies a disservice when the staff caring for them are not adequately educated/able to support them themselves.

I totally agree with you. I think if our hospital isn't going to staff us with LCs at night, then they should pay for us to take some classes. Some of the night nurses found a class in another city that they were going to go to. But the price was way more than they could afford, and the hospital refused to help pay for any of it. I don't have children, so of course I have never breastfed. I have also never even been around anyone who breastfed. So it is a challenge for me helping Moms. I feel very inadequate. The only training I got at all was I got to walk around with one of the LCs for half a day when I was on orientation. Thankfully she is one of the best ones, and I did learn from her, but it was not enough time for me to really be able to help Moms.

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