Problems with References

1. How does one get a job without references? I've left 2 jobs in the last 7 years because of conflicts with management (read that: 'the boss'), and am currently unemployed. While I have the experience to land some very nice critical care positions, am having a hard time with my new recruiter because the former employers won't provide references, just verification of employment!
   
   Has anyone else encountered this problem? If so, how did you get around it? There must be a way ... Please, help!

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2. 12 Comments

   Topic Closed
3. 
   Dec 7, '04

   The practice of not supplying references, only employment verifications is becoming more and more common -- and savy employers should be aware of this. In this case, where you left your previous jobs under unpleasant circumstances, it could actually work in your favor because your former employers won't have the chance to say bad things about you.
   
   Do you have any old evals that were positive? If not, can you get copies of your annual evals from your old employers? I work for a hospital that only gives job verifications and that's what we recommend that our employees do -- save copies of their evals to show perspective employers in the future.
   
   llg
4. 
   Dec 7, '04

   Thank you. Good to know!
5. 
   Dec 10, '04

   It is my understanding that an employer cant provide anything but date of employment. You can contact a co-worker/supervisor and ask if they will write you a reference and see how that goes. I am not sure but I dont think they can even say if you are eligible for re-hire.Hospital HR departments are very aware of this issue and so should a recruiter in my opionion.
   Gayle

   Quote from BrownRecluse

   How does one get a job without references? I've left 2 jobs in the last 7 years because of conflicts with management (read that: 'the boss'), and am currently unemployed. While I have the experience to land some very nice critical care positions, am having a hard time with my new recruiter because the former employers won't provide references, just verification of employment!
   
   Has anyone else encountered this problem? If so, how did you get around it? There must be a way ... Please, help!
6. 
   Dec 10, '04

   Quote from cber

   it is my understanding that an employer cant provide anything but date of employment. you can contact a co-worker/supervisor and ask if they will write you a reference and see how that goes. i am not sure but i dont think they can even say if you are eligible for re-hire.hospital hr departments are very aware of this issue and so should a recruiter in my opionion.
   gayle

   unfortunately, this isn't true. (i am a nurse recruiter, so i deal with referencing all the time.)
   
   many employers choose not to provide any information except verification of employment dates, but this is because of liability and not because of law. employers are allowed to say anything they want to, so long as it is true. in fact many employers give quite a bit of information about current and former employees.
   
   my best advice to someone with more than one potentially negative reference is to provide names of former charge nurses, house supervisors or other direct supervisors where you worked to provide positive information about you. obtaining evaluations from your hr department (they are obligated to provide you with copies from your personnel file) is also a good idea.
   
   the most important thing is to always, always, always be honest. we are more likely to overlook a negative experience if someone 'fesses up to it up front. if we find out that someone covered something up, they are down the road and we won't consider them for any position, ever.
   
   just my 2 cents worth... best of luck in your job search. try to remember that recruiters are human and have the capacity to understand that there are some nasty managers and unethical companies out there. i know that i personally try to give applicants the benefit of the doubt if at all possible.
   
   jami
7. 
   Jan 6, '05

   I have had a few problems with past employers and did not leave on good terms. I got a good reference from my previous supervisor and a good yearly evaluation that I give. also I have had a nursing license for 24 years should mean somethimg the only problem is that I did move around a lot. If I was military they wouldn't think anything about it but since I did mostly for family reasons it is frowned upon. Oh well I will get a job soon I am sure.
8. 
   Jan 8, '05

   Quote from jami rn

   i am a nurse recruiter, so i deal with referencing all the time.
   
   the most important thing is to always, always, always be honest. we are more likely to overlook a negative experience if someone 'fesses up to it up front. if we find out that someone covered something up, they are down the road and we won't consider them for any position, ever.
   
   just my 2 cents worth... best of luck in your job search. try to remember that recruiters are human and have the capacity to understand that there are some nasty managers and unethical companies out there. i know that i personally try to give applicants the benefit of the doubt if at all possible.
   
   jami

   do you mind if i pick your brain for a minute?
   
   i am job hunting, and these things always make me nervous. when the application says "can we contact this employer" and you put no, that immediataly triggers a red flag, right? what if you say you have a personality conflict with your manager? or you don't want them to know you are looking for work (because you will be leaving them in a staffing crunch)? i say i am nervous b/c i really don't know what my current nm would say about me. i am only per diem there, but things are bad all around, and nurses are dropping like flies. is better to be honest and say, i'd rather you not call her, or hold your breath and hope she says something nice (or at least impartial)? i have no basis to defend my "she doesn't like me" theory, i just feel like others are traeted more prefentially than i am. do oyu guys appreciate that there are 'personality conflicts' out there, and if an interview goes well (and other references turn out okay) do you just choke it up to a personality conflict?
9. 
   Jan 8, '05

   garamond

   Quote from bonemarrowrn

   do you mind if i pick your brain for a minute?
   
   i am job hunting, and these things always make me nervous. when the application says "can we contact this employer" and you put no, that immediataly triggers a red flag, right? what if you say you have a personality conflict with your manager? or you don't want them to know you are looking for work (because you will be leaving them in a staffing crunch)? i say i am nervous b/c i really don't know what my current nm would say about me. i am only per diem there, but things are bad all around, and nurses are dropping like flies. is better to be honest and say, i'd rather you not call her, or hold your breath and hope she says something nice (or at least impartial)? i have no basis to defend my "she doesn't like me" theory, i just feel like others are traeted more prefentially than i am. do oyu guys appreciate that there are 'personality conflicts' out there, and if an interview goes well (and other references turn out okay) do you just choke it up to a personality conflict?

   only putting in my 2 cents, i've never experienced bias if i check-do not contact my employer -when i have applied for nursing jobs. the most recent being a few weeks ago, it is important to keep any yearly written evals of work performance as i have been informed that more info was needed than just the dates of employment. i believe there is a universal understanding among the medical profession that sometimes things just don't work out( if you know what i mean)
10. 
    Jan 8, '05

    I just interviewed for a part time job. When they asked about contacting my current employer (nursing home), I said I was unsure how they'd feel about that. The HR person at the new job asked if I could give a name and home phone of someone I worked with there. She was able to use that as a reference.
    
    At one time I was also self employed for over 10 years. I obtained a part time job at a restaurant (specifically for the purpose of gaining a reference), and was able to use that as another reference. I explained to that employer that I was seeking a full time position, but still wanted to work for them part time.
    
    I used a friend who is a nurse as a reference for nursing school.
    
    Good luck!
11. 
    Jan 8, '05

    [font=Comic Sans MS]I think that it is understandable to check "not contact current employer." Reason being that it is up to the employee to tell their current employer that they plan to get another job, not anyone else's. [font=Comic Sans MS] It may be a good idea though to get a different reference from you job, as another poster suggested. Someone you can rely on not to spread around your looking elsewhere. Just be honest with your recruiter or the person interviewing you. Tell them that you would like to obtain a new position (your reasons are your own), and once you have and give a suitable amount of notice, your then current employee may be willing to give you a reference.
    [font=Comic Sans MS]
    [font=Comic Sans MS]Good luck on your job pursuit!
    [font=Comic Sans MS]
    [font=Comic Sans MS]Kris
12. 
    Jan 8, '05

    and speaking of job references, if you are a new grad, and therefore have not ever had a nursing job (well, except for a nursing externship) and heck, i haven't had a job in more than a year- would a potential employer call jobs that far back and jobs sooo non related to nursing? i just can't imagine my old jobs would even remember me or that my bosses from then would even be still working there.
    i put all of my jobs on my app, so i didn't hide anything, im just curious as to if non nursing jobs in the distant past really get called. but as said, i had an externship at this hospital i applied to, so they do have some clinical references to go on.
    
    just curious
13. 
    Jan 8, '05

    I had a problem with my previous unit director.
    
    However, virtually everyone that actually supervised me(night shift nurse, so most of my contact was with the night ADONs), or worked with me was very impressed with my work and behavior. I listed them as references.
    
    PS said UD lost 5 out of 7 of her long time night shift nurses. She has yet to be able to staff the unit properly on nights, since (over 3 years).
14. 
    Jan 8, '05

    Quote from Jami RN

    Unfortunately, this isn't true. (I am a Nurse Recruiter, so I deal with referencing all the time.)
    
    Many employers choose not to provide any information except verification of employment dates, but this is because of liability and not because of law. Employers are allowed to say anything they want to, so long as it is true. In fact many employers give quite a bit of information about current and former employees.
    
    Jami

    In the state of Virginia (im not sure how it is elsewhere) it is against the law to prohibit a person from obtaining a position simply because of something that YOU said while in the refrencing process (i.e an employer calls an exemployer and gives a bad refrence which detures the new employer from hiring).
    
    When I graduated nursing school (two weeks ago) - we had the career services women come in and speak with us and she specifically said that it was against the law for that to happen - and that if it did occur, that you could sue. However, I have no idea how you would get it out of a potential employer that they didn't hire you because someone said you were a terrible employee, lol.
    
    Im not sure if I read your message right, maybe you were speaking under different circumstances - but this is what I have been told.
    
    Melissa

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